Maybe they could go halves with Oxford for a new ground somewhere around Warwick. Maybe merge and call themselves the Thames Valley Rams or something. A homage to a previous owner.
To be brutally honest the council tax payers of Derby or any other council area really do not want their council being a commercial landlord, especially as pretty much every other time it has happened it has ended in tears. Councils should stick to what they know & understand.
Lucky we never had the sort of people at our club who would run the finances into the ground and end up accidentally owning former club assets. No, wait ...
@Ed_ said:
Lucky we never had the sort of people at our club who would run the finances into the ground and end up accidentally owning former club assets. No, wait ...
Some of them will be sitting in the soft seats in the middle on the 21st. They have positions at our club that they should be ashamed of. Any good they did, in the early years, were ruined when they supported and encouraged SH and “the wasps”. We are here DESPITE you, not because of you.
The Couhigs are class compared to those so called Grandees.
I cannot comprehend why these people are allowed anywhere near the club, let alone on the pitch and boardroom. They should be called out as self-seeking carpetbaggers and sent into exile. How the fans put up with this without protest while TGF robbed a Community Benefit Society under the noses of and in plain sight of the Trust board and fans beggars belief.
The Wagatha Christie stuff shouldn't be funny but from the picture of Wazza on the court steps looking like he'd been dragged away from the Champions League final to go to the gardening centre it kind of is. Shameful publicists conjuring up fake outrage, doubt it would get anywhere near a courtroom if they weren't minted and nobody will benefit from it whatever is found.
Re the training ground. It's owned by the Stevenson family and DCFC has a longish lease on it.
Some people are questioning why the Council would even want to help by buying the ground and leasing it with a view to selling it back to the club in 3 to 5 years. Anything, a football club included, is worth what someone is willing to pay. It appears CK has come up with a figure for now and the next 2 years running costs which he is prepared to pay. He's looking, apparently, to lease Pride Park in first instance and then buy. The Council is looking at the wider picture. Losing 23 home games a season will cost local businesses a lot of money. Bars, restaurants, shops, fast food outlets..... That would see more people losing their jobs, reduce the amount of custom in the town and see job losses. That's why they are considering the buy/short lease/sell option. I was talking to a few landlords over the weekend and they were all talking six figure losses if there are no League games in the City next season. Despite the dog's breakfast MM has made of it, local businesses still rely heavily on "football traffic".
I'll be quite happy with midtable mediocrity next season which, if the sale isn't completed in the next week and a half, would be the best we could hope for. Ho hum, it is what it is and I, for one, accept that.
With regard to WWFC, congratulations on reaching Wembley. Can you beat the Black Cats? I hope you do. Any road up, enjoy the day.
Lastly, I'd like to thank you all again for the reasonable conversations we've had on here, much appreciated.
Losing 23 home games a season will cost local businesses a lot of money.
I take it you're just trolling now? Because those local businesses aren't getting paid by Derby. They'll be better off if you cease to exist and stop failing to pay your bills.
"Some people are questioning why the Council would even want to help by buying the ground"
Not sure this is true either, they are questioning whether it's the best use of the council's money and that's something different. The option of HMRC seizing it from Morris and then either selling or renting it to Kirchner is more attractive.
@Raminpeace said:
I'll be quite happy with midtable mediocrity next season which, if the sale isn't completed in the next week and a half, would be the best we could hope for. Ho hum, it is what it is and I, for one, accept that.
You should be pleased if the club even exists in three months.
@Raminpeace I think we all enjoy a reasoned conversation with you as clearly you are across the issues and can see both sides. I am still staggered by some of your fan's attitude and lack of contrition over the matters though. I have seen demands that the council buy the ground. A council that is owed council tax by the club they are being expected to save. And it is all too easy to say that money used to nationalise Pride Park won't impact local services - until it does. If I was a local rate payer and learnt that my library was being closed but Pride Park had been bailed out regardless of the truth the optics are terrible. And let's face it CK I am sure is looking for a deal that favours CK and not the library customers of Derby.
Your fans (present company excepted) at the first sniff of CK coming in were already rattling off their shopping list of players that they want through the door (some incredible targets, although not on a par with Dele Alli) and were planning the route of their title winning parade next February. I don't want you to go out of business, but I do want your fans to have a reality check.
Losing 23 home games a season will cost local businesses a lot of money.
I take it you're just trolling now? Because those local businesses aren't getting paid by Derby. They'll be better off if you cease to exist and stop failing to pay your bills.
