Not massively, if we’d have lost 2-0 instead of 5-0 we’d still have the second worst goals against. Good defending has never been as ‘sexy’ as prolific goal scoring, but it’s the basis of most successful teams.
Not massively, if we’d have lost 2-0 instead of 5-0 we’d still have the second worst goals against. Good defending has never been as ‘sexy’ as prolific goal scoring, but it’s the basis of most successful teams.
Not quite, there'd be six five worse than and two level with us. After getting to grips with the division, our defensive performance when we've not been ravaged by injuries has generally been very good.
It the last 9 games since the last international break we have conceded 10 goals; 1 when we were down to 10, 2 own goals and at least 2 bad individual mistakes. Given that the last 6 of those have been with makeshift central defenders I am pretty impressed with how we are doing defensively overall.
Not massively, if we’d have lost 2-0 instead of 5-0 we’d still have the second worst goals against. Good defending has never been as ‘sexy’ as prolific goal scoring, but it’s the basis of most successful teams.
Not quite, there'd be six five worse than and two level with us. After getting to grips with the division, our defensive performance when we've not been ravaged by injuries has generally been very good.
Not massively, if we’d have lost 2-0 instead of 5-0 we’d still have the second worst goals against. Good defending has never been as ‘sexy’ as prolific goal scoring, but it’s the basis of most successful teams.
Not quite, there'd be six five worse than and two level with us. After getting to grips with the division, our defensive performance when we've not been ravaged by injuries has generally been very good.
Sorry typo by me. Should have read 3-0. Anyway, the point I’m making is about the importance of not conceding versus scoring more goals.
@bookertease said:
It the last 9 games since the last international break we have conceded 10 goals; 1 when we were down to 10, 2 own goals and at least 2 bad individual mistakes. Given that the last 6 of those have been with makeshift central defenders I am pretty impressed with how we are doing defensively overall.
I am not being critical of individual players or our overall defending, just making the point that being hard to score against is more important than being prolific scorers.
It’s such a difficult balance to achieve, though.
Perhaps I didn’t make myself clear. I expressed my surprise that whilst the majority of posts were about the need to score more goals, we still have the second worst defensive record in the division. This is a fact, not a criticism. Winning 1-0 may not be as entertaining as winning 3-2 but the outcome is the same: three points.
My view is that we have worked hard and successfully to improve our defence since the first few games. I think this has been at the cost of our attacking capabilities as our forward/midfield players have been asked to track back to cover.
But agree getting it right at the back is important
@bookertease said:
My view is that we have worked hard and successfully to improve our defence since the first few games. I think this has been at the cost of our attacking capabilities as our forward/midfield players have been asked to track back to cover.
But agree getting it right at the back is important
I agree. With our front players tracking back we seem to have very few men forward when we attack. On tv it looks like we sometimes have 3 attackers versus 7 defenders (plus their keeper). Very hard to score in those circumstances. Only way to improve would be to get comfortable keeping possession in the opposition half and building support around that. And we are developing that ‘ball on the ground’ game with McCleary and Horgan.
And Nick Freeman, I like to think. Several others too in a season which, for all its goalscoring deficiencies, has seen much progress towards a more attractive style of football.
And Nick Freeman, I like to think. Several others too in a season which, for all its goalscoring deficiencies, has seen much progress towards a more attractive style of football.
Agreed. I don’t think Nick has much confidence in front of goal but he can play a lovely pass.
I get wildly excited whenever I see Knight in the opposition half and as said above, if we could get more comfortable on retaining possession in the opposition half then more options open up.
I love Bayo, he is a club legend and I hope he scores the winner that keeps us up (or Blooms as second choice) but in order for that to happen he needs to be coming into games from the bench not from the start. League 2 defences have no idea how to play him, league 1 some idea and championship probably quite a good idea but it takes them 10-15 minutes to work it out, probably eased by him not being 100% fit. Unleash a fit Bayo against tired defenders and you expect 20 minutes of panic. Those 20 minutes need to be saved for the end of games that we need to get back into.
Absolutely spot on @Manboobs. And let’s hope the striker that GA seemed to be hinting at signing will be instrumental in sparking a few much needed victories.
@micra said:
And Nick Freeman, I like to think. Several others too in a season which, for all its goalscoring deficiencies, has seen much progress towards a more attractive style of football.
I don't agree that we've progressed towards a more attractive style at all. That's not a bad thing, but we are still overwhelmingly direct. I wouldn't expect Gaz to ever deviate far from his philosophy.
Nicks style of play hasn’t changed at all, maybe why he’s not been utilised more because of the gaffas style of play (direct) it might had worked in league 1 and 2, but it won’t work at this level, and with Horgan and Mcleary style of play, it’s begging for a Nick Freeman to control and dictate play, in my opinion Nick has been treated very badly and been overlooked, he’s been involved in 7 of the 20 games so far, which means he’s either been left at home or was an unused sub for 13 games, criminal for a player of his quality.
GA talked about adding a defender and a striker to the squad. What are the implications to a squad of 25. Do they have to be loanees, under 21 or do we have to ship a couple out on loan before adding to the squad. Not sure of the rules. Parker probably needs to be moved out because he doesn’t look close to a game even with all our injuries .
You have to look at the bigger picture with Nick, if games have passed him by is because the game was being chased and has gone from back to front bypassing him, of course he can’t dictate or have a huge influence every game, as well as our championship quality players at present don’t have, but give him the ball and he either plays simple to retain possession, or try’s the forward interlinking pass, i feel he’s never been given a decent run, in 4/12 years he’s only been given a 6 game run of starts, that was last year, others can have either a poor game, average, solid or outstanding, but still start the next game, If he had a decent run of games I’m sure you would see a better player
@micra said:
There is definitely much more carpet football this season, especially since Garath McCleary arrived.
