It's astonishing that the news media can reproduce such inaccurate drival...
Yes, of course Daily Mail, it's Wycombe & Middlesbrough who are responsible for Derby's plight. You think so?
It's got nothing at all to do with Mel Morris overspending, submitting accounts specifically designed to hide the overspend, delaying submitting revised accounts which would have seen the punishment for overspending and thus breaching the FFP rules applied last year. Yep all that can be laid at the door of Wycombe & Middlesbrough.
@Twizz said:
It's astonishing that the news media can reproduce such inaccurate drival...
Yes, of course Daily Mail, it's Wycombe & Middlesbrough who are responsible for Derby's plight. You think so?
It's got nothing at all to do with Mel Morris overspending, submitting accounts specifically designed to hide the overspend, delaying submitting revised accounts which would have seen the punishment for overspending and thus breaching the FFP rules applied last year. Yep all that can be laid at the door of Wycombe & Middlesbrough.
Like it or not, that's the way this works. Rob Couhig wanted to make himself the enemy - the Derby fans were happy to oblige and if you think the media will do anything other than tell the easiest story possible you're very much mistaken.
Wayne Rooney vs Rob Couhig? There's only going to be one winner in the eyes of the UK media.
Whether the media have it right or not, well you know my view already
Having had a read of the Derby forum, my opinion on the whole situation has changed.
Before I was hesitant in supporting our legal challenge despite believing that Derby and Morris were flagrantly cheating, because I didn't think it was fair on the fans to suffer for something they didn't have any say in and were likely just as angry about as anyone else.
Now my thoughts are "f#ck em". They are the most one eyed bunch of self pitying morons who believe they have a right to stay competitive in the championship without paying what they owe.
They still don't think they should be selling players now...
I hope the club survives, but that should be after debts are paid- their squad should be gutted if that's what it takes - why should they be allowed to be competitive at the expense of others when they can't afford it? If that's the case why don't we just go out and sign 4/5 players to get promoted and then just tear up the contracts? It's a joke. The funding of most of the club's in the championship is.
Their fans should be directing their vitriol at Morris. He's keeping the ground under his control, when that is the only asset related to the club (alongside their League status).
If he wanted to, he could front up to the legal claims from us and Boro, but he isn't even though it was his doing.
He's the person primarily responsible, and their fans would rather blame anyone else
Word of warning for us though, we need to make sure we don't chase the dream under the Couhigs. So far it looks sensible and sustainable (with the big help from championship TV money), but we can't support a Hayes like gamble unless we're happy to accept the same fate
I understand your concern @Username but so far no sign of a Hayes like gamble from Rob C. We seem to be chasing promotion with an affordable squad...which is surely the point of football to some extent!
Just skimmed The Daily Mail piece. So they want the government to get involved. How about a financial bail out? Sure. How about giving them some money to pay players wages? Why not. Maybe some transfer fees. Absolutely. THEY OWE THE GOVERNMENT AND THE TAXPAYER 26 MILLION QUID. FUCK OFF
@Wendoverman said:
I understand your concern @Username but so far no sign of a Hayes like gamble from Rob C. We seem to be chasing promotion with an affordable squad...which is surely the point of football to some extent!
Yep, so far so good from what I can tell, but with our promotion to the championship comes increased expectations.
I sincerely hope we go back up this year or next so we can carry on with this level of squad, but if we don't we as fans will have to not just accept a lower budget, but insist on it
Cutting through the myopic bilge from many of the DCFC fans and the sorry excuse for print media in the UK (FT excluded from that) this is all of Mel Morris and his cronies/apologists making - if Derby fans want to hate someone it is him.
The EFL/us/Gibson & Boro are being cast as the villains because it detracts from their own collusion in their downfall; they seem to think that they have some right to play in the Championship/Premier League because of old glories and because they were one of the founders of the EFL; but that is now ancient history and they have no more right than any other to be there.
Have the EFL got it in for them, possibly, but all they are doing, as far as I can see, is trying to apply their rules in as even handed and sensitive a way as they can. I mean, Derby need an estimated £7m to cover costs for the remainder of the season and it is perfectly reasonable for the EFL to ask for evidence of this and remind them that if they cannot prove it the rules state they will have their "golden share" suspended which will mean they cannot play in the league.
Are WWFC & MFC reasonable to submit a claim against DCFC, all of our vies vary but I personally believe that our owner and the board were duty bound to submit it once they were aware of the deliberate withholding of accounts to avoid penalties by DCFC. It is for the administrators to adjudge the merits of the claims and accept or reject them, not anyone else... Also we have only claimed what we can quantify exactly that we missed out on, namely the Championship solidarity payment & TV money (£6m) but not the stuff we cannot namely match day revenues if we had stayed up.
