@mooneyman said:
Personally I think this is a good deal for all parties. Uche will earn more money, Middlesbrough have money to burn and we get good compensation.
If you look at Uche's performance over the whole season and not just the last few games (and he had not exactly pulled up trees at his previous clubs) then in this financial climate £1m seems generous. Providing that these funds are reinvested across the squad wisely, then it is possible we could end up stronger à la Brentford.
Hopefully a good sell on percentage will be Included in the deal.
Well yes, if you include not playing for half a season then yes.
But if you look at his game changing performances in the championship its not a surprising fee.
Is he worth two Fred's though (assuming the £500k figure for him was correct)?
Gutted to see him go, and never get to see in the flesh. But if we are going down this Brentford/23's route then this thing could easily keep happening now, we're a selling team.
I don't blame either Fred or Uche staying in the Championship if offered...we got them cheap and received fees that (as far as I know) aren't going into one bloke's bank account. We also have a management team who have a good track record in signing players and loanees and maintaining a great team ethos. Soon we will get to see them playing football LIVE! We've been in worst positions in the past!
It will be interesting to see if the Fred and Uche money ( £1.25M / £1.5M ) is used as additive to Gareth’s budget. If it is we could be in for an exciting season.
I didn't realise Joe Piggot was 27 (28 this year). Scratch that in that case, no real potential for a fee down the line. Then again, if he fired us back to the Championship... (I don't really think we'd have much chance of getting him in any case.)
@mooneyman said:
Personally I think this is a good deal for all parties. Uche will earn more money, Middlesbrough have money to burn and we get good compensation.
If you look at Uche's performance over the whole season and not just the last few games (and he had not exactly pulled up trees at his previous clubs) then in this financial climate £1m seems generous. Providing that these funds are reinvested across the squad wisely, then it is possible we could end up stronger à la Brentford.
Hopefully a good sell on percentage will be Included in the deal.
Well yes, if you include not playing for half a season then yes.
But if you look at his game changing performances in the championship its not a surprising fee.
Is he worth two Fred's though (assuming the £500k figure for him was correct)?
Was there anything reliable suggesting it was that much?
But, GA and Dobbo have done alright with no money to spend. I’m not worried that they’ll struggle to find a suitable replacement with some money behind them.
But, GA and Dobbo have done alright with no money to spend. I’m not worried that they’ll struggle to find a suitable replacement with some money behind them.
Hopefully they can find suitable replacements for Uche and Fred. It cannot be Bayo and Samuel.
Last summer we had next to feck all cash and recruited (on the whole) superbly. Gareth and Dobbo I’m sure have an A, B, C etc list and maybe those A’s just got a bit more realistic.
Yes, while I'd love to have seen Uche destroying L1 defences, that kind of money is crazy for us. We know Ainsworth will pick up some diamonds, polished or otherwise. No longer are we losing our best players for a pittance and the promise of sell-ons that never come.
But seriously, I think Samuel would actually be very useful in a front two alongside a semi-physical goal-scorer (a Muskwe type) in a high-pressing, more possession-based game - which is what we were moving towards. We know his hold-up play is excellent, and he will drag defenders out of position. I'm not saying he's the Uche replacement, but I expect him to get a fair amount of game time next season.
@ReturnToSenda said:
But seriously, I think Samuel would actually be very useful in a front two alongside a semi-physical goal-scorer (a Muskwe type) in a high-pressing, more possession-based game - which is what we were moving towards. We know his hold-up play is excellent, and he will drag defenders out of position. I'm not saying he's the Uche replacement, but I expect him to get a fair amount of game time next season.
You must see something in Samuel I don’t, if you think he will get games. I just see someone who runs around , creates very few chances and doesn’t look like scoring. We need goal scoring threats to replace Uche .
If we have to rely on Samuel as one of our front two, then we can forget any sort of promotion or indeed top half challenge.
He is a nice young chap but is not what we need to have a realistic chance of getting back into the championship.
@Blue_since_1990 said:
If we have to rely on Samuel as one of our front two, then we can forget any sort of promotion or indeed top half challenge.
He is a nice young chap but is not what we need to have a realistic chance of getting back into the championship.
He played a fairly key role in us getting there last time.
And this isn't the 90s; we're not talking about strike partners at the top of a 4-4-2 who'd mainly be charged with getting on the end of crosses score in equal measure. Samuel would lead the press effectively, force mistakes and create space, as well as the holding the ball up for a striker partner and others posing more goal threat. But as I also said, he wouldn't be the Uche replacement, so I don't mean he'd start particularly regularly.
But with Admiral and Uche playing together we stepped up to another level and neither Samuel or Kashket barely got a look in apart from early in the season when we suffered our losing run.
I am not saying that he wasn’t useful in our promotion year but we need more to get out of League 1 in the coming season.
@Blue_since_1990 said:
But with Admiral and Uche playing together we stepped up to another level and neither Samuel or Kashket barely got a look in apart from early in the season when we suffered our losing run.
I am not saying that he wasn’t useful in our promotion year but we need more to get out of League 1 in the coming season.
Because Admiral and Uche are Championship calibre players, which we can't reasonably expect to have - nor do we need - in League One.
@Blue_since_1990 said:
I thought Gareth stated we were building a team for the championship irrespective of where we end up.
He did, and actually we already have some Championship calibre players if you look at who proved themselves at that level last season, but Admiral and Uche are a cut above.
You have your view of what is needed @ReturnToSenda but I think you may be underestimating what will be needed to get out of League 1 in 21/22.
I just think we need to keep moving forward as a team and not just accept that season 19/20 players are enough to get us back up again this coming season. Difficult task I know but it is what is needed.
