@Malone O'Nien (and Holloway at times) were the only decent ones I could remember in the Ainsworth era. Not sure McGinn made much difference given the clash between his style and ours.
@aloysius. I wouldn't read too much into the comments of a players previous manager. It's fair enough for a manager to say I couldn't guarantee a player game time, but he is not in a position to comment on what another club will offer. I do not see GA as the type of manager who would sign a player who is dictating guaranteed game time.
@Chris. If a central defender has had a career at Championship and International level I don't think his height can be too much of an issue. If you are good enough, you are tall enough. Pierre may be taller (about 2 inches), but he hasn't yet got his signature on a Championship contract.
As WW have gone into pre-season training with as many players on the books as they have had at the start of the previous couple of seasons, did we really expect many early signings this year. I'm not expecting the squad to be much different in size to previous years, so don't expect a great deal of transfer activity.
Improvement every does not necessary need more transfer activity, it could be better teamwork from a group of players who have trained together for at least a year.
@wformation That's overly optimistic in my opinion.
You can't expect to weaken your squad to the extent we have (so far) and do better over the course of a long, hard season, particularly when some of your veterans are a year older.
I'll be amazed if we don't sign another two or three.
By the sound of it, the Welsh winger Owain Jones looked good. I think he sounds like the kind of promising young rough diamond we should be looking at to replace Wood/Weston/Thompson out wide.
@bluenotes individually I agree, but going into a game with Stewart as the only outfield player over 6 foot might lead to trouble. That prospect isn't unrealistic given that Jombati and Hayes are not guaranteed to be in the first eleven any more - and Rowe, Freeman, Müller and De Havilland are all unlikely to start many games.
@Vital. I didn't say the club would not sign players.
In the last couple of seasons the club has returned to pre-season training with 14-16 players,and then had to sign eight or nine, some as late as in the first weeks of the season. This year there are more players on the books in July, and if there is not going to be a large increase in the squad size, that leaves less room for transfer activity. Of course there will be signings, but lets be clear, we did not loose Blackman, he was never ours to loose. Of the others, we only have lost Weston, the others were not retained, or have chosen not to re-sign.
I have faith that the professionals at the club know what they are doing and are working to build the squad as required. Do you not share that view?
We will need to sign a couple of U18s or U19s for the coming season to be able to meet the "club-developed" player in every match day squad requirement that has been agreed by the EFL for 2018/19.
@Uncle_T. With that in mind, it could be part of the reason WW are currently giving a young keeper a trial. I'm not sure how that will work for clubs without a youth setup.
I'm looking forward to 2019/20 season when the EFL will insist on having a couple of pensioners on the bench as well, in the interests of being inclusive and non-ageist. I might offer my services.
Thanks Chris. There have been plenty of occasions when WW have not named a full bench, so it hardly becomes a major issue, but I'd like to see the club developing some home-grown young players.
@Vital, that sort of post completely ignores that we've got Rowe and Southwell back, we already have Browns' replacement, and we've replaced Pierre already.
People also seem to refuse to acknowledge that we made key signings near the end of last season. Paris and Gape made permanent, and Saunders too.
Our squad is as packed as it's ever been, how many more bodies do we need?! If anyone, it's mere squad fill.
@Vital. There are changes every year, this situation is nothing new. If I remember correctly (and I am happy to be corrected by someone with a better memory than mine), WW started last season with 19 players, then added to the squad in the first month. This season WW have returned to training with a squad of approximately that size. There has been no major clear out this year, so it was always likely that there would be less transfer activity.
Blackman would never have been part of a long term plan, so that would be a position that was always under consideration. Pierre not re-signing was always likely, so would have got similar attention. The club chose to not retain Wood and Thompson. That decision would not have been taken without due thought for the future. The only surprise was Weston choosing to go.
Just because there are no current announcements, does not mean the club are not working to fill the vacancies in the squad. Overall the judgement of signing, including loan signings, in recent years has proved to be pretty sound without ever being rushed. Why think that this year would be any different? What's the panic?
@Malone Taking your points one by one (rather than ignoring them).
Brown and El Abd are clearly a downgrade on Blackman and Pierre.
Southwell and Rowe were farmed out because they couldn't get in the team.
Paris and Gape were here all season. Saunders came late I agree.
At the moment we're obviously weaker than we were at the end of last season, and I would hope that any further signings are serious contenders, not "mere squad fill."
@Vital. I now think you are getting a little confused. I never commented on whether you suggested there would be more signings. I only ever said that I had never expected a great deal of transfer activity this year because there had not been a major clear out.
