Going back to the taking the knee, was the booing coming from home or away fans? I couldn't really tell
It was a great reaction though, instant and committed. Was good to see
I must have got lucky the other night. Encountered very little traffic, and parked nearby in one of the factory car parks. I arrived just after half six I think so maybe I was fortunate in being able to get there that early
Also got a nice pint of rebellion and didn't have to queue too long. The contactless payment seems to have speeded that up
There was definitely some in the Beechdean @eric_plant which was disappointing but soon drowned out. I was quite surprised but then a lot if things have surprised me in the last six years.
@our_frank I almost agree with you. The problem is that wifi as it stands won't reach to the car park so it has to remain cash only. In the past we have had a problem with people turning up in top of the range BMWs claiming to be scouts or national newspaper reporters and not having any cash. If they arrive at say 2.30 with a queue half way down Hillbottom Road, we just don't have the time to deal with them so they end up getting in free. This hardly adds to job (volunteer) satisfaction particularly as it is obvious these people can well afford it. But I think you are right, what we have now is a sledgehammer to crack a nut.
@Watford_Blue said:
Not a big fan of Rebellion IPA either. They did have Rebellion 24 Carat on in the beer tent which was half decent if you like a hoppy, craft beer type ale. Is keg so a bit gassy and cold for my taste but prefer it to the IPA.
Yeah the ipa was ice cold so got better as it warmed up.Could not see what was in the beer tent.Will have to see what they have week Saturday.
@eric_plant said:
Going back to the taking the knee, was the booing coming from home or away fans? I couldn't really tell
It was a great reaction though, instant and committed. Was good to see
I must have got lucky the other night. Encountered very little traffic, and parked nearby in one of the factory car parks. I arrived just after half six I think so maybe I was fortunate in being able to get there that early
Also got a nice pint of rebellion and didn't have to queue too long. The contactless payment seems to have speeded that up
Yeah we got there 6.30. Encountered a little traffic by hour glass but parked up in local street and pint in hand before 7.
Rather than informing people earlier in their journey than at the gates that they need to pre-book for the vast car park, shouldn't we just allow them to park there for a tenner cash or card?
Except it isn't a vast car park, it has a limited capacity. If you make it cash on the gate what's to stop Wycombe fans filling it by 2:30pm and you still then have the queue down Hillbottom Rd of car wanting to get into a car park that's already full.
Anyway total car parking capacity has been reduced, lower plus upper, due to an increase in the size of the Chairboys Village and more spaces being allocated in the lower to staff.
Not to mention the issue of time taken getting out of the car park after the game.
Can you imagine what it's going to be like if we get back to the Championship and we're getting 7/8,000 most weeks? At the end of the day, I think we all know there are only two proper, long-term solutions here.
@Twizz. All perfectly valid but it will only be full for a minority of games which can pretty much be noted in advance. A digital sign at the end of Hillbottom Road, as has been mooted on here would work. At present we have to walk a wooden sign down the road which is hardly ideal. When this happens we have to guess how many spaces we have left (and these vary with weather conditions) and try to ensure that we can still get a Hillbottom Road full in the car park.
Just on the screen - given it is now enormous, it felt a bit of a waste with just the score taking up most of it. I'd especially not like to see a 6ft "0-3" if we are having a bad day! Would much prefer to have the line ups showing throughout the game alongside the score and clock.
Other than that I think it was a pretty successful reopening, although I don't park at the ground so no traffic stress - cashless bar worked well and was happy with a pint of 24 Carat, pitch was immaculate, new and returning signings all looked very promising, Bayo with a spring in his step, clapping the players taking the knee (any boos sounded like they were from the away end but very quickly drowned out), wifi worked well, Vokes signing, fireworks were pretty impressive. And win and a clean sheet! Bring on next Saturday!!
@ReturnToSenda said:
Can you imagine what it's going to be like if we get back to the Championship and we're getting 7/8,000 most weeks? At the end of the day, I think we all know there are only two proper, long-term solutions here.
@ReturnToSenda said:
Can you imagine what it's going to be like if we get back to the Championship and we're getting 7/8,000 most weeks? At the end of the day, I think we all know there are only two proper, long-term solutions here.
