I suspect there is little doubt why Derby adopted this policy as you suggest @carrickblue.
I doubt the auditor would have instructed the method but he may well have suggested it as an option. Pretty sure it would have been discussed with him before accounts were presented for audit. Frankly don't think its overly relevant.
As for your what is needed nows
(1) is desirable but probably only achievable if a decision is reached to stick with positions as they are. If a points deduction is to be imposed which relegates Derby, the EFL have to follow exactly the process laid out in their rules and that may take time. Its unfortunate but if they bend their rules, they would be liable to legal challenge.
2) yes - but once they do highly likely that creative clubs wishing to bend the FFP rules will try to think of other creative ways around them that the EFL in defining the rules haven't thought of and banned.
3) yes of course,but if specifically banned, highly unlikely that any club would break that element of the rules.
Realistically given that it is 29 June, must be highly unlikely that our next competitive match will not be Accrington.
92.5 The Disciplinary Commission shall have the power to abridge the time period set out in Regulation 94.3 (time limits for appeal) if there is a compelling reason why the appeal (if any) needs to be concluded expeditiously.
So there is provision to reduce the 14 day norm without bending the rules.
Not sure it is as much the time to appeal (surely Derby will not, EFL may, not sure if we have legal standing to get involved) as time to actually hear the appeal that is the problem. Anyway we'll see soon enough how this develops.
Simon Stone @sistoney67
Written reasons yet to be published in @dcfcofficial
case, so EFL not in a position to lodge an appeal against £100k fine. They (or Derby for that matter) will have 14 days to appeal once they have seen the reasons. @wwfcofficial
watching on.
Does the below mean the club are confident of L1? Either that or it will make for some stunning ironic memorabilia as we play in the Champo while following Derby's schedule on our mugs...
@Shev said:
Does the below mean the club are confident of L1? Either that or it will make for some stunning ironic memorabilia as we play in the Champo while following Derby's schedule on our mugs...
@Shev said:
Does the below mean the club are confident of L1? Either that or it will make for some stunning ironic memorabilia as we play in the Champo while following Derby's schedule on our mugs...
Bottom line is that, the reason the EFL haven't yet been able to appeal the £100K fine is because the written reasons haven't been published?
One they are then there is a 14 day period in which an appeal can be lodged.
It's like they don't think there is any need to expedite things along. Astonishing.
Given dirty Leeds were fined £200,000 for snooping on a single Derby County training session, a £100,000 fine for what Derby have done is not exactly proportionate.
Just reading a theory that the league could swap us in the Championship a few games in to the season? Had never thought the interchangeable list was that interchangeable.
Trying to think of positive things about this horrible mess and I have two.
If the club plans for Championship football it won't harm us in League One.
The incredible delays must surely lead to a good chance of some financial settlement even if the league cling on the Wayne Rooney's Derby.
One downside I am thinking about is that the delay does damage to Derby and actually could force them out of business.
@Right_in_the_Middle said:
If the club plans for Championship football it won't harm us in League One.
Except it's just as likely we'll make plans for League 1, maybe even have to agree to Ikpeazu leaving. Then find ourselves "promoted" to Championship with a Lg1 squad and spend another year struggling to compete as well as we might.
Alternatively we decline to Ikpeazu leaving because the release clause might not be applicable, and/or suitors get tired of the uncertainty, then we are relegated and he's lost his chance of Championship football.
Either possibility is equally distasteful and it's all of the EFL and DCs making. We need certainty NOW - frankly I'd happily take Lg1 now rather than not knowing for another 5/6 weeks.
Even if we’d allowed Uche Ikpeazu to leave, @Twizz, I am sure the present squad (with a few re-enforcements, including a replacement for Uche) would be competitive in the Championship. No way would they lose the first seven matches.
@Right_in_the_Middle said:
If the club plans for Championship football it won't harm us in League One.
Except it's just as likely we'll make plans for League 1, maybe even have to agree to Ikpeazu leaving. Then find ourselves "promoted" to Championship with a Lg1 squad and spend another year struggling to compete as well as we might.
Alternatively we decline to Ikpeazu leaving because the release clause might not be applicable, and/or suitors get tired of the uncertainty, then we are relegated and he's lost his chance of Championship football.
Either possibility is equally distasteful and it's all of the EFL and DCs making. We need certainty NOW - frankly I'd happily take Lg1 now rather than not knowing for another 5/6 weeks.
Aren't we .....
planning as a Championship club? (Gareth talking to sponsors on fixture release day)
Not selling Uche unless we get truckload of cash (Couhig at the Trust meeting)
Not got any players contracted with relegation clauses (Couhig again)
For what it's worth, a friend of mine who has friends within Derby's first team squad tells me they are all very concerned. The club aren't telling them anything, most of them think they're destined for League One this summer as a result and, given most of them have contracts which include significant pay cuts for relegation, they're almost in open mutiny. Wayne Rooney is being kept away from media over the Euros as they don't want him getting questions on Derby's plight...
Wonder how it would sit legally with player wage reductions if Derby were relegated for this rule break / technicality, as opposed to the players being crap and getting them relegated.
@Malone said:
Wonder how it would sit legally with player wage reductions if Derby were relegated for this rule break / technicality, as opposed to the players being crap and getting them relegated.
How are Sheff We’d working it? They would have stayed up without the points deduction
I do think this delay is damaging for Derby to a point they might not survive
Comments
@micra
Please do not pick up on the wrong placements of commas in my post above ?
Awful thread this
I suspect there is little doubt why Derby adopted this policy as you suggest @carrickblue.
