@ReturnToSenda said:
At what point are we actually allowed to get annoyed with our shit form?
But there’s a distance between being annoyed, as we all are, and imagining conspiracies and wondering if GA should be replaced isn’t there?
I think it's entirely natural to ponder the latter without getting rabid - is anyone whose views are worth giving credence actually calling for his head?
It’s also perfectly possible to be annoyed without even pondering it. I don’t know how you ascribe ’credence,’ but one fella thought the question was worth a new thread.
This is miserable, and very disappointing. But we’re still on course for our 4th highest finish in the football league.
But there is a point at which (wholly justified) admiration becomes hero worship - no one should ever be beyond criticism, and I think we stray very close to that. It's healthy to open up the debate even if the overwhelming opinion is 'Nonsense'.
Agreed, and this was why we waited too long to fire Sanchez. GA is clearly not in the ‘beyond criticism,’ category tho.
If there is any criticism of Gareth, it is that he doesn't know his best starting eleven now. In previous years he didn't have the deep squad he has now so selection was relatively easy.
I try to look for positives even on a day as gloomy as this so I just want to say how well Dom Gape played for someone who’s been out injured for most of the season.
I think the mistake the cost us the game today was probably not bringing on Forino when Accrington equalised at 2-2. They made a good change at half time, and it counted immediately - fair enough, well done to John Coleman. Waiting until they scored again was an error, and then the damage was done. I'm normally not in the 'Ainsworth makes subs way too late' camp, but I think that was the difference on this occiasion.
I'm still not panicking. We've always been a streaky side under GA - we go on long runs of winning, long runs of not conceding many, and we've also had some significant slumps too, and had periods when we look like we'll never score. He's sorted it out in the past, and he'll get us through this too.
@glasshalffull said:
I try to look for positives even on a day as gloomy as this so I just want to say how well Dom Gape played for someone who’s been out injured for most of the season.
Indeed this great to hear, but trouble is you half expect him to get injured in training on Monday and be out for 8 weeks!!
@arnos_grove said:
Use of the terms ‘lost the dressing room’ and ‘no plan B’ give a good clue that person you’re listening too doesn’t have much of a clue.
I’d agree with @glasshalffull. A complete loss of confidence but I’d extend that to the manager too, who seems to be flailing around at the moment making desperate changes each game to get the elusive win.
Needs to put a good solid side out with a bias towards defending and stop them hoofing it (easier said than done, I know). We know this can be a fine team, but it needs to feel its way back to form. The problem is that we’re running out of games fast.
The Wing loan signing was a curious one, as "goal threat" seemed to be the key thinking, but with Mehmeti, McCleary and Horgan already in the building, it seemed an odd one.
Gape is now back, to fill in when Thompson isn't around, so I'm not sure why the need was there for Wing.
When Hanlan started most games, if anything the need was for another pacey striker option off the bench.
I'm not sure if Al Hamadi is a serious idea for ever making the first team or was some sort of social media hits thing (I think Couhig has said such a scheme would be considered!), and De Barr seems a bit too far off it, hence the loan.
We took quite a while to react to giant Pell coming on today didn't we.
He'd won 3 or 4 headers in the first min or 2 he was on, then obviously scored the winner.
@glasshalffull said:
I try to look for positives even on a day as gloomy as this so I just want to say how well Dom Gape played for someone who’s been out injured for most of the season.
I second that. His style worries me. He can’t help himself being combative and I hold my breath every time he hits the turf. Needs a bit of luck to keep injury free. He certainly deserves it.
@Glenny said:
I think the mistake the cost us the game today was probably not bringing on Forino when Accrington equalised at 2-2. They made a good change at half time, and it counted immediately - fair enough, well done to John Coleman. Waiting until they scored again was an error, and then the damage was done. I'm normally not in the 'Ainsworth makes subs way too late' camp, but I think that was the difference on this occiasion.
I'm still not panicking. We've always been a streaky side under GA - we go on long runs of winning, long runs of not conceding many, and we've also had some significant slumps too, and had periods when we look like we'll never score. He's sorted it out in the past, and he'll get us through this too.
I thought it was Pell coming on that we needed to react against. The second he came on he was a huge threat we couldn't deal with.
We let it pan out for a fair while, they scored and that was almost it. Bar one superb chance late on that should have gone in from Hanlan.