@CarParkPete, if Hillbottom Rd wasn't a dead end things would be different but I don't think that's going to change. So while we remain at Adams Park, it's perfectly sensible to try a P&R approach.
However, for it to work there simply has to be no stationary queue down Hillbottom Rd* or even the minibuses can't get it to off load! Also it has to be signed on match days as well as publisised beforehand.
In fact the stationary traffic was back past The Hour Glass, blocking the traffic on Chapel Lane, Mill End Rd, New Rd and Lane End Rd and effectively leading to the complete grid-lock.
If I were a new fan or a visiting fan and my first experience of Adams Park was sitting in a 45minute traffic jam and missing much of the first half I'd probably never be coming back.
I simply don't understand the clubs lack of tackling the issue of controlling access to Hillbottom Rd on match days. I've been to other football grounds at this level where access is controlled.
I should say that the issue was not just with parking at the club. The issue is more simply that when more cars enter Hillbottom Rd than can park either at the club OR in the industrial units they have nowhere to go. However, the club has no control over parking in the industrial units but can do more about signage etc..
The park and ride can only be successful if Hillbottom Road is largely kept clear before and after the game. I can't see people hopping on a bus and regularly having to get off to walk the rest of the way due to traffic. Similarly after a wet and cold game in November getting on a bus and then waiting 45 minutes to be taken to West Wycombe is not such an attractive choice. That's before we even think about Covid 21
Clear management at the end of Hillbottom Road is required as a bare minimum.
It is also going to be interesting to see how the management of the car park passes will work. If people with valid passes (or new strikers) are stuck in a queue down Hillbottom Road behind people are getting to the gate before doing a 3 point turn it is going to frustrate.
Extreme I know but maybe closing Hillbottom Road to football traffic with the exception of the P and R buses at 2pm? Might make it more attractive I guess so long as you are not pushing the bottle neck further away.
@TheAndyGrahamFanClub said:
The park and ride can only be successful if Hillbottom Road is largely kept clear before and after the game.
Looking at what’s been done with the new one, the first bus to the ground, and the first one from the ground at FT, goes the gates where as the rest of them (one every 15 mins) drops you off at the start of hill bottom road which suggests to me there has been a level of thought put into the issue that hill bottom road will never be clear - even if it’s foot traffic.
I also have concerns that one 30ish seater bus from the ground is going to be sufficient at a mid winter, mid week game.
@our_frank said:
Thanks, @TheDancingYak . Personally, I'd be quite supportive of a policy like that and I'm certainly supportive of the P&R. But if that is the policy, why not be explicit about it, rather than just putting people off (and, as you say, possibly putting them off coming at all, rather than just off parking at the ground) and making the club look disorganised?
I agree completely. If alternative road access can’t be found then we 100% need to find a sustainable alternative and P&R seems an obvious step towards that.
But as you say, it needs to be made a clear policy of what the club would like to achieve and what they would like as as fans plan for on a match day. And it could ultimately keep people within the gates for longer and spending money at the club - be it food and drink before hand or even entertainment. But I kinda feel that’s what the couhigs want anyway.
“Tailgating” or tailgate party is, I understand, something that’s fairly normal stateside at American football games. And while i can see that style of event going down as well as the cheerleader thing (I.e way too Americanised) , I do think there is scope to attract people - particularly younger fans and families - to the ground and keep them there for longer than just the 90minutes on a Saturday, or arrive earlier at a weekday game.
Even a wooden sign would have helped on Wednesday, @CarParkPete. As I've said before it was no fault of the guy on Hillbottom Rd that he had to explain to 100? different cars, each taking 30 seconds or so, but added together that's 50minutes.
I know of someone, who pays a very healthy price for a lower tier car pass and premium seat due to health and mobility issues and because they know they can't arrive until 7:30pm for a midweek, they got as far as The Hour Glass by 7:20pm and entered the ground at 8:10pm.
We used to get 7,000 a week in the O’Neill era and it wasn’t quite such an issue then.
Fact is, traffic’s worse now because that traffic has increased. I’ve found a DFT report from 2019 that states that the miles covered by ‘all motor vehicle traffic’ has increased by 36.1% in the last 25 years. And the largest increase is the use of vans - up 106% during the same period. Vans, of course, take up much more space than cars.