I doubt the auditor would have instructed the method but he may well have suggested it as an option. Pretty sure it would have been discussed with him before accounts were presented for audit. Frankly don't think its overly relevant.
As for your what is needed nows
(1) is desirable but probably only achievable if a decision is reached to stick with positions as they are. If a points deduction is to be imposed which relegates Derby, the EFL have to follow exactly the process laid out in their rules and that may take time. Its unfortunate but if they bend their rules, they would be liable to legal challenge.
2) yes - but once they do highly likely that creative clubs wishing to bend the FFP rules will try to think of other creative ways around them that the EFL in defining the rules haven't thought of and banned.
3) yes of course,but if specifically banned, highly unlikely that any club would break that element of the rules.
Realistically given that it is 29 June, must be highly unlikely that our next competitive match will not be Accrington.
@DevC
EFL rules
92.5 The Disciplinary Commission shall have the power to abridge the time period set out in Regulation 94.3 (time limits for appeal) if there is a compelling reason why the appeal (if any) needs to be concluded expeditiously.
So there is provision to reduce the 14 day norm without bending the rules.
Not sure it is as much the time to appeal (surely Derby will not, EFL may, not sure if we have legal standing to get involved) as time to actually hear the appeal that is the problem. Anyway we'll see soon enough how this develops.
Conversation
Simon Stone
@sistoney67
Written reasons yet to be published in
@dcfcofficial
case, so EFL not in a position to lodge an appeal against £100k fine. They (or Derby for that matter) will have 14 days to appeal once they have seen the reasons.
@wwfcofficial
watching on.
Draft minutes from Thursday's Trust Board meeting have now been posted to the WWT website. These contain our transcript of what Rob Couhig said to members that night and the answers he gave to various questions.
https://wycombewandererstrust.com/2021/06/trust-board-meeting-thursday-24th-june
Does the below mean the club are confident of L1? Either that or it will make for some stunning ironic memorabilia as we play in the Champo while following Derby's schedule on our mugs...
https://www.wycombewanderers.co.uk/news/2021/june/order-your-202122-fixtures-mug/
If Derby do get a points deduction I will happily buy one of these to send to Alan Swan
I imagine he’d spit a cupful of tea out when the news came through
As if Alan Swann drinks tea
He survives on a diet of freshly squeezed lemon juice is my understanding
Nothing aromatic about Alan - he carries the aroma of opprobrium and stale scotch eggs about him wherever he goes.
Ashamed to say I had to look 'opprobrium' up, the entomology reminded me of this:
I may have missed this and it's already been stated, but Google has just prompted me to read this:-
https://footballleagueworld.co.uk/fresh-update-emerges-concerning-efl-derby-case-amid-ongoing-threat-of-relegation/amp/
Bottom line is that, the reason the EFL haven't yet been able to appeal the £100K fine is because the written reasons haven't been published?
One they are then there is a 14 day period in which an appeal can be lodged.
It's like they don't think there is any need to expedite things along. Astonishing.
If they are not careful they will lose credibility
Shouldn't there be a deadline for publishing the reasons? Absurd!
Given dirty Leeds were fined £200,000 for snooping on a single Derby County training session, a £100,000 fine for what Derby have done is not exactly proportionate.
Just reading a theory that the league could swap us in the Championship a few games in to the season? Had never thought the interchangeable list was that interchangeable.
Trying to think of positive things about this horrible mess and I have two.
If the club plans for Championship football it won't harm us in League One.
The incredible delays must surely lead to a good chance of some financial settlement even if the league cling on the Wayne Rooney's Derby.
One downside I am thinking about is that the delay does damage to Derby and actually could force them out of business.
It's a ridiculous situation for both clubs.
Except it's just as likely we'll make plans for League 1, maybe even have to agree to Ikpeazu leaving. Then find ourselves "promoted" to Championship with a Lg1 squad and spend another year struggling to compete as well as we might.
Alternatively we decline to Ikpeazu leaving because the release clause might not be applicable, and/or suitors get tired of the uncertainty, then we are relegated and he's lost his chance of Championship football.
Either possibility is equally distasteful and it's all of the EFL and DCs making. We need certainty NOW - frankly I'd happily take Lg1 now rather than not knowing for another 5/6 weeks.
I would NOT take League 1 now.
This not a problem we have caused.
Why should we suffer?
Why indeed @NiceCarrots.
Even if we’d allowed Uche Ikpeazu to leave, @Twizz, I am sure the present squad (with a few re-enforcements, including a replacement for Uche) would be competitive in the Championship. No way would they lose the first seven matches.
Aren't we .....
planning as a Championship club? (Gareth talking to sponsors on fixture release day)
Not selling Uche unless we get truckload of cash (Couhig at the Trust meeting)
Not got any players contracted with relegation clauses (Couhig again)
If all three are true it's ok isn't it?
England win, Murray win, Wanderers back in the Championship - what a week this would be. Might have to wait a bit longer for the latter.
For what it's worth, a friend of mine who has friends within Derby's first team squad tells me they are all very concerned. The club aren't telling them anything, most of them think they're destined for League One this summer as a result and, given most of them have contracts which include significant pay cuts for relegation, they're almost in open mutiny. Wayne Rooney is being kept away from media over the Euros as they don't want him getting questions on Derby's plight...
Derby also seem to be releasing a number of the few players they’ve got too (see their Twitter feed). Including Jordon Ibe.
Wonder how it would sit legally with player wage reductions if Derby were relegated for this rule break / technicality, as opposed to the players being crap and getting them relegated.
How are Sheff We’d working it? They would have stayed up without the points deduction
I do think this delay is damaging for Derby to a point they might not survive