Absolutely not Doc. As with any insolvency case, creditors will lose out. Whether that's a sheep farm or a furniture factory, it's always the same. Also applies to football clubs which are Limited Companies. As I've said previously, I'd be happier if every got paid everything they are owed. It's not going to happen in this insolvency case either. What will happen is that Quantuma will have got the highest possible return for the creditors. Liquidate the club and creditors would get less. Unsatisfactory, yes, but still the best deal the creditors are going to get. Again, unfortunately, some of the smaller businesses may got to the wall. The businesses to which I referred in the post to which you replied are businesses not, to the best of my knowledge, currently owed a penny by DCFC. I refer to 2 pub landlords I know, both of whom would be >£100K a year down. More pubs would lose a lot as well. Idem ditto restaurants, chippies and fast food franchises. Less footfall in the shopping centre on matchday..... They would also be in danger of closure or staff redundancies should there be no DCFC. The outcome of the current deal, should it go through, and that's not guaranteed, isn't anything close to ideal but at least it won't mean even more businesses and their staff hitting trouble. Do you think the perfect solution exists Doc? The deal on the table gives creditors 35% which is better than nothing but that's about the only good thing about it as it stands. No great comfort to the creditors who won’t get the 100% they deserve but it is a comfort to all the other businesses which would be negatively impacted should the club fold. The obvious perfect solution would be to have all debts fully paid up. As I said, liquidating the club would see creditors getting even less than they currently would and would have the added complication of taking pubs and other businesses down as well, businesses not owed a penny by DCFC. Not ideal but the best they are going to get. Should this deal go through, I’d fully expect companies to require cash up front. Totally understandable. Hopefully the EFL rules will now change ASAP to stop this happening again to any club and its suppliers.
A case in point. When we played at the Baseball Ground, the area around the ground contained a lot of pubs and chippies. Close the BBG and move to the other side of the City and what happened? They've all gone. Liquidating DCFC would see more closures in the City.
Losing 23 home games a season will cost local businesses a lot of money.
I take it you're just trolling now? Because those local businesses aren't getting paid by Derby. They'll be better off if you cease to exist and stop failing to pay your bills.
Absolutely not Doc. As with any insolvency case, creditors will lose out. Whether that's a sheep farm or a furniture factory, it's always the same. Also applies to football clubs which are Limited Companies. As I've said previously, I'd be happier if every got paid everything they are owed. It's not going to happen in this insolvency case either. What will happen is that Quantuma will have got the highest possible return for the creditors. Liquidate the club and creditors would get less. Unsatisfactory, yes, but still the best deal the creditors are going to get. Again, unfortunately, some of the smaller businesses may got to the wall. The businesses to which I referred in the post to which you replied are businesses not, to the best of my knowledge, currently owed a penny by DCFC. I refer to 2 pub landlords I know, both of whom would be >£100K a year down. More pubs would lose a lot as well. Idem ditto restaurants, chippies and fast food franchises. Less footfall in the shopping centre on matchday..... They would also be in danger of closure or staff redundancies should there be no DCFC. The outcome of the current deal, should it go through, and that's not guaranteed, isn't anything close to ideal but at least it won't mean even more businesses and their staff hitting trouble. Do you think the perfect solution exists Doc? The deal on the table gives creditors 35% which is better than nothing but that's about the only good thing about it as it stands. No great comfort to the creditors who won’t get the 100% they deserve but it is a comfort to all the other businesses which would be negatively impacted should the club fold. The obvious perfect solution would be to have all debts fully paid up. As I said, liquidating the club would see creditors getting even less than they currently would and would have the added complication of taking pubs and other businesses down as well, businesses not owed a penny by DCFC. Not ideal but the best they are going to get. Should this deal go through, I’d fully expect companies to require cash up front. Totally understandable. Hopefully the EFL rules will now change ASAP to stop this happening again to any club and its suppliers.
"Again, unfortunately, some of the smaller businesses may got to the wall."
I know, so unfortunate for them. And their employees, and their families, but hey, what can you do, eh? As long as Wayne gets his 40 new players and the fans get the big name stars they've been talking about, everyone's happy.
Well, except the poor sods who lose their living and stuff. But y'know, omelettes and eggs...
I haven’t seen an apology from the club to anyone who has been affected by the whole litany of failings that have taken place, so all this talk of concern for creditors and the impact on local businesses of Derby failing is just a lot of hot air.
Losing 23 home games a season will cost local businesses a lot of money.
I take it you're just trolling now? Because those local businesses aren't getting paid by Derby. They'll be better off if you cease to exist and stop failing to pay your bills.