Didn't see the game but sometimes I think GA puts faith in his players at say 5-3 or 2-1 to see the game out and worries about changing too much. Though you can blame tactics and subs, for me sometimes the players are not making good decisions during the game and we possibly lack a leader on the pitch. The guys are all nice professionals and that but as I said earlier in the season, all this lovely comradery is great but I wonder if it makes losing less of a worry.
@drcongo said: @Malone I believe Wing is a perm signing, though only till the end of the season.
Yes, you're right. Although it's a slightly bizarre situation.
Very bizarre indeed. Though I would quite like to see us play the 4-97-2 formation that our attacking midfield options would allow.
I think we need to change and go back to 4 at the back.
The collateral damage is JJ, but the team has to come first.
We've not really had great success at right wing back, so switch to a right back.
Similarly, both Stewart and Taf are more at home as a natural 2 (we'll ignore any debate of where and why Taf is out recently). I dare say Forino would find it easier there too.
Then you can still have your Thompson- Scowen axis, but still fit in 2 attacking mids, Hanlan and Vokes.
GMac, Hanlan and Mehmeti made zero impact on the game today. That’s not down to individuals that’s down to some of the appalling passes aimed at rather than two them.
If I was Dobbo and GA I would not know where to start. You could make an argument for dropping half the team today but we need to get some consistency
Not the result we wanted
We go again
Never too high
Sometimes we need to just take stock, reflect for a short time and move on. Season's not over but lets start addressing our mistakes now ready for the new season
A lot of talk of expectation that shouldn't have been so high, which I understand. The disappointment for me is we've had the best squad I can remember in 20 odd years, started so well, were 1st a month ago, and have surrendered it so meekly. These things happen in football, but you can't get angry or morally superior at someone for being annoyed at it
Ok was at the game today - positives Dom Gape good first game back; Chris Forino made a real difference and looked assured when he came on - a great find; Jack Grimmer combative and a good game.
Downsides we have a good few players out of form / off their game: GMac; Stocko (how quiet was he today and I was stood 10 yards from him first half); McCarthy (improving but has he lost some pace); JJ (set pieces / corners). This lack of confidence / form looks to be leading to poor decision making, why else would we persist with high balls into Vokes when he was getting little change out of their defence (albeit attempting to get into Vokes’ shirt on virtually every challenge appeared acceptable to today’s inept referee)
From today’s performance I don’t buy that they are not trying, I don’t buy that there is something going on if anything I felt they might be over trying. Whatever it is we are nowhere near as effective as we were earlier in the season.
But let’s face it we have been conceding goals all season - I make it we have conceded 3 or more goals 9 times in the league this season. No surprise then that a few players a little way from their best has led to a poor run of results.
We are still a work in progress and although we have much stronger strength in depth this season that has only got us to the position whereby we can compete for the play offs, we don’t have the strength of so many of those around us
Onwards to Tuesday, let’s get behind the team they need us at the moment
Comments
Agreed, and this was why we waited too long to fire Sanchez. GA is clearly not in the ‘beyond criticism,’ category tho.
If there is any criticism of Gareth, it is that he doesn't know his best starting eleven now. In previous years he didn't have the deep squad he has now so selection was relatively easy.
I try to look for positives even on a day as gloomy as this so I just want to say how well Dom Gape played for someone who’s been out injured for most of the season.
Can he play at CB @glasshalffull ?
I think the mistake the cost us the game today was probably not bringing on Forino when Accrington equalised at 2-2. They made a good change at half time, and it counted immediately - fair enough, well done to John Coleman. Waiting until they scored again was an error, and then the damage was done. I'm normally not in the 'Ainsworth makes subs way too late' camp, but I think that was the difference on this occiasion.
I'm still not panicking. We've always been a streaky side under GA - we go on long runs of winning, long runs of not conceding many, and we've also had some significant slumps too, and had periods when we look like we'll never score. He's sorted it out in the past, and he'll get us through this too.
Indeed this great to hear, but trouble is you half expect him to get injured in training on Monday and be out for 8 weeks!!
The Wing loan signing was a curious one, as "goal threat" seemed to be the key thinking, but with Mehmeti, McCleary and Horgan already in the building, it seemed an odd one.
Gape is now back, to fill in when Thompson isn't around, so I'm not sure why the need was there for Wing.
When Hanlan started most games, if anything the need was for another pacey striker option off the bench.
I'm not sure if Al Hamadi is a serious idea for ever making the first team or was some sort of social media hits thing (I think Couhig has said such a scheme would be considered!), and De Barr seems a bit too far off it, hence the loan.
