Until we win a game it's not so much a run of form as just not being up to the standard.
Fingers crossed I'm well wide of the mark, but I don't think anyone that's a football neutral could have watched any of our games bar Rotherham and not thought that we were at least 1 division lower, maybe 2.
I think you are well wide of the mark. To suggest that we were two divisions inferior to some of our opponents is both inaccurate and unfair. We have got steadily better and if it hadn’t been for poor refereeing decisions we would now be sitting on 3-6 points.
Totally agree @glasshalffull . Not sure what last few games @Username has been watching. Obviously we have lost 7 on the trot but we are improving a lot. Still think we could do with a couple of free agents to give us a fighting chance.
Until we win a game it's not so much a run of form as just not being up to the standard.
Fingers crossed I'm well wide of the mark, but I don't think anyone that's a football neutral could have watched any of our games bar Rotherham and not thought that we were at least 1 division lower, maybe 2.
I think you are well wide of the mark. To suggest that we were two divisions inferior to some of our opponents is both inaccurate and unfair. We have got steadily better and if it hadn’t been for poor refereeing decisions we would now be sitting on 3-6 points.
Don't disagree that weve improved and we could easily have got points from the games, but that doesn't mean that we haven't looked like a team from a different league. Cup upsets happen, and so far that's how the games have felt watching them, us hoping to hang into a game against vastly superior teams in the hope of pulling off a result once in a blue moon. We were much better today, but Norwich still should have scored 3 or 4 if they were on song.
Was always likely to be the case with the huge financial chasm but it doesn't make the season less daunting, and I'm not willing to bury my head in the sand and pretend that's not how I see it.
I'm not sure Norwich should have scored 3 or 4. They had a lot of chances but almost all low quality - largely down to our excellent defending. The chances we created were better if not amazing (which they were never likely to be against potential champions).
@chairboyscentral said:
I'm not sure Norwich should have scored 3 or 4. They had a lot of chances but almost all low quality - largely down to our excellent defending. The chances we created were better if not amazing (which they were never likely to be against potential champions).
By "on song" I didn't just mean finishing, there were 3 or 4 times when a better final ball (by players now than capable of doing it) would have opened us up, or not given us the chance of putting in a last ditch block or tackle.
Fortunately Stewart has to be up there with one of the best in the business at last ditch blocks
I must admit, much as I love the big man when we are defending like hell and not getting out of our own half I would rather see someone quicker with a bit of energy coming on than a target man who we cannot get the ball to myself.
Worth pointing out we’ve only played 1 team currently in the bottom half. Several of the teams we’ve played would expect to be competing for promotion. By the end of November we will have played several other teams that have made a slow start.
Plus of course we have Sheffield Weds next Sat. We could really, really do with getting a result from that. They could leapfrog us in that game otherwise, depending on results Tues.
Any sensible person would say that we will probably get relegated. But I think we’ve shown enough in the last couple of games to at least provide some genuine hope.
To continue @Username’s debate, I think it’s fair to say that the teams at the top end of the table have ‘classier’ footballers than we do and to compete we do have to treat these games in effect like cup ties.
But, the same could have been said at the start of last season when you looked at the squads of Sunderland, Ipswich, Portsmouth, etc and that worked out pretty well.
Our strength is being greater than the sum of our parts (not meaning any disrespect to our players, but a fair few would probably have finished their career as ‘only’ lower league professionals without GA and RDs influence).
We will always be vulnerable to those moments of skill and class that good teams and players can produce but we appear to be learning and getting better at reducing good opportunities and starting to get a shape of creating chances ourselves.
I think our ‘success’ this season will be dependent on GA managing to keep the players confidence levels high. Yesterday’s early goal was a good test that we passed exceptionally well. The late sickener will be a test for Tuesday (hopefully with a different outcome than Blackburn).
As an aside, isn’t it weird to have only a cursory interest in the FA Cup first round draw tomorrow. Been quite a while since we’ve not been involved in that.
How are the anger levels today? Mine are still on high and I am really starting to believe this big team bias which has to be complete nonsense doesn't it?
Wonder if Ainsworth is looking at that late free kick in a different light to his press conference and if he is considering working with our players on improving our free kick generation (diving) to Championship standard. We really do seem to be behind the curve on this.
Wonder if Ainsworth is looking at that late free kick in a different light to his press conference and if he is considering working with our players on improving our free kick generation (diving) to Championship standard. We really do seem to be behind the curve on this.
And people said there is no room for Bloomfield in this division...
I am not a fan of VAR, but I wonder how many points we might have had by now if it was in use in the Championship?
Disallowed goals v Luton and Millwall might have counted and then came yesterday’s incidents.
Despite Trevor’s defence of referees, there’s no doubt that their decisions have had a major affect in three of our last four games.
@glasshalffull said:
I am not a fan of VAR, but I wonder how many points we might have had by now if it was in use in the Championship?