During that period, the only road improvement near AP I can think of is that junction widening where Chapel Lane meets the A40.
The only way to solve this is for fewer vehicles to enter Hillbottom Road. But the problem is most people think that it’s someone else who needs to change their behaviour.
@TheAndyGrahamFanClub said:
The park and ride can only be successful if Hillbottom Road is largely kept clear before and after the game. I can't see people hopping on a bus and regularly having to get off to walk the rest of the way due to traffic. Similarly after a wet and cold game in November getting on a bus and then waiting 45 minutes to be taken to West Wycombe is not such an attractive choice. That's before we even think about Covid 21
Clear management at the end of Hillbottom Road is required as a bare minimum.
It is also going to be interesting to see how the management of the car park passes will work. If people with valid passes (or new strikers) are stuck in a queue down Hillbottom Road behind people are getting to the gate before doing a 3 point turn it is going to frustrate.
Extreme I know but maybe closing Hillbottom Road to football traffic with the exception of the P and R buses at 2pm? Might make it more attractive I guess so long as you are not pushing the bottle neck further away.
Back in the days of 7k attendances there was a mini army of stewards who stood either side of the road blocking all cars from leaving until the bulk of walking spectators left. Then it was a well managed release of all cars. A lady co-ordinated it all with military precision. Cost I guess
@ReturnToSenda said:
Can you imagine what it's going to be like if we get back to the Championship and we're getting 7/8,000 most weeks? At the end of the day, I think we all know there are only two proper, long-term solutions here.
@ReturnToSenda said:
Can you imagine what it's going to be like if we get back to the Championship and we're getting 7/8,000 most weeks? At the end of the day, I think we all know there are only two proper, long-term solutions here.
Ski lift and/or cable car?
Ski lift there, cable car back, otherwise the club are going to have a lot of lawsuits on their hands
@TheAndyGrahamFanClub said:
The park and ride can only be successful if Hillbottom Road is largely kept clear before and after the game. I can't see people hopping on a bus and regularly having to get off to walk the rest of the way due to traffic. Similarly after a wet and cold game in November getting on a bus and then waiting 45 minutes to be taken to West Wycombe is not such an attractive choice. That's before we even think about Covid 21
Clear management at the end of Hillbottom Road is required as a bare minimum.
It is also going to be interesting to see how the management of the car park passes will work. If people with valid passes (or new strikers) are stuck in a queue down Hillbottom Road behind people are getting to the gate before doing a 3 point turn it is going to frustrate.
Extreme I know but maybe closing Hillbottom Road to football traffic with the exception of the P and R buses at 2pm? Might make it more attractive I guess so long as you are not pushing the bottle neck further away.
@arnosgrove. A few years ago we had a system whereby you paid for the car park depending on the number of people in the car. This was before my time in the car park but I do remember us congregating in West Wycombe and all cramming into one car. Seemed to work and no idea why it was discontinued. If all else fails it might be worth giving this another try.
This does sound pretty exhausting. For home games I can generally either dedicate 24 hours to the game, which sounds enough and I can enjoy @TheDancingYak tailgate party, or about a window from 2 until 6, which sounds as though it isn't going to be physically possible to do.
I've resigned myself that midweek home games aren't going to happen if I'm driving from work, until this ramp over the top of the ground is brought in.
All the talk of access roads and a new stadium aren't going to help us out for the foreseeable future. We need to work with what's available now.
There are still a fair few factories/businesses/schools that have available parking that sits empty on a match day. I would suggest engaging with these and seeing what we can do to open them up.
I remember parking in the car park behind the business to the right of the gates...past the burger van...years ago. That seemed like quite a large one, has that all gone now?
Comments
Going back to the taking the knee, was the booing coming from home or away fans? I couldn't really tell
It was a great reaction though, instant and committed. Was good to see
I must have got lucky the other night. Encountered very little traffic, and parked nearby in one of the factory car parks. I arrived just after half six I think so maybe I was fortunate in being able to get there that early
Also got a nice pint of rebellion and didn't have to queue too long. The contactless payment seems to have speeded that up
There was definitely some in the Beechdean @eric_plant which was disappointing but soon drowned out. I was quite surprised but then a lot if things have surprised me in the last six years.
