@Quarterman said:
Let’s hope for a decent end to the season and Gareth and Dobbo can work their magic on the squad again so we can start next year in a weaker division confident in what we could achieve.
Why do you think it will be a weaker division? We will probably have a much stronger Derby and Peterborough under new management are unlikely to be a pushover. Sunderland and Ipswich will eventually get their acts together.
@ReturnToSenda said:
I'm beginning to wonder if they'll be here beyond this season
I think it’d be pretty ridiculous if they were gone by then. They’d have to feel really hard done by and it’d leave a big stain on RC’s standing within the club.
But as I’ve said before - I think RC, though brilliant at times, is bordering on delusional when he assesses where we ought to be as a club, so maybe that would cause him to pull the trigger.
Desperately hope it doesn’t come to that, a view 90%+ of the fanbase probably share.
Power celebrated in Stockdale’s face for the goal and there was a coming together, more like shoulder/chest. Nothing of it, no ban likely, although I’d actually like to have a look at Tyla Dickinson as I just have a funny feeling he’s going to be a real find.
@thecatwwfc said:
I just don't want to be another Burton Albion
Really? They seem like a reasonable template for us. They managed two quick fire promotions and have now settled as a mid-table League One side, still in my view punching above their weight.
Prior to the 18/19 season we hadn't finished above the League One relegation zone for sixteen years. Settling again as a mid-table third tier side, for only the second spell in our history, would seem like a reasonable outcome to the last couple of years.
All pretty grim to watch in truth. We completely folded once the equaliser went in and at that point the loss was inevitable. We look a team completely lacking in confidence and ideas, and a team rapidly slipping down the table. I can't see us finishing in the top 6.
I thought Wigan were very very good, and it was always going to be a tall task. It's concerning we seem to be falling away in the second half at home, but I am not surprised at the result.
The strangest thing about this season is comparing the amazing talent we have now to departed players who were "not good enough" - and to be fair, are less talented than the current iteration - but managed to get us promoted. Gape, Blooms, Bayo, Samuel, Freeman and Kashket have either left or barely played, and yet that team managed the unthinkable.
It's probably a little harsh - after all, we are not so far away on points, and that season's third tier was probably more forgiving than the current division, but it's a strange feeling to see a genuinely more talented team falling away, and I can't really make head or tail of it, except to wonder if the larger squad and loss of so many leaders impacts team chemistry more than we know?
Either way, I am Ainsworth in all day long. We are on course for our fourth best finish in history, three of which will have come under him. I would never want him to leave.
@ReturnToSenda said:
I'm beginning to wonder if they'll be here beyond this season
I think it’d be pretty ridiculous if they were gone by then. They’d have to feel really hard done by and it’d leave a big stain on RC’s standing within the club.
But as I’ve said before - I think RC, though brilliant at times, is bordering on delusional when he assesses where we ought to be as a club, so maybe that would cause him to pull the trigger.
Desperately hope it doesn’t come to that, a view 90%+ of the fanbase probably share.
@thecatwwfc said:
I just don't want to be another Burton Albion
Really? They seem like a reasonable template for us. They managed two quick fire promotions and have now settled as a mid-table League One side, still in my view punching above their weight.
Prior to the 18/19 season we hadn't finished above the League One relegation zone for sixteen years. Settling again as a mid-table third tier side, for only the second spell in our history, would seem like a reasonable outcome to the last couple of years.
Yeovil are the template I worry about more.
Tbf, it was all falling apart behind the scenes at Yeovil whole they were still in the Champ.
@ReturnToSenda said:
I'm beginning to wonder if they'll be here beyond this season
I think it’d be pretty ridiculous if they were gone by then. They’d have to feel really hard done by and it’d leave a big stain on RC’s standing within the club.
But as I’ve said before - I think RC, though brilliant at times, is bordering on delusional when he assesses where we ought to be as a club, so maybe that would cause him to pull the trigger.
Desperately hope it doesn’t come to that, a view 90%+ of the fanbase probably share.
