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Match day thread: Fleetwood

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  • I don’t think we can be too hard on Gazs tactics. I can see what he’s tried to do. Joey Barton teams tend to play football and he’s looked to put out a team to match them.

    Problem we’ve had for the last couple of seasons is lack of midfielder who can run a game. Pattison was that signing, but apart from the Bolton game against a bunch of 17 year olds he not really added anything.

    Double edged sword he needs more games but clearly isn’t ready. We’ve got enough firepower to match most league 1 teams, the issue is we can’t connect the dots in midfield. With the right playmaker the team would naturally evolve, without that the midfield will always be functional.

    To be fair it’s not a big deal if we finished outside play offs. We’d get smashed in the championship, at start of season I would have bitten for a top 10 finish. When all said and done bring a sustainable league 1 club is more important.

    See where the next couple of months take us, take stock of the squad in the summer and Gaz/Couhigs can work together to improve both the playing/non playing needs of the club.

  • Not sure many of ours would get in to a combined wyc/fleet 11 on that performance tbh.
    Actually apart from the early pass out I thought Allsopp did OK. Pretty dire performances from Samuel, Pattison and Freeman in particular.
    Fred looked cut above the rest but style is so hoofbally that do wonder what happens when Bayo retires. Sometimes living 200 miles plus away not a bad thing. Not sure I would want to watch that every week.

  • Like the man very much and have no issue with what he said.

    But that was absolute cack tonight.

  • If the definition of madness is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result, we'd be well on our way to the asylum tonight. Against such huge, solid defenders why constantly keep hoofing it up to the front three?

    Bringing Fred on earlier might have helped but overall that was a shocker of a team performance.

  • Dom Gape was excellent tonight.

    Fleetwood were a decent side let down by a nutcase of a manager. If they nulify his mood swings they'll be near the top soon.

    The ref was awful. Just plain awful

    It was cold

  • The tone was set with a bizarre, jittery few minutes from the defence at the start of the game. We look awful at the back without Darius, you never know what Sido's going to do next, and Rocky looks completely bereft of confidence one minute, but pulls off decent saves the next. Didn't think we looked too bad later on in the first half, we put a few moves together, and it was a cracking shot from Josh, but the second half was totally lacking any sort of quality, and we only really came to life again in stoppage time when it was too late.

  • I think @Right_in_the_Middle was the one who suggested we might have caused ourselves a problem with the keeping situation.
    I think he might be right.

    Would have to see that goal again but it looked the softest ever. Half down to the keeper. But then allssopp produced great work to stop it going 2-0 after the Stubati combo just totally bungling a simple ball soon after

  • Allsop’s head has absolutely gone after a good first half of the season.

    Yesterday’s performance just shows our lack of depth. The second string team are nowhere near good enough.

  • edited February 2020

    The spine of our side lost that. Right the way through the middle we were weak. In defence we look a shambles without Charles. Up front Samuel and Parker are great runners, chasing down every cause, but with little spark to create. The two centre mids were a real issue for me though, neither Gape nor Pattison looked like they knew how to pass a ball, preferring to treat it as an unexploded landmine, and getting it away asap.

    Also, McCarthy's first touch is consistently woeful, and we let Paddy Madden score the only goal Paddy Madden ever scores.

  • @Right_in_the_Middle said:
    Dom Gape was excellent tonight.

    Funny how people see things differently. I thought he was abysmal all night. Which is far from normal for him.

  • @Right_in_the_Middle said:
    Dom Gape was excellent tonight.

    Fleetwood were a decent side let down by a nutcase of a manager. If they nulify his mood swings they'll be near the top soon.

    The ref was awful. Just plain awful

    It was cold

    How do his mood swings impact their results?

  • Agree Gape had a rare poor game - as did Stewart.

  • I like Dom G, I like Thomo, I like Mr Wycombe, I like Nick F but I put our current predicament down to the lack of a creative midfielder. Nothing comes through the middle. The big miss in the window was a play maker. Watched some old highlights featuring Sam S in his pomp recently, oh how we need that missing element to run the show.
    Still, you play the hand you are dealt, on to the Wanderers derby.

  • To quote the great Martin O'Neill, Dom Gape was everywhere the ball had just been

  • That and not having the defence which made up for it for two months now.

  • how bad was that linesman on the main stand side by the way?

  • Play parker as a number 10, the man oozes class on the ball he's the creative player we crave for!!!!

  • edited February 2020

    @bigred87 said:
    Play parker as a number 10, the man oozes class on the ball he's the creative player we crave for!!!!

    But who would you take out? I don't disagree that Parker could work as a 10, but I guess you'd have to take out Blooms in a 4-3-3, which would force us to keep the ball a bit more - something I don't think we're capable of doing.

  • The starting line-up gave us a huge issue. We cannot compete with two centre midfielders. Freeman was playing left wing back, which left us dreadfully exposed in the centre.

    We then compounded this later on by removing Pattison, which meant we turned into 4-1-5. The 5 were all getting in each others way and we had no-one picking up the second ball once Fleetwood had won the first header. It was so frustrating to see.