I fully expect there to be a few signings before the end of the transfer window. I just don't see a reason to panic that the signings have not already taken place.
The squad currently may or may not be as strong as at the end of last season (that is a matter of individual opinion), but the season hasn't started yet, and the transfer window will remain open for while after that. There is nothing new in this situation, and in the past the state of the squad at this stage has been worse.
I have enough faith to believe the club have matters in hand and know what they are doing. Is it beyond the realms of possibility that more experienced players may read the game better and do the job as well, if not better than previous less experienced players? I find it rather sad that players are being dismissed as a down grade before a ball has even been kicked in a competitive match.
@Vital , a lot of our fans hyped Brown up to huge levels when he was at Cheltenham, and while I never went along with that, I think he's plenty good enough for our needs.
Anyone from Pierre is the one step down I see.
Thompson and Wood i think are comfortably replaced as squad players.
Our season depends on Bayo, Kashket and Saunders remaining fit. If they can play in most games I think we'll have a great season.
@DevC If we want to be contenders I believe we need a better central defender to replace Pierre, at least one quality wide man to replace Thompson, Wood and Weston, and another striker, given the fitness problems with Kashket and Hayes.
Comments
I completely agree, Richie. Just look what happened with another senior, high profile signing in Peter Murphy.
My biggest concern with El Abd is his lack of height compared with Pierre, and where this leaves the team as a whole heightwise.
With only one new recruit so far, and little success from trialists in recent years, I'm pinning my hopes on a late flurry of quality loan signings.
O Nien and McGinn was a decent couple of trialists a couple of years ago wasn't it?
And right now, we don't really need any starters, although that could quickly change of course.
@Malone O'Nien (and Holloway at times) were the only decent ones I could remember in the Ainsworth era. Not sure McGinn made much difference given the clash between his style and ours.
@aloysius. I wouldn't read too much into the comments of a players previous manager. It's fair enough for a manager to say I couldn't guarantee a player game time, but he is not in a position to comment on what another club will offer. I do not see GA as the type of manager who would sign a player who is dictating guaranteed game time.
@Chris. If a central defender has had a career at Championship and International level I don't think his height can be too much of an issue. If you are good enough, you are tall enough. Pierre may be taller (about 2 inches), but he hasn't yet got his signature on a Championship contract.
As WW have gone into pre-season training with as many players on the books as they have had at the start of the previous couple of seasons, did we really expect many early signings this year. I'm not expecting the squad to be much different in size to previous years, so don't expect a great deal of transfer activity.
@bluenotes Since the end of last season we've lost Blackman, Pierre, Wood, Thompson and Weston.
We've signed El Abd.
Given that the goal is to improve each year, I think it's perfectly reasonable to expect more transfer activity.
Improvement every does not necessary need more transfer activity, it could be better teamwork from a group of players who have trained together for at least a year.
omitted "season" after every
@wformation That's overly optimistic in my opinion.
You can't expect to weaken your squad to the extent we have (so far) and do better over the course of a long, hard season, particularly when some of your veterans are a year older.
I'll be amazed if we don't sign another two or three.
By the sound of it, the Welsh winger Owain Jones looked good. I think he sounds like the kind of promising young rough diamond we should be looking at to replace Wood/Weston/Thompson out wide.
@bluenotes individually I agree, but going into a game with Stewart as the only outfield player over 6 foot might lead to trouble. That prospect isn't unrealistic given that Jombati and Hayes are not guaranteed to be in the first eleven any more - and Rowe, Freeman, Müller and De Havilland are all unlikely to start many games.
@Vital. I didn't say the club would not sign players.
In the last couple of seasons the club has returned to pre-season training with 14-16 players,and then had to sign eight or nine, some as late as in the first weeks of the season. This year there are more players on the books in July, and if there is not going to be a large increase in the squad size, that leaves less room for transfer activity. Of course there will be signings, but lets be clear, we did not loose Blackman, he was never ours to loose. Of the others, we only have lost Weston, the others were not retained, or have chosen not to re-sign.
I have faith that the professionals at the club know what they are doing and are working to build the squad as required. Do you not share that view?
I'm not advocating bringing back Luke Oliver but it's something to consider. Now if Blackman was back that would take some of the pressure off...
We will need to sign a couple of U18s or U19s for the coming season to be able to meet the "club-developed" player in every match day squad requirement that has been agreed by the EFL for 2018/19.
@Uncle_T. With that in mind, it could be part of the reason WW are currently giving a young keeper a trial. I'm not sure how that will work for clubs without a youth setup.
I'm looking forward to 2019/20 season when the EFL will insist on having a couple of pensioners on the bench as well, in the interests of being inclusive and non-ageist. I might offer my services.