Finally, Derby would have been snapped up some time ago if Mel Morris hadn't transferred the stadium to another of his companies (that is not in administration) leaving the only thing on the table being the name and the history and seriously how much is that really worth?
@TheAndyGrahamFanClub said:
I genuinely struggle with this. They are bang to rights. Their defence appears to be that they have been around for a long time and are a big club.
So we get to lose out 'cos we are a smaller club and have not been in the league as long.
Do I want to see Derby go out of business, of course not, same as Macclesfield, Bury etc etc and those fans were not living in a deluded state of denial. This is a club that was systematically cheating and the fans were loving it. Don't act dumb you know when the numbers don't stack up - Rooney? Please. He could have gone to the Premiership, he joined Derby for free and was happy being paid minimal wage? Now it's crocodile tears.
It's a common enough story. Sorry I was caught, not sorry I did the crime.
And if Ashley was serious that **** can afford a few bob extra in the takeover to pay little Wycombe off. Let alone square up HMRC and ever other poor sod that Derby have ripped off. Oh wait, why should he do the proper thing either?
You don't get rich by writing a lot of cheques and doing the right thing.
Finally, Derby would have been snapped up some time ago if Mel Morris hadn't transferred the stadium to another of his companies (that is not in administration) leaving the only thing on the table being the name and the history and seriously how much is that really worth?
Hit the nail on the head.
No investor is paying £26m just for the keys to the name and history. They won't own the stadium. They won't have five senior pros come June 30th. They won't even have Championship football. That doesn't even begin to factor in the myriad of risks, such as our £8m claim, agents of top players for league 1 level steering well clear, no Rooney to continue to help the club's marketing etc.
I don't buy this - 'we have three investors queueing'. They will almost certainly liquidate. The more I read the sheer level of delusion illustrated by DCFC fans on Twitter, the more I hope they do.
And the amount of times I've seen on Twitter 'but Wycombe were terrible all season that's why they were relegated. They cheated their way into the Championship'
...Really? They clearly don't know anything about the way our story has unfolded.
I'm not saying Wycombe should directly benefit from Derby's cheating (even though technically in the rulebook we should benefit) - but Derby should certainly be punished. They should be knocked out of professional football at the bare minimum.
I would hope that we withdraw our claim should there genuinely be a preferred bidder that can stop them going out of existence and our claim being the only blocker to that bid going through.
We all know Derby cheated and avoided a points deduction by refusing to submit their accounts on time and correctly.
I know Rob has said he’s doing this for the fans, as we’ve been robbed but I’d honestly rather a town and communities football club continued to exist than we chase a few million due to late accounts being submitted.
If I was asked to vote to save Derby OR receive a couple of million and they die then I’d be voting to save Derby.
If they go out of business we get nothing of monetary value but we will forever be linked to their demise and probably blamed for it.
Morris and his leadership team will get away with it more than we will.
Wimbledon got back to the league in 10 seasons and I’m sure Derby would to.
However, I’m not sure I’d like to find out their reaction to us as fans if we ever met or travelled to Derby for a match.
Everyone on here was so pleased when Nick Freeman was offered a new deal when we didn’t have to, it gave him security etc whilst he recovers. Could we not show that same compassion here?
Yes we are entitled to submit a claim but do we have to, what’s the right thing to do for Derby as a town and community not just us.
@ReturnToSenda said:
We will not be a part of their demise. Their demise will be their fault and their fault only. It really is that simple.
This is true but they will continue to blame us and, as so often happens in football, myth quickly becomes fact. Nasty Wycombe, the club that vindictively drove poor, innocent Derby to ruin. And plenty of media outlets will be happy to repeat and confirm as much.
We can't win really: press for compensation and we're the bad guys, drop it and we let a bunch of cheats off the hook and relinquish what we're due.
I find it hard to show compassion for people as aggressively deluded as their fans. Has anyone seen a reasonable take on the situation from a single one of them? Doesn't someone on here work at Pride Park? Maybe they can shed some light on what the general attitude is like 'on the ground'.
I'm more concerned with defending my own club from slander (I think accusing us of trying to put them out of business amounts to that?) than I am with appeasing cheats, but each to their own.
@HolmerBlue said:
I can't believe the attitude some of you have on this... quite frankly I think... we'll I'm not going to say what I think, I might get banned.
@ReturnToSenda said:
I find it hard to show compassion for people as aggressively deluded as their fans. Has anyone seen a reasonable take on the situation from a single one of them? Doesn't someone on here work at Pride Park? Maybe they can shed some light on what the general attitude is like 'on the ground'.