I get that Gareth's philosophy is to play in the final third but we need to find a way to enhance and vary our transitions from defence to attack as we have become pretty one dimensional and predictable, especially once the energy levels start to drop from playing the high press.
That probably means we need to find wing backs/wide midfielders who are quick, can hold the ball and put in decent crosses, a second striker who has more consistent and better close control than Hanlan is currently showing (it might be him if he can improve this aspect of his game), at least one midfielder who is able to play a decent forward pass regularly and at least two centre backs who are solid defensively but also comfortable with the ball at their feet.
Perhaps it is getting to the point of giving Pendlebury, Young, Wing, Przybek/Dickinson, Mehmeti & Forino more opportunities than mostly warming the bench; after all they will only get better by playing.
I know he’s not set the world alight at Crewe but I still think Kashket would’ve been a really useful squad member with his pace and finishing. Still baffled he left to be honest.
Hopefully we’ll have learnt from this season and we can evolve our style in the next year or two as we’ve got too many good players now to keep launching it over their heads. But, regardless of that, anyone seriously questioning Ainsworth as manager is crazy. I think the next 18 months is going to be key to whether we can ever get back up, but mainly I’d like to see a more positive and passing approach evolve over the next year or two, and really solidify our space as always challenging for the play offs at least.
Tough game to pick apart and analyse. For me there were clear positives. Wheeler put in a great shift. First half the front 2 of Vokes and Hanlan held it up and caused numerous problems; Kaikai buzzing about behind them worked nicely as well. Stewart and Scowen back was a breath of fresh air.
However, for me 3 reasons we lost that and fell apart.
Individual error Stockdale, awful attempt at parrying that free kick which travelled from so far out - straight back into the danger area. At 1-0 up and when you are conceding goals at will, that was just a really poor effort.
Weakness at centre half - unfortunately our refusal to strengthen both in August and January has come back to bite us. Tafazoli made of glass seemingly and the rot sets in from there. Stewart treated bizarrely, and Forino asked to do too much. He's a great prospect but no way he should be starting this many games against strong League One opposition. Lavelle should have been signed at the start of the season and we again refused to resolve the problem in January. Sure we didn't want to pay what we considered to be over the odds for players, but other teams strengthen, we stuck while others twisted and it's cost us dear.
Third and probably the biggest reason - Ainsworth's tactics and in game management. It must be said he has done an incredible job for us and is a terrific man manager. But nights like tonight are infuriating when we sit back on a one goal lead at home, from half time, when it is clearly the wrong approach. It meant we created absolutely no opportunities and handed the momentum to attack us at will. You could see the second and third goals coming a mile off. Wing and Kaikai should both have been off at 1-0 or at worst 1-1 as they were knackered but instead they are withdrawn at 1-3 when the game is lost. Hanlan subbed first when he was causing the most problems for us. It seems Mehmeti can only get minutes in the B&B - again I don't get it. For me, some utterly odd decisions from our management team lately that I cannot get my head around, and more tonight.
Whilst we could and probably should have been in a better place after the last 4 games we are bizarrely still not out of it, especially given Sunderland's dismal run of form & the patchy form of Wednesday, Ipswich, Bolton & Pompey.
@drcongo said:
I think we now have an answer to the question “why hasn’t Stewart been starting”. He was the second best centre back by a huge distance today. Didn’t look interested at all.
@DJWYC14 Agree with most of that, apart from "Stewart treated bizarrely, and Forino asked to do too much". Stewart was abysmal tonight, and Forino was again excellent. Doubly so considering he was carrying Stewart for the entire game.
Perhaps we are forgetting something.
We have been over achieving for a long time.
In reality, this is probably where we are at and we are still by no means out of the running for a playoff place at all!
When we came up from League 2, if someone said you would be promoted in your first season, related from the championship and be playoff contenders in the following season...we all would have laughed.
The worrying thing for me is, bar Plymouth away...we don't actually look like that good a side. I often wonder how we come away from games with points and i put it down to one thing. We were organised and tough to beat....which we are not at the moment. Back to basics now. We were a real shit team to come up against. I think we are almost trying to change our identity too quickly. It's not what we are about, yet.