@our_frank I almost agree with you. The problem is that wifi as it stands won't reach to the car park so it has to remain cash only. In the past we have had a problem with people turning up in top of the range BMWs claiming to be scouts or national newspaper reporters and not having any cash. If they arrive at say 2.30 with a queue half way down Hillbottom Road, we just don't have the time to deal with them so they end up getting in free. This hardly adds to job (volunteer) satisfaction particularly as it is obvious these people can well afford it. But I think you are right, what we have now is a sledgehammer to crack a nut.
Yeah the ipa was ice cold so got better as it warmed up.Could not see what was in the beer tent.Will have to see what they have week Saturday.
Yeah we got there 6.30. Encountered a little traffic by hour glass but parked up in local street and pint in hand before 7.
Except it isn't a vast car park, it has a limited capacity. If you make it cash on the gate what's to stop Wycombe fans filling it by 2:30pm and you still then have the queue down Hillbottom Rd of car wanting to get into a car park that's already full.
Anyway total car parking capacity has been reduced, lower plus upper, due to an increase in the size of the Chairboys Village and more spaces being allocated in the lower to staff.
Not to mention the issue of time taken getting out of the car park after the game.
Can you imagine what it's going to be like if we get back to the Championship and we're getting 7/8,000 most weeks? At the end of the day, I think we all know there are only two proper, long-term solutions here.
@Twizz. All perfectly valid but it will only be full for a minority of games which can pretty much be noted in advance. A digital sign at the end of Hillbottom Road, as has been mooted on here would work. At present we have to walk a wooden sign down the road which is hardly ideal. When this happens we have to guess how many spaces we have left (and these vary with weather conditions) and try to ensure that we can still get a Hillbottom Road full in the car park.
Just on the screen - given it is now enormous, it felt a bit of a waste with just the score taking up most of it. I'd especially not like to see a 6ft "0-3" if we are having a bad day! Would much prefer to have the line ups showing throughout the game alongside the score and clock.
Other than that I think it was a pretty successful reopening, although I don't park at the ground so no traffic stress - cashless bar worked well and was happy with a pint of 24 Carat, pitch was immaculate, new and returning signings all looked very promising, Bayo with a spring in his step, clapping the players taking the knee (any boos sounded like they were from the away end but very quickly drowned out), wifi worked well, Vokes signing, fireworks were pretty impressive. And win and a clean sheet! Bring on next Saturday!!
New road and hoverboards?
Precisely
@CarParkPete, if Hillbottom Rd wasn't a dead end things would be different but I don't think that's going to change. So while we remain at Adams Park, it's perfectly sensible to try a P&R approach.
However, for it to work there simply has to be no stationary queue down Hillbottom Rd* or even the minibuses can't get it to off load! Also it has to be signed on match days as well as publisised beforehand.
In fact the stationary traffic was back past The Hour Glass, blocking the traffic on Chapel Lane, Mill End Rd, New Rd and Lane End Rd and effectively leading to the complete grid-lock.
If I were a new fan or a visiting fan and my first experience of Adams Park was sitting in a 45minute traffic jam and missing much of the first half I'd probably never be coming back.
I simply don't understand the clubs lack of tackling the issue of controlling access to Hillbottom Rd on match days. I've been to other football grounds at this level where access is controlled.
I should say that the issue was not just with parking at the club. The issue is more simply that when more cars enter Hillbottom Rd than can park either at the club OR in the industrial units they have nowhere to go. However, the club has no control over parking in the industrial units but can do more about signage etc..
The park and ride can only be successful if Hillbottom Road is largely kept clear before and after the game. I can't see people hopping on a bus and regularly having to get off to walk the rest of the way due to traffic. Similarly after a wet and cold game in November getting on a bus and then waiting 45 minutes to be taken to West Wycombe is not such an attractive choice. That's before we even think about Covid 21
Clear management at the end of Hillbottom Road is required as a bare minimum.
It is also going to be interesting to see how the management of the car park passes will work. If people with valid passes (or new strikers) are stuck in a queue down Hillbottom Road behind people are getting to the gate before doing a 3 point turn it is going to frustrate.
