We were totally outclassed at Wigan early on...but grabbed a point. For me every game (however 'disastrous' or 'shocking') being part of a promotion push rather than a relegation battle is progress.
@MorrisItal_ said:
Better first half overwhelmed in the second mistakes forced by allowing Wigan to come at us. Only comic relief was Stocko accidentally decking a Wigan player after they scored.
On to Saturday
Having just watched the highlights, there seemed nothing accidental about it. I can't think what was going on there.
Looks very much like a punch - not much of one but a punch nonetheless. But if the ref dealt with it at the time, can Stocko be retrospectively punished?
I don't think he did any more than arrive in the aftermath and sooth tempers. What was Stocko thinking? I get the anger with his own defence but goodness...
@coopaman said:
Same old high balls, heading tennis, every throw in down the line, not playing the ball on the ground,bring on the likes of Mehmeti who will run at opponents play passing football
as Wigan did against us.Wigan played excellent football the way football should be played,we were totally outclassed !!!
Had to check the stats, but the ref did actually book one of their players.
It felt the classic ref has forgotten his cards job. While not any sort of dirty game there could/should have been the usual sprinkling of bookings. Not least the Stockdale scuffle and then scowen being utterly brutalised late on, with an aerial challenge about 30secs too late.
Dibs to the Frank Adams stand guy who entertained us in the last few mins shouting at the ref. Best one being "he's unconscious, but that's fine".
Our favourite drummer suddenly popped up in the stand in the second half. Creativity using the stand to drum on.
Then disappeared about 20mins later.
It was one of those sort of games, I normally don't pay attention to people in the stand!
One has to wonder, sometimes, what happens at half time as in too many games this season we look a different side in the second half especially for the first 15 minutes or so, Maybe we should give them lemons to suck on rather than a nice cup of cocoa
@LX1 Generally a definite yes, but I do enjoy the broadcasting skills of Colin Murray and so on this occasion his advertised ‘deep dive’ into the goings on in Eastern Europe won my vote and the late night chat with KT kept me hooked.
@LeedsBlue said: @LX1 Generally a definite yes, but I do enjoy the broadcasting skills of Colin Murray and so on this occasion his advertised ‘deep dive’ into the goings on in Eastern Europe won my vote and the late night chat with KT kept me hooked.
I'm fine, and I don't feel anything other than a certain 'off-ness' about the place - and I know I'm far from alone. Just a feeling, could be wrong ?
Could it be down to players realising that their chances of playing (and being paid appropriately to play) Championship football next season are slipping away?
When did it start? What are the foundations of it? What incidents are contributing to it? Was there any sign of it bubbling under during the win against Oxford just over 5 weeks ago? Someone not applauding the fans passionately enough? Or smiling?
For me, it just feels like we’re on our usual post-Xmas run of poor results.
Some people confidently predicted that we would struggle to survive in this division full of strong teams before a ball was kicked...now with 12 or 13 games to go its terrible that we are just out of the play-offs. It may well end with disappointment as most seasons do for most teams...but its not over yet and we have seen some great performances this term. So despite our poor young or too old players hating each other, our tactically inept manager and the Chairman who is either over-ambitious or has no ambition, I will still have high hopes until the end is nigh.
@arnos_grove said:
I’d love this ‘off-ness’ to be defined.
When did it start? What are the foundations of it? What incidents are contributing to it? Was there any sign of it bubbling under during the win against Oxford just over 5 weeks ago? Someone not applauding the fans passionately enough? Or smiling?
For me, it just feels like we’re on our usual post-Xmas run of poor results.
It's exactly the last sentence, just later than usual.
@coopaman said:
Same old high balls, heading tennis, every throw in down the line, not playing the ball on the ground,bring on the likes of Mehmeti who will run at opponents play passing football
as Wigan did against us.Wigan played excellent football the way football should be played,we were totally outclassed !!!
Is that what you were saying at half time?
That is what I have been saying the whole season !!