Let's get behind the team. It's not over. This is Wycombe Wanderers ffs!!!!!
13 games to go , so there is still hope. Mid 70 points should be enough to get us into the playoffs. So can we get 20 or so points our of 39. Not on current form.
@drcongo said: @DJWYC14 Agree with most of that, apart from "Stewart treated bizarrely, and Forino asked to do too much". Stewart was abysmal tonight, and Forino was again excellent. Doubly so considering he was carrying Stewart for the entire game.
Comments
Why do you think it will be a weaker division? We will probably have a much stronger Derby and Peterborough under new management are unlikely to be a pushover. Sunderland and Ipswich will eventually get their acts together.
I think it’d be pretty ridiculous if they were gone by then. They’d have to feel really hard done by and it’d leave a big stain on RC’s standing within the club.
But as I’ve said before - I think RC, though brilliant at times, is bordering on delusional when he assesses where we ought to be as a club, so maybe that would cause him to pull the trigger.
Desperately hope it doesn’t come to that, a view 90%+ of the fanbase probably share.
Power celebrated in Stockdale’s face for the goal and there was a coming together, more like shoulder/chest. Nothing of it, no ban likely, although I’d actually like to have a look at Tyla Dickinson as I just have a funny feeling he’s going to be a real find.
Really? They seem like a reasonable template for us. They managed two quick fire promotions and have now settled as a mid-table League One side, still in my view punching above their weight.
Prior to the 18/19 season we hadn't finished above the League One relegation zone for sixteen years. Settling again as a mid-table third tier side, for only the second spell in our history, would seem like a reasonable outcome to the last couple of years.
Yeovil are the template I worry about more.
All pretty grim to watch in truth. We completely folded once the equaliser went in and at that point the loss was inevitable. We look a team completely lacking in confidence and ideas, and a team rapidly slipping down the table. I can't see us finishing in the top 6.
yup, this, basically (at least from the WWTV angle).
I thought Wigan were very very good, and it was always going to be a tall task. It's concerning we seem to be falling away in the second half at home, but I am not surprised at the result.
The strangest thing about this season is comparing the amazing talent we have now to departed players who were "not good enough" - and to be fair, are less talented than the current iteration - but managed to get us promoted. Gape, Blooms, Bayo, Samuel, Freeman and Kashket have either left or barely played, and yet that team managed the unthinkable.
It's probably a little harsh - after all, we are not so far away on points, and that season's third tier was probably more forgiving than the current division, but it's a strange feeling to see a genuinely more talented team falling away, and I can't really make head or tail of it, except to wonder if the larger squad and loss of so many leaders impacts team chemistry more than we know?
Either way, I am Ainsworth in all day long. We are on course for our fourth best finish in history, three of which will have come under him. I would never want him to leave.
I was thinking of their own volition
Tbf, it was all falling apart behind the scenes at Yeovil whole they were still in the Champ.
A long way to go yet - a win could change everything
Not that long to go
Its about time he let someone else have a go! It might be the change that could refresh the team out of this slump.
And before anyone moans 'You've never liked Stocko' etc etc, I thought he was the person who turned our form and fortune around
Oh haha. Then yes, maybe
I get that Gareth's philosophy is to play in the final third but we need to find a way to enhance and vary our transitions from defence to attack as we have become pretty one dimensional and predictable, especially once the energy levels start to drop from playing the high press.
That probably means we need to find wing backs/wide midfielders who are quick, can hold the ball and put in decent crosses, a second striker who has more consistent and better close control than Hanlan is currently showing (it might be him if he can improve this aspect of his game), at least one midfielder who is able to play a decent forward pass regularly and at least two centre backs who are solid defensively but also comfortable with the ball at their feet.
Perhaps it is getting to the point of giving Pendlebury, Young, Wing, Przybek/Dickinson, Mehmeti & Forino more opportunities than mostly warming the bench; after all they will only get better by playing.
I know he’s not set the world alight at Crewe but I still think Kashket would’ve been a really useful squad member with his pace and finishing. Still baffled he left to be honest.