Absolutely not Doc. As with any insolvency case, creditors will lose out. Whether that's a sheep farm or a furniture factory, it's always the same. Also applies to football clubs which are Limited Companies. As I've said previously, I'd be happier if every got paid everything they are owed. It's not going to happen in this insolvency case either. What will happen is that Quantuma will have got the highest possible return for the creditors. Liquidate the club and creditors would get less. Unsatisfactory, yes, but still the best deal the creditors are going to get. Again, unfortunately, some of the smaller businesses may got to the wall. The businesses to which I referred in the post to which you replied are businesses not, to the best of my knowledge, currently owed a penny by DCFC. I refer to 2 pub landlords I know, both of whom would be >£100K a year down. More pubs would lose a lot as well. Idem ditto restaurants, chippies and fast food franchises. Less footfall in the shopping centre on matchday..... They would also be in danger of closure or staff redundancies should there be no DCFC. The outcome of the current deal, should it go through, and that's not guaranteed, isn't anything close to ideal but at least it won't mean even more businesses and their staff hitting trouble. Do you think the perfect solution exists Doc? The deal on the table gives creditors 35% which is better than nothing but that's about the only good thing about it as it stands. No great comfort to the creditors who won’t get the 100% they deserve but it is a comfort to all the other businesses which would be negatively impacted should the club fold. The obvious perfect solution would be to have all debts fully paid up. As I said, liquidating the club would see creditors getting even less than they currently would and would have the added complication of taking pubs and other businesses down as well, businesses not owed a penny by DCFC. Not ideal but the best they are going to get. Should this deal go through, I’d fully expect companies to require cash up front. Totally understandable. Hopefully the EFL rules will now change ASAP to stop this happening again to any club and its suppliers.
They need to get a move on as they are raking up costs. If it goes tits up this will be deducted from anything that can be recovered. This is the administrator's job, although they seem to be doing the opposite.
How anyone can believe pledges or have any faith that they'll be able to complete the next season I have no idea and they'll need to provide some assurances soon.
Comments
Maybe they could go halves with Oxford for a new ground somewhere around Warwick. Maybe merge and call themselves the Thames Valley Rams or something. A homage to a previous owner.
a) I have zero confidence in any council to make a transaction of this nature work in favour of the tax payer (ie their employer). Northampton anyone ? https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11739/12335831/northampton-town-seven-charged-over-disappearance-of-10m-loan-for-east-stand-at-sixfields-stadium#:~:text=PEC Zwolle-,Northampton Town: Seven charged over disappearance of £10m loan,East Stand at Sixfields Stadium&text=Six men and a woman,loan to Northampton Town FC.
b) They are doing this to be populist
c) No council should do this unless there is a clear business case to do that has ZERO and I mean ZERO impact on other council services, otherwise you are nationalising Derby County
d) WHY THE FCUK SHOULD THEY DO THIS WHEN SOME RICH BLOKE COULD PAY IT HIMSELF?
It’s going to be much harder to grease palms at the council after last night too.
To be brutally honest the council tax payers of Derby or any other council area really do not want their council being a commercial landlord, especially as pretty much every other time it has happened it has ended in tears. Councils should stick to what they know & understand.
Aren't you a West Ham fan?
DCFC the disaster that doesnt stop giving....
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/61371213
Getting boring now
Maybe buying the ground from your club at an inflated price wasn't that clever
I rest my case. The London stadium is a disgrace. The funding of it is a disgrace. People should have gone to prison over that.
Maybe selling the ground to your owner at an inflated price wasn't that clever
Lucky we never had the sort of people at our club who would run the finances into the ground and end up accidentally owning former club assets. No, wait ...
Some of them will be sitting in the soft seats in the middle on the 21st. They have positions at our club that they should be ashamed of. Any good they did, in the early years, were ruined when they supported and encouraged SH and “the wasps”. We are here DESPITE you, not because of you.
The Couhigs are class compared to those so called Grandees.
I cannot comprehend why these people are allowed anywhere near the club, let alone on the pitch and boardroom. They should be called out as self-seeking carpetbaggers and sent into exile. How the fans put up with this without protest while TGF robbed a Community Benefit Society under the noses of and in plain sight of the Trust board and fans beggars belief.
The Wagatha Christie stuff shouldn't be funny but from the picture of Wazza on the court steps looking like he'd been dragged away from the Champions League final to go to the gardening centre it kind of is. Shameful publicists conjuring up fake outrage, doubt it would get anywhere near a courtroom if they weren't minted and nobody will benefit from it whatever is found.
Re the training ground. It's owned by the Stevenson family and DCFC has a longish lease on it.
Some people are questioning why the Council would even want to help by buying the ground and leasing it with a view to selling it back to the club in 3 to 5 years. Anything, a football club included, is worth what someone is willing to pay. It appears CK has come up with a figure for now and the next 2 years running costs which he is prepared to pay. He's looking, apparently, to lease Pride Park in first instance and then buy. The Council is looking at the wider picture. Losing 23 home games a season will cost local businesses a lot of money. Bars, restaurants, shops, fast food outlets..... That would see more people losing their jobs, reduce the amount of custom in the town and see job losses. That's why they are considering the buy/short lease/sell option. I was talking to a few landlords over the weekend and they were all talking six figure losses if there are no League games in the City next season. Despite the dog's breakfast MM has made of it, local businesses still rely heavily on "football traffic".