@coopaman said:
Same old high balls, heading tennis, every throw in down the line, not playing the ball on the ground,bring on the likes of Mehmeti who will run at opponents play passing football
as Wigan did against us.Wigan played excellent football the way football should be played,we were totally outclassed !!!
Is that what you were saying at half time?
That is what I have been saying the whole season !!
Well, what a miracle it is to have collected 55 points whilst playing so poorly. I wonder why all those vastly superior teams let us beat them? We should stand aside and let teams who play football ‘the way it should be played’ take their rightful place above us.
Without wishing to gloss over a (pretty short) run of poor results, are some people really that upset at where we find ourselves right now? We shouldn't 'know our place' or play the 'little Wycombe' card particularly anymore but just a look at the table as it stands you have to go down to the likes of Cambridge in 12th and Burton in 13th to see other clubs of our relative size. And you'd have to look past the likes of Portsmouth, Ipswich, Bolton and Sheffield Wednesday to get there. This league is dominated by clubs with far bigger fanbases and financial resources than we have, even with recent Championship windfalls.
We're on a bad run, it happens, but we've endured far, far worse even in quite recent seasons and come back stronger.
Last night we made mistakes and lost to an exceptional team who were more than capable of punishing us for those mistakes. Please don't let's go down the Sunderland/Pompey/Oxford fans forum routes of somehow feeling entitled to better things and imagining looming disaster when they don't consistently arrive with a pretty ribbon attached.
There is greater expectation now; that's not entitlement. But I think maybe RC shouldn't have been quite so publicly vocal about an immediate return to the Championship (I never expected it, but his words might have instilled that kind of expectation in some fans).
@Malone said:
And was it just me (and someone else who mentioned it earlier) that thought Wheeler was right wing back rather than it being a back 4?
That was me! To me it looked like Wheeler and Obita were playing as classic wing backs last night, but I bow to the greater tactical knowledge of others if that's not correct.
@ReturnToSenda said:
There is greater expectation now; that's not entitlement. But I think maybe RC shouldn't have been quite so publicly vocal about an immediate return to the Championship (I never expected it, but his words might have instilled that kind of expectation in some fans).
Not entitlement from you, no, easily one of the most thoughtful contributors to the Gasroom, but there's a few new names on here who have only popped up since we went on this poor run. I know it's in the nature of football fans to be most vocal when things go wrong but maybe I'm just old enough to remember some properly bad times and recognise we're still enjoying the good times right now.
We were simply outclassed for much of the game last night. I thought we played really well for the first 30 minutes and were then slowly pushed back by a more superior team. Second half was very much attack versus defence and with their quality it was inevitable that we would get overrun.
I think we have a bit of thinking to do at the end of this season, do we want to push for the Championship knowing that we have a much smaller fan base than every club in that division, or do we consolidate in this division and develop our youth/development structure and improve the facilities, whilst continuing to work the self sufficiency model.
I think Rob and Pete must realise that Wycombe Wanderers will never be a Luton or a Coventry who have both established themselves at Championship level.
Also, for us the supporters I am not saying we shouldn’t be ambitious but expectation as definitely played games with my outlook this season.
@ReturnToSenda said:
There is greater expectation now; that's not entitlement. But I think maybe RC shouldn't have been quite so publicly vocal about an immediate return to the Championship (I never expected it, but his words might have instilled that kind of expectation in some fans).
Not entitlement from you, no, easily one of the most thoughtful contributors to the Gasroom, but there's a few new names on here who have only popped up since we went on this poor run. I know it's in the nature of football fans to be most vocal when things go wrong but maybe I'm just old enough to remember some properly bad times and recognise we're still enjoying the good times right now.
I think Rob and Pete must realise that Wycombe Wanderers will never be a Luton or a Coventry who have both established themselves at Championship level.
Strongly disagree here - we absolutely can, and I think we will, but it was never likely to be that quick.
It is heightened expectation after our success over the last two seasons. Very difficult to balance things right now but for me I simply go back to that dreadful day at Torquay when our club could easily have disappeared for ever.