You can choose to name six substitutes and leave a blank space in place of having a club developed player.
Thanks Chris. There have been plenty of occasions when WW have not named a full bench, so it hardly becomes a major issue, but I'd like to see the club developing some home-grown young players.
@bluenotes You can call it what you like. We have lost the services of Blackman, Pierre, Wood, Thompson and Weston.
Might as well bring back sergio torres too he was good for us too lol
@Vital, that sort of post completely ignores that we've got Rowe and Southwell back, we already have Browns' replacement, and we've replaced Pierre already.
People also seem to refuse to acknowledge that we made key signings near the end of last season. Paris and Gape made permanent, and Saunders too.
Our squad is as packed as it's ever been, how many more bodies do we need?! If anyone, it's mere squad fill.
@Vital. There are changes every year, this situation is nothing new. If I remember correctly (and I am happy to be corrected by someone with a better memory than mine), WW started last season with 19 players, then added to the squad in the first month. This season WW have returned to training with a squad of approximately that size. There has been no major clear out this year, so it was always likely that there would be less transfer activity.
Blackman would never have been part of a long term plan, so that would be a position that was always under consideration. Pierre not re-signing was always likely, so would have got similar attention. The club chose to not retain Wood and Thompson. That decision would not have been taken without due thought for the future. The only surprise was Weston choosing to go.
Just because there are no current announcements, does not mean the club are not working to fill the vacancies in the squad. Overall the judgement of signing, including loan signings, in recent years has proved to be pretty sound without ever being rushed. Why think that this year would be any different? What's the panic?
@Malone Taking your points one by one (rather than ignoring them).
Brown and El Abd are clearly a downgrade on Blackman and Pierre.
Southwell and Rowe were farmed out because they couldn't get in the team.
Paris and Gape were here all season. Saunders came late I agree.
At the moment we're obviously weaker than we were at the end of last season, and I would hope that any further signings are serious contenders, not "mere squad fill."
Blackman: Replaced with Brown and possibly the keeper who is on trial
Pierre: Replaced by El Abd
Wood: Replaced by Rowe and probably one other squad player will sign
Thomo: Replaced by Tyson possibly
Weston: We have atleast one winger on trial so I'm sure we will be fine here.
We also have the likes of Southwell, Freeman etc who were either injured or didn't get much of a chance last year.
I'm with @Malone the squad is decent and if Tyson does sign probably only needs one or two more players.
@bluenotes Show me the bit where I doubt there will be more signings.
clue...Its not the bit where I say "I'll be amazed if we don't sign another two or three."
Squad unless I have missed anyone
GK Brown
FB Jombati, Harriman, Jacobson
CB El Abd, Stewart, Muller, De Hav (pierre)
CM Gape, Onien, Bloomfield, Saunders, (bean) , Rowe
WM/F Cowan Hall, Kashket, Freeman
F Akinfenwa, Southwell, Hayes
Doesn't feel like there are a huge number of gaps, particularly if Tyson is judged up to scratch.
@DevC It's not about gaps, it's about the quality of the squad (at the moment) compared to the end of last season.
I'm sure some decent loanees will redress the balance.
What positions do you feel need to be added too (lets assume for now that Tyson signs)
@Vital. I now think you are getting a little confused. I never commented on whether you suggested there would be more signings. I only ever said that I had never expected a great deal of transfer activity this year because there had not been a major clear out.
I fully expect there to be a few signings before the end of the transfer window. I just don't see a reason to panic that the signings have not already taken place.
The squad currently may or may not be as strong as at the end of last season (that is a matter of individual opinion), but the season hasn't started yet, and the transfer window will remain open for while after that. There is nothing new in this situation, and in the past the state of the squad at this stage has been worse.
I have enough faith to believe the club have matters in hand and know what they are doing. Is it beyond the realms of possibility that more experienced players may read the game better and do the job as well, if not better than previous less experienced players? I find it rather sad that players are being dismissed as a down grade before a ball has even been kicked in a competitive match.
@Vital , a lot of our fans hyped Brown up to huge levels when he was at Cheltenham, and while I never went along with that, I think he's plenty good enough for our needs.
Anyone from Pierre is the one step down I see.
Thompson and Wood i think are comfortably replaced as squad players.
Our season depends on Bayo, Kashket and Saunders remaining fit. If they can play in most games I think we'll have a great season.
@DevC If we want to be contenders I believe we need a better central defender to replace Pierre, at least one quality wide man to replace Thompson, Wood and Weston, and another striker, given the fitness problems with Kashket and Hayes.