@eric_plant said:
I don't really understand why people are having a go at the EFL. They wanted a harsher punishment but have had to reluctantly concede that they have no grounds for appeal
Spot on.
Surely it’s the league who set the rules that the independent panel have judge the crime against? If those rules can’t get a suitable punishment they are not fit for purpose.
The final poor decision in a season of poor decisions
League 1 probably allows us to build a bit better and come up in style.
If we were to have been granted last min access to the championship, having lost those key players, I think it'd be a big ask to get us going any quicker than the start of last season.
Completely agree @carrickblue I want us to get back into the Championship (watched by our great fans) in such a fashion that no-one will be able to moan about it even if it really irritates them. Staying up would have been nice but it would not have felt fully deserved. We just need to capitalise on the advantages it has afforded us for the new season.
Regardless of the outcome, they’re in no way out of the woods just yet. Us, on the other hand - we are a club on the up with great owners, an incredible management team and a dedicated group of players. Will we be back in the second tier anytime soon? Who knows, but it doesn’t matter, because at least we’re not Derby County.
@eric_plant said:
I don't really understand why people are having a go at the EFL. They wanted a harsher punishment but have had to reluctantly concede that they have no grounds for appeal
Spot on.
Surely it’s the league who set the rules that the independent panel have judge the crime against? If those rules can’t get a suitable punishment they are not fit for purpose.
The final poor decision in a season of poor decisions
I agree the EFL are not fit for purpose - I just don't blame the outcome of this scenario on them as much as I do the independent panel. I would guess the EFL very much wanted to relegate Derby.
The outstanding question for me is whether we go after the EFL for compensation for the difficult position we (and Derby - but that is more there fault) have been put in by the doubts the EFL encouraged over what league we should be in.
I think that there is a moral case for us to do so whereas going after Derby for potential loss of earning is just wrong (in my opinion)
@bookertease said:
The outstanding question for me is whether we go after the EFL for compensation for the difficult position we (and Derby - but that is more there fault) have been put in by the doubts the EFL encouraged over what league we should be in.
I think that there is a moral case for us to do so whereas going after Derby for potential loss of earning is just wrong (in my opinion)
Surely the only possible case we would have had, is if the league took ages to deduct Derby points for the matter in hand, and that cost us staying up.
Now the league aren't even appealing the decision, surely it's a dead duck now.
@bookertease said:
The outstanding question for me is whether we go after the EFL for compensation for the difficult position we (and Derby - but that is more there fault) have been put in by the doubts the EFL encouraged over what league we should be in.
I think that there is a moral case for us to do so whereas going after Derby for potential loss of earning is just wrong (in my opinion)
I've always felt that going after Derby County for financial compensation was a non starter. What's the point in running up huge legal costs to win a court case then get told "yep, you win, but we've got no money to pay you anyway"? Might win the moral high ground, but bugger all else.
Can someone tell me if DCFC will be under a transfer embargo please.
I remember seeing on QI that when placed on an electroencephalograph, jelly gives off a reading that if emitted by the brain, would not qualify as sufficiently dead as to have its life support removed. It doesn't make jelly a viable life form, it's still just a bowl of wobbly slime.
Sounds much like the EFL to me.
Disappointed as I am with the result at least now we have certainty over which league we're playing in 21/22 season. We possibly have a better chance than Derby of playing in the Championship in 22/23 too.
It does amuse me that the derby fans are celebrating staying up like some kind of victory. Deep down they know it’s a stay of execution and a points deduction may be the least of their worries.
Just about scraping staying up on the pitch, and just about scraping to stay up off the pitch.
They won't be making any decent signings any time soon, and you'd imagine they'll get clocked with a decent points deduction when they inevitably fail the next accounts check.
So they're most likely in for a miserable season either way.
Good luck to them @TheAndyGrahamFanClub, it wasn’t the fans fault and I am sure we would have celebrated if the roles were reversed.
They are probably praying for a successful take over.