I'll be quite happy with midtable mediocrity next season which, if the sale isn't completed in the next week and a half, would be the best we could hope for. Ho hum, it is what it is and I, for one, accept that.
With regard to WWFC, congratulations on reaching Wembley. Can you beat the Black Cats? I hope you do. Any road up, enjoy the day.
Lastly, I'd like to thank you all again for the reasonable conversations we've had on here, much appreciated.
I take it you're just trolling now? Because those local businesses aren't getting paid by Derby. They'll be better off if you cease to exist and stop failing to pay your bills.
"Some people are questioning why the Council would even want to help by buying the ground"
Not sure this is true either, they are questioning whether it's the best use of the council's money and that's something different. The option of HMRC seizing it from Morris and then either selling or renting it to Kirchner is more attractive.
You should be pleased if the club even exists in three months.
@Raminpeace I think we all enjoy a reasoned conversation with you as clearly you are across the issues and can see both sides. I am still staggered by some of your fan's attitude and lack of contrition over the matters though. I have seen demands that the council buy the ground. A council that is owed council tax by the club they are being expected to save. And it is all too easy to say that money used to nationalise Pride Park won't impact local services - until it does. If I was a local rate payer and learnt that my library was being closed but Pride Park had been bailed out regardless of the truth the optics are terrible. And let's face it CK I am sure is looking for a deal that favours CK and not the library customers of Derby.
Your fans (present company excepted) at the first sniff of CK coming in were already rattling off their shopping list of players that they want through the door (some incredible targets, although not on a par with Dele Alli) and were planning the route of their title winning parade next February. I don't want you to go out of business, but I do want your fans to have a reality check.
I see to recall the council coughing up for a stadium was not popular round our way.
I come back to this point again and again. It's easy to say we'd behave exactly the same if we were in Derby's position. But we were, and we didn't.
Absolutely not Doc. As with any insolvency case, creditors will lose out. Whether that's a sheep farm or a furniture factory, it's always the same. Also applies to football clubs which are Limited Companies. As I've said previously, I'd be happier if every got paid everything they are owed. It's not going to happen in this insolvency case either. What will happen is that Quantuma will have got the highest possible return for the creditors. Liquidate the club and creditors would get less. Unsatisfactory, yes, but still the best deal the creditors are going to get. Again, unfortunately, some of the smaller businesses may got to the wall. The businesses to which I referred in the post to which you replied are businesses not, to the best of my knowledge, currently owed a penny by DCFC. I refer to 2 pub landlords I know, both of whom would be >£100K a year down. More pubs would lose a lot as well. Idem ditto restaurants, chippies and fast food franchises. Less footfall in the shopping centre on matchday..... They would also be in danger of closure or staff redundancies should there be no DCFC. The outcome of the current deal, should it go through, and that's not guaranteed, isn't anything close to ideal but at least it won't mean even more businesses and their staff hitting trouble. Do you think the perfect solution exists Doc? The deal on the table gives creditors 35% which is better than nothing but that's about the only good thing about it as it stands. No great comfort to the creditors who won’t get the 100% they deserve but it is a comfort to all the other businesses which would be negatively impacted should the club fold. The obvious perfect solution would be to have all debts fully paid up. As I said, liquidating the club would see creditors getting even less than they currently would and would have the added complication of taking pubs and other businesses down as well, businesses not owed a penny by DCFC. Not ideal but the best they are going to get. Should this deal go through, I’d fully expect companies to require cash up front. Totally understandable. Hopefully the EFL rules will now change ASAP to stop this happening again to any club and its suppliers.
A case in point. When we played at the Baseball Ground, the area around the ground contained a lot of pubs and chippies. Close the BBG and move to the other side of the City and what happened? They've all gone. Liquidating DCFC would see more closures in the City.
Parklife.
"Again, unfortunately, some of the smaller businesses may got to the wall."
I know, so unfortunate for them. And their employees, and their families, but hey, what can you do, eh? As long as Wayne gets his 40 new players and the fans get the big name stars they've been talking about, everyone's happy.
Well, except the poor sods who lose their living and stuff. But y'know, omelettes and eggs...
I haven’t seen an apology from the club to anyone who has been affected by the whole litany of failings that have taken place, so all this talk of concern for creditors and the impact on local businesses of Derby failing is just a lot of hot air.
I'm sure DCFC will be more than happy to pay off the other 65% of their debt before ever paying another transfer fee.
They need to get a move on as they are raking up costs. If it goes tits up this will be deducted from anything that can be recovered. This is the administrator's job, although they seem to be doing the opposite.
How anyone can believe pledges or have any faith that they'll be able to complete the next season I have no idea and they'll need to provide some assurances soon.