Seriously? We have our own set of deluded fans.
You’d rather Derby went out of business because they have some aggressively deluded fans who are smashing out all sorts as keyboard warriors.
Im sure there are many sensible Derby fans who acknowledge the situation and how we may feel.
Yes, they cheated but our ire should be directed at the rules & procedures that allowed them to get away without a points deduction last season. Which meant we went down.
We shouldn’t be trying to gain a few
Million which could ultimately result in killing a football club off from its way of life.
I don’t know what I’d do if Wycombe died,
It doesn’t bare thinking about, and that should be where all fans support each other’s clubs no matter the circumstances.
Comments
Niall Horgan now on the case
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-10410571/One-Direction-singerr-Niall-Horan-backs-calls-government-aid-Derby-County.html
Oh god, their fans are even more fanatical than Derby's. Call it off, Rob!
Maybe he could throw a bit of cash our way?
They've done pretty well for themselves, I'm led to believe
It's astonishing that the news media can reproduce such inaccurate drival...
Yes, of course Daily Mail, it's Wycombe & Middlesbrough who are responsible for Derby's plight. You think so?
It's got nothing at all to do with Mel Morris overspending, submitting accounts specifically designed to hide the overspend, delaying submitting revised accounts which would have seen the punishment for overspending and thus breaching the FFP rules applied last year. Yep all that can be laid at the door of Wycombe & Middlesbrough.
Isn't the term "One-Direction Singer" an oxymoron?
Like it or not, that's the way this works. Rob Couhig wanted to make himself the enemy - the Derby fans were happy to oblige and if you think the media will do anything other than tell the easiest story possible you're very much mistaken.
Wayne Rooney vs Rob Couhig? There's only going to be one winner in the eyes of the UK media.
Whether the media have it right or not, well you know my view already
No just a moron
Having had a read of the Derby forum, my opinion on the whole situation has changed.
Before I was hesitant in supporting our legal challenge despite believing that Derby and Morris were flagrantly cheating, because I didn't think it was fair on the fans to suffer for something they didn't have any say in and were likely just as angry about as anyone else.
Now my thoughts are "f#ck em". They are the most one eyed bunch of self pitying morons who believe they have a right to stay competitive in the championship without paying what they owe.
They still don't think they should be selling players now...
I hope the club survives, but that should be after debts are paid- their squad should be gutted if that's what it takes - why should they be allowed to be competitive at the expense of others when they can't afford it? If that's the case why don't we just go out and sign 4/5 players to get promoted and then just tear up the contracts? It's a joke. The funding of most of the club's in the championship is.
Their fans should be directing their vitriol at Morris. He's keeping the ground under his control, when that is the only asset related to the club (alongside their League status).
If he wanted to, he could front up to the legal claims from us and Boro, but he isn't even though it was his doing.
He's the person primarily responsible, and their fans would rather blame anyone else
Word of warning for us though, we need to make sure we don't chase the dream under the Couhigs. So far it looks sensible and sustainable (with the big help from championship TV money), but we can't support a Hayes like gamble unless we're happy to accept the same fate
I understand your concern @Username but so far no sign of a Hayes like gamble from Rob C. We seem to be chasing promotion with an affordable squad...which is surely the point of football to some extent!
We need to sign a South Korean player and counter attack with BTS
Just skimmed The Daily Mail piece. So they want the government to get involved. How about a financial bail out? Sure. How about giving them some money to pay players wages? Why not. Maybe some transfer fees. Absolutely. THEY OWE THE GOVERNMENT AND THE TAXPAYER 26 MILLION QUID. FUCK OFF
Yep, so far so good from what I can tell, but with our promotion to the championship comes increased expectations.
I sincerely hope we go back up this year or next so we can carry on with this level of squad, but if we don't we as fans will have to not just accept a lower budget, but insist on it
Cutting through the myopic bilge from many of the DCFC fans and the sorry excuse for print media in the UK (FT excluded from that) this is all of Mel Morris and his cronies/apologists making - if Derby fans want to hate someone it is him.
The EFL/us/Gibson & Boro are being cast as the villains because it detracts from their own collusion in their downfall; they seem to think that they have some right to play in the Championship/Premier League because of old glories and because they were one of the founders of the EFL; but that is now ancient history and they have no more right than any other to be there.
Have the EFL got it in for them, possibly, but all they are doing, as far as I can see, is trying to apply their rules in as even handed and sensitive a way as they can. I mean, Derby need an estimated £7m to cover costs for the remainder of the season and it is perfectly reasonable for the EFL to ask for evidence of this and remind them that if they cannot prove it the rules state they will have their "golden share" suspended which will mean they cannot play in the league.