Extreme I know but maybe closing Hillbottom Road to football traffic with the exception of the P and R buses at 2pm? Might make it more attractive I guess so long as you are not pushing the bottle neck further away.
Looking at what’s been done with the new one, the first bus to the ground, and the first one from the ground at FT, goes the gates where as the rest of them (one every 15 mins) drops you off at the start of hill bottom road which suggests to me there has been a level of thought put into the issue that hill bottom road will never be clear - even if it’s foot traffic.
I also have concerns that one 30ish seater bus from the ground is going to be sufficient at a mid winter, mid week game.
I agree completely. If alternative road access can’t be found then we 100% need to find a sustainable alternative and P&R seems an obvious step towards that.
But as you say, it needs to be made a clear policy of what the club would like to achieve and what they would like as as fans plan for on a match day. And it could ultimately keep people within the gates for longer and spending money at the club - be it food and drink before hand or even entertainment. But I kinda feel that’s what the couhigs want anyway.
“Tailgating” or tailgate party is, I understand, something that’s fairly normal stateside at American football games. And while i can see that style of event going down as well as the cheerleader thing (I.e way too Americanised) , I do think there is scope to attract people - particularly younger fans and families - to the ground and keep them there for longer than just the 90minutes on a Saturday, or arrive earlier at a weekday game.
Even a wooden sign would have helped on Wednesday, @CarParkPete. As I've said before it was no fault of the guy on Hillbottom Rd that he had to explain to 100? different cars, each taking 30 seconds or so, but added together that's 50minutes.
I know of someone, who pays a very healthy price for a lower tier car pass and premium seat due to health and mobility issues and because they know they can't arrive until 7:30pm for a midweek, they got as far as The Hour Glass by 7:20pm and entered the ground at 8:10pm.
We used to get 7,000 a week in the O’Neill era and it wasn’t quite such an issue then.
Fact is, traffic’s worse now because that traffic has increased. I’ve found a DFT report from 2019 that states that the miles covered by ‘all motor vehicle traffic’ has increased by 36.1% in the last 25 years. And the largest increase is the use of vans - up 106% during the same period. Vans, of course, take up much more space than cars.
During that period, the only road improvement near AP I can think of is that junction widening where Chapel Lane meets the A40.
The only way to solve this is for fewer vehicles to enter Hillbottom Road. But the problem is most people think that it’s someone else who needs to change their behaviour.
Covid 21?! Is it going to skip an entire Covid?
Back in the days of 7k attendances there was a mini army of stewards who stood either side of the road blocking all cars from leaving until the bulk of walking spectators left. Then it was a well managed release of all cars. A lady co-ordinated it all with military precision. Cost I guess
Ski lift and/or cable car?
Ski lift there, cable car back, otherwise the club are going to have a lot of lawsuits on their hands
Might be 9th wave of Covid 19 - The Revenge
@arnosgrove. A few years ago we had a system whereby you paid for the car park depending on the number of people in the car. This was before my time in the car park but I do remember us congregating in West Wycombe and all cramming into one car. Seemed to work and no idea why it was discontinued. If all else fails it might be worth giving this another try.
I pick up 3 sometimes 4 households on my way to the game. That is why £10 to park is not really a dis-incentive.
This does sound pretty exhausting. For home games I can generally either dedicate 24 hours to the game, which sounds enough and I can enjoy @TheDancingYak tailgate party, or about a window from 2 until 6, which sounds as though it isn't going to be physically possible to do.
I've resigned myself that midweek home games aren't going to happen if I'm driving from work, until this ramp over the top of the ground is brought in.
All the talk of access roads and a new stadium aren't going to help us out for the foreseeable future. We need to work with what's available now.
There are still a fair few factories/businesses/schools that have available parking that sits empty on a match day. I would suggest engaging with these and seeing what we can do to open them up.
Have they thought about building another train line right to the ground? Like a mini HS2.
Again, that's not going to help much at the Accrington game!
How quickly can we get one of these built?
YESSS
I remember parking in the car park behind the business to the right of the gates...past the burger van...years ago. That seemed like quite a large one, has that all gone now?