The performance, although expected, lays down a benchmark. Has to be that much effort, at least, each and every week
Although I don't agree with the Gape red card, there's no way it would be overturned - his studs do land on the players foot. Seriously though, how else is Gape supposed to make the challenge? If a midfield player can't challenge in that situation then football becomes non-contract.
@DJWYC14 said:
Should be appealed and overturned, it doesnt fit any red card criteria.
Summed up a diabolical referee who got many others decisions wrong
@Malone said:
Yes have to agree on this McCarthy in midfield business. Bizarre idea.
Midfield isn't just about being athletic, it's a totally different role to what he plays.
Talk about Samuel, his finishing isn't particularly bad is it? It's not like he gets loads of chances?!
His strengths aren't the same as a Kashket who sniffs the chance and is great at getting into positions.
It's not just about his athleticism... Unlikely to be tried but think he could be converted. Out of the midfielders we currently have, I guess it would have to be Thompson?
It's an emergency option maybe.
Surely Thompson will start, although he does seem to take a long time to get back to top form.
If we're pursuing any loanees/trialists, maybe that Karacan, now would be a good moment to bring them in!
I thought the referee was really poor. I didn’t catch who it was but reminded me of some of the random decision generators we’ve had in the past. Awarding free kicks to both sides for nothing and then missing obvious fouls. I wasn’t surprised at all that he rushed to send Gape off. I can’t understand on what basis that could possibly be a red. Maybe a yellow depending on how you interpret the rules.
Grimmer looked Championship quality today, hard to see how McCarthy displaces him if he stays injury and suspension free. Horgan looks an astute signing, aggressive, intelligent and already seemingly Wycomised. Parker really impressed me with some of those crosses - I was pretty confident he'd end up out on loan but perhaps we may be seeing a lot more of him than we did last year.
The midfield needs a lot of work. Difficult to judge on one match but Nick Freeman did not look ready to make the step up, anonymous in the first half and wasteful in the second. Bloomfield runs but we'll need more than that in this league. Gape's red shows the need to get at least two more central midfielders in, and I would also like to see Wheeler used more as a central attacking midfielder as I think we will need his guile and creativity, even if we end up playing Fred and Horgan on the wings.
@aloysius said:
Grimmer looked Championship quality today, hard to see how McCarthy displaces him if he stays injury and suspension free. Horgan looks an astute signing, aggressive, intelligent and already seemingly Wycomised. Parker really impressed me with some of those crosses - I was pretty confident he'd end up out on loan but perhaps we may be seeing a lot more of him than we did last year.
The midfield needs a lot of work. Difficult to judge on one match but Nick Freeman did not look ready to make the step up, anonymous in the first half and wasteful in the second. Bloomfield runs but we'll need more than that in this league. Gape's red shows the need to get at least two more central midfielders in, and I would also like to see Wheeler used more as a central attacking midfielder as I think we will need his guile and creativity, even if we end up playing Fred and Horgan on the wings.
Agree with most of that. Wheeler did win a lot of ball from wide positions, but Horgan surely has to be one of the first names on the sheet. He looks red hot.
Grimmer is a superb defender.
You wouldn't think we'll start Bloomfield and Freeman together too often.
The ball was there to be won and Dom won it. If that’s going to be a straight red in the championship several of our players are going to have to change their approach.
I guess we got an answer about Stockdale’s status today, although I’m confused about Anderson’s non-involvement.
Thought it was more a lower leg/ankle job than foot.
It was the foot. It was not a red card challenge in any football I am used to watching. Don't see much Championship stuff up to now to be fair though.
In the first half the intent of JJ's tackle was an issue despite him being away from the man. Was that that much different to the intent of Brentford keeper on Kashket? Neither were fouls to me
Thought it was more a lower leg/ankle job than foot.
It was the foot. It was not a red card challenge in any football I am used to watching. Don't see much Championship stuff up to now to be fair though.
In the first half the intent of JJ's tackle was an issue despite him being away from the man. Was that that much different to the intent of Brentford keeper on Kashket? Neither were fouls to me
You can see in the clip that @chairboyscentral just posted (and also from the still) that it's up to ankle/lower leg.
I'm not sure you can stud someone on the foot in fairness either.
Agree with your last line though - didn't think JJ's was a foul at all.
@Glenactico said:
I thought the referee was really poor. I didn’t catch who it was
Charles Breakspear - same ref who sent Phillips off at Posh last season. I think he gets a special mention in Close Quarters as not being a favourite of our management team.
Thought it was more a lower leg/ankle job than foot.
It was the foot. It was not a red card challenge in any football I am used to watching. Don't see much Championship stuff up to now to be fair though.
In the first half the intent of JJ's tackle was an issue despite him being away from the man. Was that that much different to the intent of Brentford keeper on Kashket? Neither were fouls to me
You can see in the clip that @chairboyscentral just posted (and also from the still) that it's up to ankle/lower leg.
I'm not sure you can stud someone on the foot in fairness either.
Agree with your last line though - didn't think JJ's was a foul at all.
If there's an issue, it's with the law, but it's been applied correctly there.
I’ve watched it several times now, and it’s definitely foot. Gape’s foot wasn’t even raised. Just because the guy rolls around holding his ankle afterwards doesn’t mean that’s where the contact was.
My admiration for Nick Freeman is probably well known but I was disappointed with him today. He always come across as a real cool customer so it was a surprise to see him blast his penalty well over.