Disallowed goals v Luton and Millwall might have counted and then came yesterday’s incidents.
Despite Trevor’s defence of referees, there’s no doubt that their decisions have had a major affect in three of our last four games.
VAR is no guarantee of anything at the moment, can you imagine sitting through all those decisions twice as 2 sets of lapsed Specsavers attendees dismiss them.
@Right_in_the_Middle said:
How are the anger levels today? Mine are still on high and I am really starting to believe this big team bias which has to be complete nonsense doesn't it?
In hindsight, it is probably as well that the game was played behind locked doors.
Otherwise, I could imagine a certain referee being chased back down the A11 by cars and coaches full of light and dark blue clad supporters hungry for blood and justice.
It's not been mentioned (I think), but I love the fact Daniel Farke researched and respected JJ enough to position someone on the line for when a corner of his inevitably beat a Dutch international keeper. I wish it had gone in, but it made me smile that JJ is showing he would do it at any level (as far as corners, at least).
@StrongestTeam Indeed. The stamp + dive yesterday reminded me of Bruno Fernandes doing the same to win a penalty for Man Utd (vs Villa, was it?) in the summer. A shocking decision which VAR reviewed and sustained.
@Shev Absolutely. Also notable how, when we had the chance to pitch that free-kick into the penalty area in the dying seconds, Krul came to the edge of the area to claim it, thereby nullifying the threat from Bayo and Uche. It might just be something that Krul would do, but it felt to me like a plan for the eventuality that one or both of those two would come on.
Of course, refs would make far fewer mistakes if players didn't take every opportunity to cheat.
It's somewhat bizarre that it's nearly alway the ref that gets the blame for making an honest mistake thanks to a dishonest player.
I'd also suggest that our own reputation for the dark arts has probably not done us any favours when refs have had decisions to make.
@our_frank said: @StrongestTeam Indeed. The stamp + dive yesterday reminded me of Bruno Fernandes doing the same to win a penalty for Man Utd (vs Villa, was it?) in the summer. A shocking decision which VAR reviewed and sustained.
In fairness Bruno had done a little turn and had his back to their man as he stood on him. Quite accidental.
The Norwich guy purposely did a most bizarre mix of diving and standing on our man with 100% intent.
Looked to me like Varncic deliberately tried to put his foot just before Fred's to make it look like a genuine trip but missed and trod on his foot. That would make the dive 100% intent and the foul on Fred a less intended consequence.
My initial view was the same as Gareth's I have to say. With the speed of it, and knowing how players go own with a tiny brush, i thought it "probably" would be one.
It was only the replay and slow mo that was damning to me.
You'd hope a pro ref and his linesman who are closer to the action and not on a less than 100% HD picture would spot what happened though.
At the time of Fred's claim I assumed he realised if he gave a pen he would have to send off the already booked defender and thus in popular parlance the ref 'bottled it'. It was certainly a poor show from.the man in the middle.
@Wendoverman said:
At the time of Fred's claim I assumed he realised if he gave a pen he would have to send off the already booked defender and thus in popular parlance the ref 'bottled it'. It was certainly a poor show from.the man in the middle.
He would have had to give a straight red for not making a legit challenge for the ball anyway.
Comments
Don’t know how predictive text came up with that last word! Should,of course, have read ‘to play for’.
Totally agree @glasshalffull . Not sure what last few games @Username has been watching. Obviously we have lost 7 on the trot but we are improving a lot. Still think we could do with a couple of free agents to give us a fighting chance.
Does anyone think we will see Uche and Bayo up front together again?
Don't disagree that weve improved and we could easily have got points from the games, but that doesn't mean that we haven't looked like a team from a different league. Cup upsets happen, and so far that's how the games have felt watching them, us hoping to hang into a game against vastly superior teams in the hope of pulling off a result once in a blue moon. We were much better today, but Norwich still should have scored 3 or 4 if they were on song.
Was always likely to be the case with the huge financial chasm but it doesn't make the season less daunting, and I'm not willing to bury my head in the sand and pretend that's not how I see it.
I'm not sure Norwich should have scored 3 or 4. They had a lot of chances but almost all low quality - largely down to our excellent defending. The chances we created were better if not amazing (which they were never likely to be against potential champions).
I hope not. Uche is baby bayo and doesn't need to play with him.
By "on song" I didn't just mean finishing, there were 3 or 4 times when a better final ball (by players now than capable of doing it) would have opened us up, or not given us the chance of putting in a last ditch block or tackle.
Fortunately Stewart has to be up there with one of the best in the business at last ditch blocks
I must admit, much as I love the big man when we are defending like hell and not getting out of our own half I would rather see someone quicker with a bit of energy coming on than a target man who we cannot get the ball to myself.
All apart from Rotherham top half table teams the points will come, it will be tough but we are talking wycombe aren’t we?!