@Blue_since_1990 Seven regulars from 2019/20 were regulars in very nearly keeping us in the Championship. I think you may be underestimating them. And I know Samuel wasn't one of them, but he hasn't suddenly become a less useful player at League One level.
Both Samuel nor Kashket actually proved themselves at Championship level and neither scored goals on a regular basis even in League 1.
Yes we have seven or even more players who proved themselves at championship level but my point is we need to strengthen in the forward positions to really have a chance of going up.
We must improve to move forward and I am sure Gareth will do exactly that and we will add attacking options either through signings or loans.
@ReturnToSenda said: @Blue_since_1990 Seven regulars from 2019/20 were regulars in very nearly keeping us in the Championship. I think you may be underestimating them. And I know Samuel wasn't one of them, but he hasn't suddenly become a less useful player at League One level.
How was he useful even in League 1? Was it one goal and a couple of assists?
Comments
I wonder if Hearts inserted a good sell-on percentage in the deal that brought him to us.
Is he worth two Fred's though (assuming the £500k figure for him was correct)?
Gutted to see him go, and never get to see in the flesh. But if we are going down this Brentford/23's route then this thing could easily keep happening now, we're a selling team.
Every club apart from the most elite few is a selling club; we're just not used to having players quite this valuable.
I don't blame either Fred or Uche staying in the Championship if offered...we got them cheap and received fees that (as far as I know) aren't going into one bloke's bank account. We also have a management team who have a good track record in signing players and loanees and maintaining a great team ethos. Soon we will get to see them playing football LIVE! We've been in worst positions in the past!
Would this be a record sale for us? Surely £1m would if not £750,000.
It will be interesting to see if the Fred and Uche money ( £1.25M / £1.5M ) is used as additive to Gareth’s budget. If it is we could be in for an exciting season.
I didn't realise Joe Piggot was 27 (28 this year). Scratch that in that case, no real potential for a fee down the line. Then again, if he fired us back to the Championship... (I don't really think we'd have much chance of getting him in any case.)
Was there anything reliable suggesting it was that much?
We sold a few players with sell on fees.
Ibe is surely the overall record.
Disappointed if true
But, GA and Dobbo have done alright with no money to spend. I’m not worried that they’ll struggle to find a suitable replacement with some money behind them.
Hopefully they can find suitable replacements for Uche and Fred. It cannot be Bayo and Samuel.
Hadn't considered Samuel as a LWB
Last summer we had next to feck all cash and recruited (on the whole) superbly. Gareth and Dobbo I’m sure have an A, B, C etc list and maybe those A’s just got a bit more realistic.
Exciting times and good luck to Uche btw
Yes, while I'd love to have seen Uche destroying L1 defences, that kind of money is crazy for us. We know Ainsworth will pick up some diamonds, polished or otherwise. No longer are we losing our best players for a pittance and the promise of sell-ons that never come.
But seriously, I think Samuel would actually be very useful in a front two alongside a semi-physical goal-scorer (a Muskwe type) in a high-pressing, more possession-based game - which is what we were moving towards. We know his hold-up play is excellent, and he will drag defenders out of position. I'm not saying he's the Uche replacement, but I expect him to get a fair amount of game time next season.
You must see something in Samuel I don’t, if you think he will get games. I just see someone who runs around , creates very few chances and doesn’t look like scoring. We need goal scoring threats to replace Uche .
You must be joking all Samuel's does is works hard and falls over, never scores goals
If we have to rely on Samuel as one of our front two, then we can forget any sort of promotion or indeed top half challenge.
He is a nice young chap but is not what we need to have a realistic chance of getting back into the championship.
He played a fairly key role in us getting there last time.
And this isn't the 90s; we're not talking about strike partners at the top of a 4-4-2 who'd mainly be charged with getting on the end of crosses score in equal measure. Samuel would lead the press effectively, force mistakes and create space, as well as the holding the ball up for a striker partner and others posing more goal threat. But as I also said, he wouldn't be the Uche replacement, so I don't mean he'd start particularly regularly.
But with Admiral and Uche playing together we stepped up to another level and neither Samuel or Kashket barely got a look in apart from early in the season when we suffered our losing run.
I am not saying that he wasn’t useful in our promotion year but we need more to get out of League 1 in the coming season.
Yes agree Samuel’s still got plenty to offer this club. Kashket too.
It won’t be easy to replace Uche. Big athletic players who can lead the line and score goals aren’t easy to find and are not usually short of suitors.
Because Admiral and Uche are Championship calibre players, which we can't reasonably expect to have - nor do we need - in League One.
I thought Gareth stated we were building a team for the championship irrespective of where we end up.
He did, and actually we already have some Championship calibre players if you look at who proved themselves at that level last season, but Admiral and Uche are a cut above.
You have your view of what is needed @ReturnToSenda but I think you may be underestimating what will be needed to get out of League 1 in 21/22.
I just think we need to keep moving forward as a team and not just accept that season 19/20 players are enough to get us back up again this coming season. Difficult task I know but it is what is needed.
@Blue_since_1990 Seven regulars from 2019/20 were regulars in very nearly keeping us in the Championship. I think you may be underestimating them. And I know Samuel wasn't one of them, but he hasn't suddenly become a less useful player at League One level.
Both Samuel nor Kashket actually proved themselves at Championship level and neither scored goals on a regular basis even in League 1.
Yes we have seven or even more players who proved themselves at championship level but my point is we need to strengthen in the forward positions to really have a chance of going up.
We must improve to move forward and I am sure Gareth will do exactly that and we will add attacking options either through signings or loans.
How was he useful even in League 1? Was it one goal and a couple of assists?