I know in these cases it's not the fans' fault, and there are numerous cases where owners gut clubs from within, but equally there are cases where fans are happy to see their club signing big, pushing for the Premier League dream or whatever, surely realising the financial hole they're digging for themselves and saying and doing nothing. At least until it's too late. I remember the disquiet among many Wycombe fans from early on in Steve Hayes' reign about where money was coming from and when or whether it would need paying back - hence the Black and White campaign.
I do recall John Gregory telling us time and again how Derby were a proper football club and how we should try and emulate their methods, daring to dream that one day we might be worthy of competing with them.
@floyd said:
The reason so many club owners get away with financial mismanagement is that supporters let them.
Short of voting with their feet en masse, what are supporters supposed to do?
I don’t know. But not celebrating and defending the reckless spending of their owners might be a start.
It’s a problem that the supporters themselves can’t solve. While the rewards for getting to the Premier League are so huge and the punishment for breaking the rules to improve the chance of getting there are so inconsequential it will always be a problem.
No Rams fan me...but the owner's not their fault. I doubt they enjoyed last season much and I cannot see that it looks like it will be much better for them next term.
It’s really difficult to feel any sympathy for Derby fans when your hobby is ready opposition fans forums. There are realists who see who is to blame for their situation but they are a tiny minority most are lauding it over the EFL and ourselves probably for Robs comments.
So while I commend the thumbs up all the best to them attitude of some on here don’t believe for a minute you’re getting it back
I find the DCFC fans attitude towards Mel Morris disingenuous - not all that log ago he was viewed as their saviour and now according to many he is the problem
@Erroll_Sims said:
I find the DCFC fans attitude towards Mel Morris disingenuous - not all that log ago he was viewed as their saviour and now according to many he is the problem
Surely opinions can change as the full story comes out though?
I'm sure I recall us having an owner once who looked a marvel, then it panned out that maybe it wasn't that marvellous after all.
@floyd said:
The reason so many club owners get away with financial mismanagement is that supporters let them.
@floyd said:
The reason so many club owners get away with financial mismanagement is that supporters let them.
This is a point I was making when Wycombe supporters decided to overwhelmingly vote through giving the club away to a man with no obvious well of income, no clear business plan and barely any accountability. Maybe it will work out ok. But if it doesn't, @aloysius will be saying he told you so...
@floyd said:
The reason so many club owners get away with financial mismanagement is that supporters let them.
@floyd said:
The reason so many club owners get away with financial mismanagement is that supporters let them.
This is a point I was making when Wycombe supporters decided to overwhelmingly vote through giving the club away to a man with no obvious well of income, no clear business plan and barely any accountability. Maybe it will work out ok. But if it doesn't, @aloysius will be saying he told you so...
You certainly weren’t alone there, but we were in a significant minority.
Comments
Surely it’s the league who set the rules that the independent panel have judge the crime against? If those rules can’t get a suitable punishment they are not fit for purpose.
The final poor decision in a season of poor decisions
Yep, the last line is key @carrickblue.
League 1 probably allows us to build a bit better and come up in style.
If we were to have been granted last min access to the championship, having lost those key players, I think it'd be a big ask to get us going any quicker than the start of last season.
Completely agree @carrickblue I want us to get back into the Championship (watched by our great fans) in such a fashion that no-one will be able to moan about it even if it really irritates them. Staying up would have been nice but it would not have felt fully deserved. We just need to capitalise on the advantages it has afforded us for the new season.
Regardless of the outcome, they’re in no way out of the woods just yet. Us, on the other hand - we are a club on the up with great owners, an incredible management team and a dedicated group of players. Will we be back in the second tier anytime soon? Who knows, but it doesn’t matter, because at least we’re not Derby County.
Brilliant @Gary.
I agree the EFL are not fit for purpose - I just don't blame the outcome of this scenario on them as much as I do the independent panel. I would guess the EFL very much wanted to relegate Derby.
The outstanding question for me is whether we go after the EFL for compensation for the difficult position we (and Derby - but that is more there fault) have been put in by the doubts the EFL encouraged over what league we should be in.