Hopefully we’ll have learnt from this season and we can evolve our style in the next year or two as we’ve got too many good players now to keep launching it over their heads. But, regardless of that, anyone seriously questioning Ainsworth as manager is crazy. I think the next 18 months is going to be key to whether we can ever get back up, but mainly I’d like to see a more positive and passing approach evolve over the next year or two, and really solidify our space as always challenging for the play offs at least.
Tough game to pick apart and analyse. For me there were clear positives. Wheeler put in a great shift. First half the front 2 of Vokes and Hanlan held it up and caused numerous problems; Kaikai buzzing about behind them worked nicely as well. Stewart and Scowen back was a breath of fresh air.
However, for me 3 reasons we lost that and fell apart.
Individual error Stockdale, awful attempt at parrying that free kick which travelled from so far out - straight back into the danger area. At 1-0 up and when you are conceding goals at will, that was just a really poor effort.
Weakness at centre half - unfortunately our refusal to strengthen both in August and January has come back to bite us. Tafazoli made of glass seemingly and the rot sets in from there. Stewart treated bizarrely, and Forino asked to do too much. He's a great prospect but no way he should be starting this many games against strong League One opposition. Lavelle should have been signed at the start of the season and we again refused to resolve the problem in January. Sure we didn't want to pay what we considered to be over the odds for players, but other teams strengthen, we stuck while others twisted and it's cost us dear.
Third and probably the biggest reason - Ainsworth's tactics and in game management. It must be said he has done an incredible job for us and is a terrific man manager. But nights like tonight are infuriating when we sit back on a one goal lead at home, from half time, when it is clearly the wrong approach. It meant we created absolutely no opportunities and handed the momentum to attack us at will. You could see the second and third goals coming a mile off. Wing and Kaikai should both have been off at 1-0 or at worst 1-1 as they were knackered but instead they are withdrawn at 1-3 when the game is lost. Hanlan subbed first when he was causing the most problems for us. It seems Mehmeti can only get minutes in the B&B - again I don't get it. For me, some utterly odd decisions from our management team lately that I cannot get my head around, and more tonight.
That was actually the first time this season that we've lost after leading at HT - I thought there'd been another one.
On the flip side, this is only the second time we've ever conceded 8+ goals across two EFL home games
Whilst we could and probably should have been in a better place after the last 4 games we are bizarrely still not out of it, especially given Sunderland's dismal run of form & the patchy form of Wednesday, Ipswich, Bolton & Pompey.
The table could be a lot worse....
Bullshit
Saturday?
Oops felt like a loss!
If promotion is really our ambition, don't we need to be doing better than 'okay'?
Every 1-2 games for the last few months, Stockdale concedes a goal that isn’t a howler but you feel he could have done a bit better with it.
Very inconsistent season so far.
@DJWYC14 Agree with most of that, apart from "Stewart treated bizarrely, and Forino asked to do too much". Stewart was abysmal tonight, and Forino was again excellent. Doubly so considering he was carrying Stewart for the entire game.
Perhaps we are forgetting something.
We have been over achieving for a long time.
In reality, this is probably where we are at and we are still by no means out of the running for a playoff place at all!
When we came up from League 2, if someone said you would be promoted in your first season, related from the championship and be playoff contenders in the following season...we all would have laughed.
The worrying thing for me is, bar Plymouth away...we don't actually look like that good a side. I often wonder how we come away from games with points and i put it down to one thing. We were organised and tough to beat....which we are not at the moment. Back to basics now. We were a real shit team to come up against. I think we are almost trying to change our identity too quickly. It's not what we are about, yet.
Let's get behind the team. It's not over. This is Wycombe Wanderers ffs!!!!!
13 games to go , so there is still hope. Mid 70 points should be enough to get us into the playoffs. So can we get 20 or so points our of 39. Not on current form.
I wonder if Gareth may be thinking he has taken Wycombe as far as he can?
Exactly this. Dreary Dury and then some other non descript stuff
Fully agree, Forino was easily the best defender.