I'd go back even more recently than that - the start to the 2016-17 season was very poor and after defeat at home to Barnet at the end of October in front of some 3,500 fans, we were 21st in league 2. Coming so soon after the play-off season many felt we were going backwards and that Gareth had taken us as far as he could. Soon after that game we went on a ridiculous winning streak led by the Kashket/Bayo/Paris combo. We finished 9th that season (might have been higher had we not hit that terrible post-White Hart Lane run) but since then it's been almost all upwards.
I think Rob and Pete must realise that Wycombe Wanderers will never be a Luton or a Coventry who have both established themselves at Championship level.
Strongly disagree here - we absolutely can, and I think we will, but it was never likely to be that quick.
Could you explain to me why you see the aim of being a sustainable Championship club as being realistic in the medium term? I hope you are right but not sure I have ever really seen it as being likely. What do you think I am missing?
I think Rob and Pete must realise that Wycombe Wanderers will never be a Luton or a Coventry who have both established themselves at Championship level.
Strongly disagree here - we absolutely can, and I think we will, but it was never likely to be that quick.
Could you explain to me why you see the aim of being a sustainable Championship club as being realistic in the medium term? I hope you are right but not sure I have ever really seen it as being likely. What do you think I am missing?
Mainly because of the recruitment model imo. It takes years to develop it to, say, Brentford levels, but that's as key to sustainability as anything and I think we're already on the right track. My slight concern would be that Rob's apparent envisaged timescale might not match the realistic one. It takes patience.
That said, we could well get back to the Championship in the next couple of seasons and do a Rotherham for a few years (not sure how much fun that is, though).
Comments
We were totally outclassed at Wigan early on...but grabbed a point. For me every game (however 'disastrous' or 'shocking') being part of a promotion push rather than a relegation battle is progress.
I don't think he did any more than arrive in the aftermath and sooth tempers. What was Stocko thinking? I get the anger with his own defence but goodness...
Is that what you were saying at half time?
Had to check the stats, but the ref did actually book one of their players.
It felt the classic ref has forgotten his cards job. While not any sort of dirty game there could/should have been the usual sprinkling of bookings. Not least the Stockdale scuffle and then scowen being utterly brutalised late on, with an aerial challenge about 30secs too late.
Dibs to the Frank Adams stand guy who entertained us in the last few mins shouting at the ref. Best one being "he's unconscious, but that's fine".
Our favourite drummer suddenly popped up in the stand in the second half. Creativity using the stand to drum on.
Then disappeared about 20mins later.
It was one of those sort of games, I normally don't pay attention to people in the stand!
One has to wonder, sometimes, what happens at half time as in too many games this season we look a different side in the second half especially for the first 15 minutes or so, Maybe we should give them lemons to suck on rather than a nice cup of cocoa
@LX1 Generally a definite yes, but I do enjoy the broadcasting skills of Colin Murray and so on this occasion his advertised ‘deep dive’ into the goings on in Eastern Europe won my vote and the late night chat with KT kept me hooked.
Suddenly I see what all the fuss is about
Could it be down to players realising that their chances of playing (and being paid appropriately to play) Championship football next season are slipping away?
I’d love this ‘off-ness’ to be defined.
When did it start? What are the foundations of it? What incidents are contributing to it? Was there any sign of it bubbling under during the win against Oxford just over 5 weeks ago? Someone not applauding the fans passionately enough? Or smiling?
For me, it just feels like we’re on our usual post-Xmas run of poor results.
Some people confidently predicted that we would struggle to survive in this division full of strong teams before a ball was kicked...now with 12 or 13 games to go its terrible that we are just out of the play-offs. It may well end with disappointment as most seasons do for most teams...but its not over yet and we have seen some great performances this term. So despite our poor young or too old players hating each other, our tactically inept manager and the Chairman who is either over-ambitious or has no ambition, I will still have high hopes until the end is nigh.
It's exactly the last sentence, just later than usual.
And was it just me (and someone else who mentioned it earlier) that thought Wheeler was right wing back rather than it being a back 4?
That is what I have been saying the whole season !!