I think that there is a moral case for us to do so whereas going after Derby for potential loss of earning is just wrong (in my opinion)
Surely the only possible case we would have had, is if the league took ages to deduct Derby points for the matter in hand, and that cost us staying up.
Now the league aren't even appealing the decision, surely it's a dead duck now.
Any future accounts review is a separate issue.
I've always felt that going after Derby County for financial compensation was a non starter. What's the point in running up huge legal costs to win a court case then get told "yep, you win, but we've got no money to pay you anyway"? Might win the moral high ground, but bugger all else.
Can someone tell me if DCFC will be under a transfer embargo please.
Until they file accounts for 2019 they are
Derby is a zombie football club financially dead but still moving kept alive by nefarious methods let’s leave them lurch off to their next crisis
I remember seeing on QI that when placed on an electroencephalograph, jelly gives off a reading that if emitted by the brain, would not qualify as sufficiently dead as to have its life support removed. It doesn't make jelly a viable life form, it's still just a bowl of wobbly slime.
Sounds much like the EFL to me.
Disappointed as I am with the result at least now we have certainty over which league we're playing in 21/22 season. We possibly have a better chance than Derby of playing in the Championship in 22/23 too.
It does amuse me that the derby fans are celebrating staying up like some kind of victory. Deep down they know it’s a stay of execution and a points deduction may be the least of their worries.
Just about scraping staying up on the pitch, and just about scraping to stay up off the pitch.
They won't be making any decent signings any time soon, and you'd imagine they'll get clocked with a decent points deduction when they inevitably fail the next accounts check.
So they're most likely in for a miserable season either way.
Good luck to them @TheAndyGrahamFanClub, it wasn’t the fans fault and I am sure we would have celebrated if the roles were reversed.
They are probably praying for a successful take over.
I know in these cases it's not the fans' fault, and there are numerous cases where owners gut clubs from within, but equally there are cases where fans are happy to see their club signing big, pushing for the Premier League dream or whatever, surely realising the financial hole they're digging for themselves and saying and doing nothing. At least until it's too late. I remember the disquiet among many Wycombe fans from early on in Steve Hayes' reign about where money was coming from and when or whether it would need paying back - hence the Black and White campaign.
Seeing a lot of their fans comments online and in particular towards us, I say stuff em
I can’t imagine many fans forums being so graceful to them as the Gasroom.
If they want to laud it, leave them to it.
I do recall John Gregory telling us time and again how Derby were a proper football club and how we should try and emulate their methods, daring to dream that one day we might be worthy of competing with them.
Those days are certainly over!
The reason so many club owners get away with financial mismanagement is that supporters let them.
Short of voting with their feet en masse, what are supporters supposed to do?
I don’t know. But not celebrating and defending the reckless spending of their owners might be a start.
It’s a problem that the supporters themselves can’t solve. While the rewards for getting to the Premier League are so huge and the punishment for breaking the rules to improve the chance of getting there are so inconsequential it will always be a problem.
No Rams fan me...but the owner's not their fault. I doubt they enjoyed last season much and I cannot see that it looks like it will be much better for them next term.
Well it will be even more sweet now when we go up and they go down ??????
It’s really difficult to feel any sympathy for Derby fans when your hobby is ready opposition fans forums. There are realists who see who is to blame for their situation but they are a tiny minority most are lauding it over the EFL and ourselves probably for Robs comments.
So while I commend the thumbs up all the best to them attitude of some on here don’t believe for a minute you’re getting it back
It worked for Blaackpool fans
I find the DCFC fans attitude towards Mel Morris disingenuous - not all that log ago he was viewed as their saviour and now according to many he is the problem
Surely opinions can change as the full story comes out though?
I'm sure I recall us having an owner once who looked a marvel, then it panned out that maybe it wasn't that marvellous after all.
This is a point I was making when Wycombe supporters decided to overwhelmingly vote through giving the club away to a man with no obvious well of income, no clear business plan and barely any accountability. Maybe it will work out ok. But if it doesn't, @aloysius will be saying he told you so...
You certainly weren’t alone there, but we were in a significant minority.