The numbers say we're actually slightly more direct than last season - although that could change going forward. There's a very slight correlation between short passing and league position, but there are teams with different styles at both ends of the table - play to your strengths etc! We're not where we are because of our style.
Comments
Skewed massively by the Blackburn game tbf
Please. Will you keep it positive!
Not massively, if we’d have lost 2-0 instead of 5-0 we’d still have the second worst goals against. Good defending has never been as ‘sexy’ as prolific goal scoring, but it’s the basis of most successful teams.
Not quite, there'd be six five worse than and two level with us. After getting to grips with the division, our defensive performance when we've not been ravaged by injuries has generally been very good.
It the last 9 games since the last international break we have conceded 10 goals; 1 when we were down to 10, 2 own goals and at least 2 bad individual mistakes. Given that the last 6 of those have been with makeshift central defenders I am pretty impressed with how we are doing defensively overall.
Sorry typo by me. Should have read 3-0. Anyway, the point I’m making is about the importance of not conceding versus scoring more goals.
12 goals in the first 5 and 17 in the next 15 games @glasshalffull. Not sure you are fair in criticising our defensive record.
I am not being critical of individual players or our overall defending, just making the point that being hard to score against is more important than being prolific scorers.
It’s such a difficult balance to achieve, though.
Who is suggesting that Kashket be dropped @aloysius ?
Think I've got it. We need to score more and conceed less. Is that about it?
We have only scored two goals twice this season, while we have had a lot of games conceding either one or no goals.
Perhaps I didn’t make myself clear. I expressed my surprise that whilst the majority of posts were about the need to score more goals, we still have the second worst defensive record in the division. This is a fact, not a criticism. Winning 1-0 may not be as entertaining as winning 3-2 but the outcome is the same: three points.
My view is that we have worked hard and successfully to improve our defence since the first few games. I think this has been at the cost of our attacking capabilities as our forward/midfield players have been asked to track back to cover.
But agree getting it right at the back is important
I agree. With our front players tracking back we seem to have very few men forward when we attack. On tv it looks like we sometimes have 3 attackers versus 7 defenders (plus their keeper). Very hard to score in those circumstances. Only way to improve would be to get comfortable keeping possession in the opposition half and building support around that. And we are developing that ‘ball on the ground’ game with McCleary and Horgan.
And Nick Freeman, I like to think. Several others too in a season which, for all its goalscoring deficiencies, has seen much progress towards a more attractive style of football.
@micra said:
Agreed. I don’t think Nick has much confidence in front of goal but he can play a lovely pass.
I get wildly excited whenever I see Knight in the opposition half and as said above, if we could get more comfortable on retaining possession in the opposition half then more options open up.
I love Bayo, he is a club legend and I hope he scores the winner that keeps us up (or Blooms as second choice) but in order for that to happen he needs to be coming into games from the bench not from the start. League 2 defences have no idea how to play him, league 1 some idea and championship probably quite a good idea but it takes them 10-15 minutes to work it out, probably eased by him not being 100% fit. Unleash a fit Bayo against tired defenders and you expect 20 minutes of panic. Those 20 minutes need to be saved for the end of games that we need to get back into.
Absolutely spot on @Manboobs. And let’s hope the striker that GA seemed to be hinting at signing will be instrumental in sparking a few much needed victories.
Don’t forget Ickpeazu, he was brought in to lighten the load on Bayo but injuries have prevented him showing what he’s capable of.
I don't agree that we've progressed towards a more attractive style at all. That's not a bad thing, but we are still overwhelmingly direct. I wouldn't expect Gaz to ever deviate far from his philosophy.
Nicks style of play hasn’t changed at all, maybe why he’s not been utilised more because of the gaffas style of play (direct) it might had worked in league 1 and 2, but it won’t work at this level, and with Horgan and Mcleary style of play, it’s begging for a Nick Freeman to control and dictate play, in my opinion Nick has been treated very badly and been overlooked, he’s been involved in 7 of the 20 games so far, which means he’s either been left at home or was an unused sub for 13 games, criminal for a player of his quality.
The calls for Freeman to play more seem to crop up intensely a couple of times a season.
But usually quickly drop down again.
Yeah, very frustrating.
There is definitely much more carpet football this season, especially since Garath McCleary arrived.
I love it.
GA talked about adding a defender and a striker to the squad. What are the implications to a squad of 25. Do they have to be loanees, under 21 or do we have to ship a couple out on loan before adding to the squad. Not sure of the rules. Parker probably needs to be moved out because he doesn’t look close to a game even with all our injuries .
You have to look at the bigger picture with Nick, if games have passed him by is because the game was being chased and has gone from back to front bypassing him, of course he can’t dictate or have a huge influence every game, as well as our championship quality players at present don’t have, but give him the ball and he either plays simple to retain possession, or try’s the forward interlinking pass, i feel he’s never been given a decent run, in 4/12 years he’s only been given a 6 game run of starts, that was last year, others can have either a poor game, average, solid or outstanding, but still start the next game, If he had a decent run of games I’m sure you would see a better player
With our current injury crisis I think Freeman has to be given a game or two with Mehmeti to see if we can play a different way.
The numbers say we're actually slightly more direct than last season - although that could change going forward. There's a very slight correlation between short passing and league position, but there are teams with different styles at both ends of the table - play to your strengths etc! We're not where we are because of our style.