Well, what a miracle it is to have collected 55 points whilst playing so poorly. I wonder why all those vastly superior teams let us beat them? We should stand aside and let teams who play football ‘the way it should be played’ take their rightful place above us.
Without wishing to gloss over a (pretty short) run of poor results, are some people really that upset at where we find ourselves right now? We shouldn't 'know our place' or play the 'little Wycombe' card particularly anymore but just a look at the table as it stands you have to go down to the likes of Cambridge in 12th and Burton in 13th to see other clubs of our relative size. And you'd have to look past the likes of Portsmouth, Ipswich, Bolton and Sheffield Wednesday to get there. This league is dominated by clubs with far bigger fanbases and financial resources than we have, even with recent Championship windfalls.
We're on a bad run, it happens, but we've endured far, far worse even in quite recent seasons and come back stronger.
Last night we made mistakes and lost to an exceptional team who were more than capable of punishing us for those mistakes. Please don't let's go down the Sunderland/Pompey/Oxford fans forum routes of somehow feeling entitled to better things and imagining looming disaster when they don't consistently arrive with a pretty ribbon attached.
There is greater expectation now; that's not entitlement. But I think maybe RC shouldn't have been quite so publicly vocal about an immediate return to the Championship (I never expected it, but his words might have instilled that kind of expectation in some fans).
That was me! To me it looked like Wheeler and Obita were playing as classic wing backs last night, but I bow to the greater tactical knowledge of others if that's not correct.
Not entitlement from you, no, easily one of the most thoughtful contributors to the Gasroom, but there's a few new names on here who have only popped up since we went on this poor run. I know it's in the nature of football fans to be most vocal when things go wrong but maybe I'm just old enough to remember some properly bad times and recognise we're still enjoying the good times right now.
We were simply outclassed for much of the game last night. I thought we played really well for the first 30 minutes and were then slowly pushed back by a more superior team. Second half was very much attack versus defence and with their quality it was inevitable that we would get overrun.
I think we have a bit of thinking to do at the end of this season, do we want to push for the Championship knowing that we have a much smaller fan base than every club in that division, or do we consolidate in this division and develop our youth/development structure and improve the facilities, whilst continuing to work the self sufficiency model.
I think Rob and Pete must realise that Wycombe Wanderers will never be a Luton or a Coventry who have both established themselves at Championship level.
Also, for us the supporters I am not saying we shouldn’t be ambitious but expectation as definitely played games with my outlook this season.
Oh no, I wasn't accusing you of accusing me!
Strongly disagree here - we absolutely can, and I think we will, but it was never likely to be that quick.
Well let us agree to disagree then.
Such wise words from MindlessDrugHoover, too many fans treat every defeat as a crisis.
It is heightened expectation after our success over the last two seasons. Very difficult to balance things right now but for me I simply go back to that dreadful day at Torquay when our club could easily have disappeared for ever.
Of course we should always remember Torquay, but we've got to keep pushing towards our goal. It's a realistic goal, but maybe the timescale was off.
I'd go back even more recently than that - the start to the 2016-17 season was very poor and after defeat at home to Barnet at the end of October in front of some 3,500 fans, we were 21st in league 2. Coming so soon after the play-off season many felt we were going backwards and that Gareth had taken us as far as he could. Soon after that game we went on a ridiculous winning streak led by the Kashket/Bayo/Paris combo. We finished 9th that season (might have been higher had we not hit that terrible post-White Hart Lane run) but since then it's been almost all upwards.
Could you explain to me why you see the aim of being a sustainable Championship club as being realistic in the medium term? I hope you are right but not sure I have ever really seen it as being likely. What do you think I am missing?
Mainly because of the recruitment model imo. It takes years to develop it to, say, Brentford levels, but that's as key to sustainability as anything and I think we're already on the right track. My slight concern would be that Rob's apparent envisaged timescale might not match the realistic one. It takes patience.
That said, we could well get back to the Championship in the next couple of seasons and do a Rotherham for a few years (not sure how much fun that is, though).