Worth pointing out we’ve only played 1 team currently in the bottom half. Several of the teams we’ve played would expect to be competing for promotion. By the end of November we will have played several other teams that have made a slow start.
Plus of course we have Sheffield Weds next Sat. We could really, really do with getting a result from that. They could leapfrog us in that game otherwise, depending on results Tues.
Any sensible person would say that we will probably get relegated. But I think we’ve shown enough in the last couple of games to at least provide some genuine hope.
Nice to see Ashton agrees this time that it was never a free kick.
Still intrigued by @DJWYC14 describing the ref as "dugmeat".
Drogbeat?
To continue @Username’s debate, I think it’s fair to say that the teams at the top end of the table have ‘classier’ footballers than we do and to compete we do have to treat these games in effect like cup ties.
But, the same could have been said at the start of last season when you looked at the squads of Sunderland, Ipswich, Portsmouth, etc and that worked out pretty well.
Our strength is being greater than the sum of our parts (not meaning any disrespect to our players, but a fair few would probably have finished their career as ‘only’ lower league professionals without GA and RDs influence).
We will always be vulnerable to those moments of skill and class that good teams and players can produce but we appear to be learning and getting better at reducing good opportunities and starting to get a shape of creating chances ourselves.
I think our ‘success’ this season will be dependent on GA managing to keep the players confidence levels high. Yesterday’s early goal was a good test that we passed exceptionally well. The late sickener will be a test for Tuesday (hopefully with a different outcome than Blackburn).
As an aside, isn’t it weird to have only a cursory interest in the FA Cup first round draw tomorrow. Been quite a while since we’ve not been involved in that.
@JohnBoy It’s not Ashton, it’s our very own Super Sammy Parkin.
It did sound rather like a nasty STD.
How are the anger levels today? Mine are still on high and I am really starting to believe this big team bias which has to be complete nonsense doesn't it?
Wonder if Ainsworth is looking at that late free kick in a different light to his press conference and if he is considering working with our players on improving our free kick generation (diving) to Championship standard. We really do seem to be behind the curve on this.
@Right_in_the_Middle said:
And people said there is no room for Bloomfield in this division...
I am not a fan of VAR, but I wonder how many points we might have had by now if it was in use in the Championship?
Disallowed goals v Luton and Millwall might have counted and then came yesterday’s incidents.
Despite Trevor’s defence of referees, there’s no doubt that their decisions have had a major affect in three of our last four games.
VAR is no guarantee of anything at the moment, can you imagine sitting through all those decisions twice as 2 sets of lapsed Specsavers attendees dismiss them.
In hindsight, it is probably as well that the game was played behind locked doors.
Otherwise, I could imagine a certain referee being chased back down the A11 by cars and coaches full of light and dark blue clad supporters hungry for blood and justice.
Glaswegian for 'not very good' presumably? I would have thought the ref's performance was more in the 'walloper' category personally.
It's not been mentioned (I think), but I love the fact Daniel Farke researched and respected JJ enough to position someone on the line for when a corner of his inevitably beat a Dutch international keeper. I wish it had gone in, but it made me smile that JJ is showing he would do it at any level (as far as corners, at least).
@StrongestTeam Indeed. The stamp + dive yesterday reminded me of Bruno Fernandes doing the same to win a penalty for Man Utd (vs Villa, was it?) in the summer. A shocking decision which VAR reviewed and sustained.
@Shev Absolutely. Also notable how, when we had the chance to pitch that free-kick into the penalty area in the dying seconds, Krul came to the edge of the area to claim it, thereby nullifying the threat from Bayo and Uche. It might just be something that Krul would do, but it felt to me like a plan for the eventuality that one or both of those two would come on.
Of course, refs would make far fewer mistakes if players didn't take every opportunity to cheat.
It's somewhat bizarre that it's nearly alway the ref that gets the blame for making an honest mistake thanks to a dishonest player.
I'd also suggest that our own reputation for the dark arts has probably not done us any favours when refs have had decisions to make.
In fairness Bruno had done a little turn and had his back to their man as he stood on him. Quite accidental.
The Norwich guy purposely did a most bizarre mix of diving and standing on our man with 100% intent.
Looked to me like Varncic deliberately tried to put his foot just before Fred's to make it look like a genuine trip but missed and trod on his foot. That would make the dive 100% intent and the foul on Fred a less intended consequence.
My initial view was the same as Gareth's I have to say. With the speed of it, and knowing how players go own with a tiny brush, i thought it "probably" would be one.
It was only the replay and slow mo that was damning to me.
You'd hope a pro ref and his linesman who are closer to the action and not on a less than 100% HD picture would spot what happened though.
At the time of Fred's claim I assumed he realised if he gave a pen he would have to send off the already booked defender and thus in popular parlance the ref 'bottled it'. It was certainly a poor show from.the man in the middle.
He would have had to give a straight red for not making a legit challenge for the ball anyway.