Are WWFC & MFC reasonable to submit a claim against DCFC, all of our vies vary but I personally believe that our owner and the board were duty bound to submit it once they were aware of the deliberate withholding of accounts to avoid penalties by DCFC. It is for the administrators to adjudge the merits of the claims and accept or reject them, not anyone else... Also we have only claimed what we can quantify exactly that we missed out on, namely the Championship solidarity payment & TV money (£6m) but not the stuff we cannot namely match day revenues if we had stayed up.
Finally, Derby would have been snapped up some time ago if Mel Morris hadn't transferred the stadium to another of his companies (that is not in administration) leaving the only thing on the table being the name and the history and seriously how much is that really worth?
You don't get rich by writing a lot of cheques and doing the right thing.
Hit the nail on the head.
No investor is paying £26m just for the keys to the name and history. They won't own the stadium. They won't have five senior pros come June 30th. They won't even have Championship football. That doesn't even begin to factor in the myriad of risks, such as our £8m claim, agents of top players for league 1 level steering well clear, no Rooney to continue to help the club's marketing etc.
I don't buy this - 'we have three investors queueing'. They will almost certainly liquidate. The more I read the sheer level of delusion illustrated by DCFC fans on Twitter, the more I hope they do.
And the amount of times I've seen on Twitter 'but Wycombe were terrible all season that's why they were relegated. They cheated their way into the Championship'
...Really? They clearly don't know anything about the way our story has unfolded.
I'm not saying Wycombe should directly benefit from Derby's cheating (even though technically in the rulebook we should benefit) - but Derby should certainly be punished. They should be knocked out of professional football at the bare minimum.
I always thought of you more as a window Twanky
I would hope that we withdraw our claim should there genuinely be a preferred bidder that can stop them going out of existence and our claim being the only blocker to that bid going through.
We all know Derby cheated and avoided a points deduction by refusing to submit their accounts on time and correctly.
I know Rob has said he’s doing this for the fans, as we’ve been robbed but I’d honestly rather a town and communities football club continued to exist than we chase a few million due to late accounts being submitted.
If I was asked to vote to save Derby OR receive a couple of million and they die then I’d be voting to save Derby.
I think if we end up being a part of their demise, no matter how small we think it is, it will not end well for us, we'll be tarnished forever
7 million could be more than we are worth....
We will not be a part of their demise. Their demise will be their fault and their fault only. It really is that simple.
It obviously isn't
If they go out of business we get nothing of monetary value but we will forever be linked to their demise and probably blamed for it.
Morris and his leadership team will get away with it more than we will.
Wimbledon got back to the league in 10 seasons and I’m sure Derby would to.
However, I’m not sure I’d like to find out their reaction to us as fans if we ever met or travelled to Derby for a match.
Everyone on here was so pleased when Nick Freeman was offered a new deal when we didn’t have to, it gave him security etc whilst he recovers. Could we not show that same compassion here?
Yes we are entitled to submit a claim but do we have to, what’s the right thing to do for Derby as a town and community not just us.
This is true but they will continue to blame us and, as so often happens in football, myth quickly becomes fact. Nasty Wycombe, the club that vindictively drove poor, innocent Derby to ruin. And plenty of media outlets will be happy to repeat and confirm as much.
We can't win really: press for compensation and we're the bad guys, drop it and we let a bunch of cheats off the hook and relinquish what we're due.
I find it hard to show compassion for people as aggressively deluded as their fans. Has anyone seen a reasonable take on the situation from a single one of them? Doesn't someone on here work at Pride Park? Maybe they can shed some light on what the general attitude is like 'on the ground'.
I can't believe the attitude some of you have on this... quite frankly I think... we'll I'm not going to say what I think, I might get banned.
I'm more concerned with defending my own club from slander (I think accusing us of trying to put them out of business amounts to that?) than I am with appeasing cheats, but each to their own.
Say it, this is a pretty free place
Seriously? We have our own set of deluded fans.
You’d rather Derby went out of business because they have some aggressively deluded fans who are smashing out all sorts as keyboard warriors.
Im sure there are many sensible Derby fans who acknowledge the situation and how we may feel.
Yes, they cheated but our ire should be directed at the rules & procedures that allowed them to get away without a points deduction last season. Which meant we went down.
We shouldn’t be trying to gain a few
Million which could ultimately result in killing a football club off from its way of life.
I don’t know what I’d do if Wycombe died,
It doesn’t bare thinking about, and that should be where all fans support each other’s clubs no matter the circumstances.
There’s some truly bizarre posts in this thread. If you cut your own leg off and then I gave you a paper cut did I make you bleed to death?