    Fred and Smyth were in each others way, Freeman was then nullified as too many players were coming deep for the ball, as we had no midfield to link play.

    Last night sits with Ainsworth & Dobson. We know 4-3-3 is our best formula, with 3 genuine hard working midfielders. We had 4 "attacking players" on and 2 midfielders, which was so imbalanced.

    Ofoborh should have started in the middle with Pattison and Gape. He then had a choice to play Parker/Freeman out wide left OR Parker/Samuel through the middle with Freeman on the left.

    We have also missed pace out wide for a long time. Without Fred or Smyth running at players, it allows the oppo to keep their shape. If we can pull them apart a bit more, this allows our midfield to exploit the gaps.

    All in all a disappointing night...the only possible thing to celebrate is that normally when we start playing shit at home our away form suddenly improves! So I fully expect us to win on Saturday now!

  • Sam S? I’ve probably lost me marbles.

  • I think you're right @Commoner - our best formation by far is a 433. We attack best when Bayo is up top with either Fred/ Smyth/ Wheeler on the wings, and hard-working midfielders picking up second balls. As a defensive team, I prefer Samuel up top - running non-stop and helping us counter.

    The issue is not a creative midfielder, the way we currently play that would be pointless as they wouldn't get the ball on the ground long enough to unlock a defence. The issue is that we aren't playing the way we do play well enough at the moment. Our early season pace was made by a strong defence, getting the ball forward and nicking a couple of goals. When we can't defend and can't keep the ball up front, it's hardly surprising the formula doesn't work.

  • Of course. Thanks @ChasHarps.
    But I agree with @prufrock_91.

  • I thought Dom Gape had probably his second worst game for us after that one where he was ill and got subbed before half time. I lost count of the number of times he received the ball while facing his own goal, and while in plenty of space would just hoof it blindly over his own head straight to the Fleetwood defence.

    I have to admit, I mostly don't understand the high praise that he gets on here. I don't think he's a bad player, far from it, but I also don't think he's in even the top 5 in the current squad.

  • @drcongo I've never been on board with suggestions that he's Championship quality.

  • @prufrock_91 - creativity is a massive issue for us.

    4-3-3 is our best option based on the personnel we have currently. No issues with that, but break it down further and it’s something we need to fix.

    Our goal difference is plus 3, you have to scroll down to Burton in 12th for a like for like. Last night is an example where we’ve lost by an odd goal, based on the game I saw, some creativity might have won us the game.

    Our left back is our second top scorer, name me another team in the PL and EFL that is challenging at the upper end of the table where this is the case.

    We have Bayo, Fred, Parker, Wheeler, Kashket, Samuel and Smyth. It’s not rocket science, we need someone to enable and create opportunities for them.

  • Have to say, the few occasions when Pattison got the ball - when it wasn't just sailing over the midfield's heads yet again - he seemed to have a decent pass on him, but was wasted in that game. I'm a huge fan of Stewart, he's an excellent defender, but his habit of simply lumping the ball upfield without really trying to find a teammate, or even looking where it's going, was frustrating again and simply invites pressure.

  • @MindlessDrugHoover - that’s why Stewart plays for us in league 1. His defensive attributes are championship standard.

    Distribution can be hit and miss though. Thing is though at game pace and under pressure there is room for error. Takes me back to not having a midfielder that can drop deep, take the ball from the centre backs and carry 15-20 yards to connect defensive and attack.

    Pattison should be that player but he’s not ready yet. If we had that suddenly we would become multi dimensional. You have McCarthy flying down the right, long to Bayo, searching cross fields from JJ and Freeman/Fred running at players.

    Sam Saunders is a good example from his first loan with us. Thing is he was championship standard and these players are not readily available. Pattison was signed for this I guess to develop into this style of player.

  • Had time to reflect and my opinion hasn't changed, that was the worst I've seen us play this season. The 433 setup looked incredibly weak in the midfield when I saw the team sheet and then was shown to be true from the outset. Excluding JJ and Parker the whole team looked nervous and the amount of hoofs when there was time to think and take a touch was astounding. Couldn't figure out why Ofoborh wasn't stuck in the midfield after about ten minutes?? Parker I thought looked good and was surprised when he was taken off. A tough game for rocky, palming shots back into the danger area when they should have been caught and wtf was up with the goal???? Tools and Sido looked nervous wrecks and both had a terrible game. Special mention to the ref and the Lino in front of the FA. Ref was just basically incompetent and the Lino wasn't even looking the right way half the time, no wonder JJ was having words with him.
    Couldn't see the Ched Evans elbow clearly will need to watch that back but as a chap behind me stated "he'll probably get off on appeal".........

    Breathe, breathe..... I see the world through light/dark blue glasses but I have to agree with an earlier poster who said last night was Waddock-esque. So write that one off to a bad day at the office, sort out the midfield.....defence.....keeper.....and get three points on Saturday.
    COYB

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