Only if he climbs onto Josh Scowen’s shoulders!
That might not be a bad shout y'know
@Malone I believe Wing is a perm signing, though only till the end of the season.
We took quite a while to react to giant Pell coming on today didn't we.
He'd won 3 or 4 headers in the first min or 2 he was on, then obviously scored the winner.
Not a problem if Taff was around of course...
Have to agree with Glenny that bringing on Forino earlier would have helped against their beanstalk players. I am a big fan of Forino.
Yes, you're right. Although it's a slightly bizarre situation.
I second that. His style worries me. He can’t help himself being combative and I hold my breath every time he hits the turf. Needs a bit of luck to keep injury free. He certainly deserves it.
I thought it was Pell coming on that we needed to react against. The second he came on he was a huge threat we couldn't deal with.
We let it pan out for a fair while, they scored and that was almost it. Bar one superb chance late on that should have gone in from Hanlan.
Didn't see the game but sometimes I think GA puts faith in his players at say 5-3 or 2-1 to see the game out and worries about changing too much. Though you can blame tactics and subs, for me sometimes the players are not making good decisions during the game and we possibly lack a leader on the pitch. The guys are all nice professionals and that but as I said earlier in the season, all this lovely comradery is great but I wonder if it makes losing less of a worry.
Very bizarre indeed. Though I would quite like to see us play the 4-97-2 formation that our attacking midfield options would allow.
I think we need to change and go back to 4 at the back.
The collateral damage is JJ, but the team has to come first.
We've not really had great success at right wing back, so switch to a right back.
Similarly, both Stewart and Taf are more at home as a natural 2 (we'll ignore any debate of where and why Taf is out recently). I dare say Forino would find it easier there too.
Then you can still have your Thompson- Scowen axis, but still fit in 2 attacking mids, Hanlan and Vokes.
GMac, Hanlan and Mehmeti made zero impact on the game today. That’s not down to individuals that’s down to some of the appalling passes aimed at rather than two them.
If I was Dobbo and GA I would not know where to start. You could make an argument for dropping half the team today but we need to get some consistency
Not the result we wanted
We go again
Never too high
Playing with 4 full backs and 1 centre back is our problem.
I've got to say I thought this evening on here would be a lot livelier. Is everyone just that lost for words? To be fair, I am.
Sometimes I find the matchday threads too depressing when we lose.
Sometimes we need to just take stock, reflect for a short time and move on. Season's not over but lets start addressing our mistakes now ready for the new season
Comment from Coleman.
https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/19955145.accrington-stanley-boss-john-colemans-verdict-wycombe-wanderers-victory
Does he not understand the concept of the amount of stoppage time being a “minimum”, as Phil C is so careful to point out on every commentary?
A lot of talk of expectation that shouldn't have been so high, which I understand. The disappointment for me is we've had the best squad I can remember in 20 odd years, started so well, were 1st a month ago, and have surrendered it so meekly. These things happen in football, but you can't get angry or morally superior at someone for being annoyed at it
Meh.
https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/12552647/accrington-3-2-wycombe-league-one-highlights
6 wins from our last 20 matches. Mid table beckons.
Just watched, great ball by Vokes to vein the move on first goal and excellent by Gape for second. Their first goal though, oh my god.
Ok was at the game today - positives Dom Gape good first game back; Chris Forino made a real difference and looked assured when he came on - a great find; Jack Grimmer combative and a good game.
Downsides we have a good few players out of form / off their game: GMac; Stocko (how quiet was he today and I was stood 10 yards from him first half); McCarthy (improving but has he lost some pace); JJ (set pieces / corners). This lack of confidence / form looks to be leading to poor decision making, why else would we persist with high balls into Vokes when he was getting little change out of their defence (albeit attempting to get into Vokes’ shirt on virtually every challenge appeared acceptable to today’s inept referee)
From today’s performance I don’t buy that they are not trying, I don’t buy that there is something going on if anything I felt they might be over trying. Whatever it is we are nowhere near as effective as we were earlier in the season.
But let’s face it we have been conceding goals all season - I make it we have conceded 3 or more goals 9 times in the league this season. No surprise then that a few players a little way from their best has led to a poor run of results.
We are still a work in progress and although we have much stronger strength in depth this season that has only got us to the position whereby we can compete for the play offs, we don’t have the strength of so many of those around us
Onwards to Tuesday, let’s get behind the team they need us at the moment
Nice balanced perspective, @PJS, cheers!