It's only a definite red if the secondary contact is clearly likely to happen due to the type of tackle or so reckless that anything could happen. It shouldn't matter what or where the contact ends up being.
I think Freeman can be very good at picking a pass no other player in our side does. Problem is he can be too ponderous, and he always looks like the least confident player on the pitch.
@StrongestTeam said:
It's only a definite red if the secondary contact is clearly likely to happen due to the type of tackle or so reckless that anything could happen. It shouldn't matter what or where the contact ends up being.
The sports going to ruin if this is a valid reason for a tackle to be a straight red card.
'Secondary contact'
'Likely to happen'
I am not saying that in current top level football that you are technically wrong but from a sport point of view tackling is becoming impossible. Gape won the ball and the physics of kicking it lifted his studs a bit.
@micra said:
My admiration for Nick Freeman is probably well known but I was disappointed with him today. He always come across as a real cool customer so it was a surprise to see him blast his penalty well over.
Second season in a row he's missed a pen in this cup
Comments
Does anyone else think the lack of crowds are making referees worse? They are simply not held accountable at the point of an awful decision.
The performance, although expected, lays down a benchmark. Has to be that much effort, at least, each and every week
Although I don't agree with the Gape red card, there's no way it would be overturned - his studs do land on the players foot. Seriously though, how else is Gape supposed to make the challenge? If a midfield player can't challenge in that situation then football becomes non-contract.
Studs went into leg. Surely that's the criteria!?
Foot
It's an emergency option maybe.
Surely Thompson will start, although he does seem to take a long time to get back to top form.
If we're pursuing any loanees/trialists, maybe that Karacan, now would be a good moment to bring them in!
I thought the referee was really poor. I didn’t catch who it was but reminded me of some of the random decision generators we’ve had in the past. Awarding free kicks to both sides for nothing and then missing obvious fouls. I wasn’t surprised at all that he rushed to send Gape off. I can’t understand on what basis that could possibly be a red. Maybe a yellow depending on how you interpret the rules.
Grimmer looked Championship quality today, hard to see how McCarthy displaces him if he stays injury and suspension free. Horgan looks an astute signing, aggressive, intelligent and already seemingly Wycomised. Parker really impressed me with some of those crosses - I was pretty confident he'd end up out on loan but perhaps we may be seeing a lot more of him than we did last year.
The midfield needs a lot of work. Difficult to judge on one match but Nick Freeman did not look ready to make the step up, anonymous in the first half and wasteful in the second. Bloomfield runs but we'll need more than that in this league. Gape's red shows the need to get at least two more central midfielders in, and I would also like to see Wheeler used more as a central attacking midfielder as I think we will need his guile and creativity, even if we end up playing Fred and Horgan on the wings.
I think it will be overturned personally and quite right too
Thought it was more a lower leg/ankle job than foot.
Agree with most of that. Wheeler did win a lot of ball from wide positions, but Horgan surely has to be one of the first names on the sheet. He looks red hot.
Grimmer is a superb defender.
You wouldn't think we'll start Bloomfield and Freeman together too often.
The ball was there to be won and Dom won it. If that’s going to be a straight red in the championship several of our players are going to have to change their approach.
I guess we got an answer about Stockdale’s status today, although I’m confused about Anderson’s non-involvement.
A new CM just became even more of a priority.
Lower leg
It was the foot. It was not a red card challenge in any football I am used to watching. Don't see much Championship stuff up to now to be fair though.
In the first half the intent of JJ's tackle was an issue despite him being away from the man. Was that that much different to the intent of Brentford keeper on Kashket? Neither were fouls to me
You can see in the clip that @chairboyscentral just posted (and also from the still) that it's up to ankle/lower leg.
I'm not sure you can stud someone on the foot in fairness either.
Agree with your last line though - didn't think JJ's was a foul at all.
Sorry @Right_in_the_Middle. I realise now that you were referring to McCarthy, not Thompson.
Charles Breakspear - same ref who sent Phillips off at Posh last season. I think he gets a special mention in Close Quarters as not being a favourite of our management team.
If there's an issue, it's with the law, but it's been applied correctly there.
I’ve watched it several times now, and it’s definitely foot. Gape’s foot wasn’t even raised. Just because the guy rolls around holding his ankle afterwards doesn’t mean that’s where the contact was.
The ref was good old Charlie Breakspeare @Glenactico.
My admiration for Nick Freeman is probably well known but I was disappointed with him today. He always come across as a real cool customer so it was a surprise to see him blast his penalty well over.
Thompson and pattison will be cover for gape surely?
Foot.
It's only a definite red if the secondary contact is clearly likely to happen due to the type of tackle or so reckless that anything could happen. It shouldn't matter what or where the contact ends up being.
Putting the poor officiating aside - typical Gareth, Dobbo, Wycombe resilience - very happy with that performance and extremely proud of our team.
I think Freeman can be very good at picking a pass no other player in our side does. Problem is he can be too ponderous, and he always looks like the least confident player on the pitch.
I thought "careless" was yellow and "reckless" was red. Hard to judge that tackle as reckless - careless yes, but not reckless.
I thought it was late and reckless. Maybe a Yellow but no complaints that it was Red.
The sports going to ruin if this is a valid reason for a tackle to be a straight red card.
'Secondary contact'
'Likely to happen'
I am not saying that in current top level football that you are technically wrong but from a sport point of view tackling is becoming impossible. Gape won the ball and the physics of kicking it lifted his studs a bit.
Second season in a row he's missed a pen in this cup