I don’t know about Dev’s claim that marlowchair has actually done any harm, but here’s a serious question:
Does a club ‘insider’ leaking confidential information and making unsubstantiated accusations actually help WWFC in any way?
Only if those revelations could be effective in bringing about a change or end to that behaviour. As many people have said, I’m not sure that this forum is influential enough to achieve that.
That said, the black and white campaign for more information surrounding the proposed new stadium played a part in that not going through and was brought to life on the old gasroom
Always worth remembering that "the Gasroom" isn't a sentient being, but a collection of (mainly) Wycombe Wanderers supporters. Would probably be more helpful to describe it as "some fans" rather than "The Gasroom" when referring to something we've read here
Is it conceivable that the reason tonight’s meeting is cancelled is due to the fact, that they now seek at 49% minority, then a majority later. Hence no vote would be needed on a minority. Just a thought
@glasshalffull said:
Only if those revelations could be effective in bringing about a change or end to that behaviour. As many people have said, I’m not sure that this forum is influential enough to achieve that.
One could also use the view that " for evil to succeed, it is only necessary for good men to do nothing"? Revolution has to start somewhere.
Just an observation, not meant as a personal insult Mr P. Let's be upfront here, there is clearly some "backroom" issues here and for once I agree with @DevC in his feelings that the USA deal is dead in the water and the Trust are looking at ways of "dressing the turd sandwich" before presentation. Hope I am wrong, but information voids are not helping.
The Americans have been very patient and understanding up to now despite a delay in negotiations caused by the alternative bid. I very much hope that this hiccup is genuine and unavoidable, but I genuinely have no idea as I’m no longer ‘in the loop’ when it comes to insider information.
With 3 historic clubs Bury, Bolton and Notts County in the news today, staring into the abyss, why on earth would anyone consider relinquishing trust ownership?
Don’t worry @glasshalffull. @marlowchair is clearly ‘in the loop’ so we lucky souls on here are privileged to be kept in the know about what the Board is up to
@glasshalffull said:
The Americans have been very patient and understanding up to now despite a delay in negotiations caused by the alternative bid. I very much hope that this hiccup is genuine and unavoidable, but I genuinely have no idea as I’m no longer ‘in the loop’ when it comes to insider information.
Sorry @glasshalffull but what is there to keep negotiating about? Surely they had a bid ready which was going to be presented to us months ago. There is no other bid now. All this horlicks that there were a few bits at the solicitors still to iron out, (hence no details could be issued for our edification), last Friday, is getting very hard to swallow/believe. It would be easier if there was a reason given for them not being able to make it, such as illness in the family or other business needs took priority. Can't make it, simply doesn't cut the mustard. Yet you will comment when speculation abounds. The trust need to let us know or come up with "plan C".
I have another theory though it's based on nothing more than intuition.
The Americans know the 75% threshold is an extremely high bar to jump over, which at the moment it's hard to see happening. So why not pretend to get cold feet once you know there are no other bids left on the table, leaving the club staring into the abyss? Then, when enough people have worked themselves into a frenzy worrying how the tax bill will be paid (or utilities, Dev, you take your pick) they ride back into town and everyone is so absurdly grateful that the 75% bar becomes more summountable.
It also buys them a little more time in case we do go down, when a retabled offer might all of a sudden become a little lower than before.
I've no idea whether any of that is likely, but it's certainly how I'd play it if making a bid myself.
Is the 75% an extremely high bar? How many does that need to vote for?
I'm not sure it is being debated as widely in the real world as it is in Gasroomia...
Other than that you may well be right @aloysius if of course you discount 'the Wycombe bug' and the expected fun journey...
@mooneyman said:
Fully agree @LX1 - providing we can get a competent Board to run it.
Do you honestly believe that having a different set of people in charge would turn a substantial deficit into a profit or even a break even scenario? And who would this new look board consist of? As far as I’m aware, even the most vociferous critics of the current board have not expressed any interest in volunteering to take their places.
surely @marlowchair is the only viable option...he knows where it is all going wrong and how to fix it. If the deal fails, get him and his hand-picked team in (not a power group) He's got my legacy vote.
@glasshalffull - If you honestly believe that the American's could turn us in to a profit making or break even business, why do you think it impossible for a competent Trust Board to do the same.
I agree we may not have the necessary talent within the supporter base, but we need to try a new approach, particularly if the Americans withdraw their bid.
@mooneyman said:
Fully agree @LX1 - providing we can get a competent Board to run it.
Do you honestly believe that having a different set of people in charge would turn a substantial deficit into a profit or even a break even scenario? And who would this new look board consist of? As far as I’m aware, even the most vociferous critics of the current board have not expressed any interest in volunteering to take their places.
I think some people on here seem to forget that our board members have full-time jobs (in the main) in addition to their role for our club.
Without knowing every single little detail of each and every deal they have made to bring income to the club how does anyone know if those deals were poor value for money.
As a part owner of a business with roughly the same turnover per annum as Wycombe I'm well aware of the juggling that sometimes is required to balance the books at the end of the month.
However I know that there are things I can do in my business that can lower the outgoings and increase the incomings.
Football clubs simply can't do this easily.
At the start of each season you can pretty much work out your outgoings (wages, running costs etc) however what you don't know is what your income will be apart from early season ticket sales and income from Football League / TV revenue.
The monthly incomings must be a nightmare to predict.
You will never know if that 'big' game due to take place on a Saturday in December will be postponed due to weather / cup games / internationals this would have serious affects on your monthly income.
Equally if you don't invest in the squad at the start of a season (increase in outgoings) and the team then struggles this could have a knock-on affect of lower crowds thus decreased incomings.
Anyone that claims they can understand football finance at the level Wycombe operate is lying. There are just too many unknown variables each and every month to accurately predict cashflow
I fully expect to get shouted down by certain posters but hey what the f##k
Thank you @glasshalffull, that is exactly what I've been saying on here for quite some time. Trust owned and run by volunteers sounds nice but I have little faith that the requisite 'boots' can be filled successfully or provide the time required to run the club properly. WWFC is million pound (plus) business and many people rely on it for their income. Playing around with volunteers, with the best will in the world, is not really the way to treat professionals or the way forward IMHO.
@mooneyman said: @glasshalffull - If you honestly believe that the American's could turn us in to a profit making or break even business, why do you think it impossible for a competent Trust Board to do the same.
I agree we may not have the necessary talent within the supporter base, but we need to try a new approach, particularly if the Americans withdraw their bid.
I didn’t say that the Americans would have all the answers. I asked if you believed a different board drawn from Trust members could improve matters significantly.
You agree that it’s unlikely and that a new approach is needed and surely that is exactly what the Trust board has said.
@mooneyman said:
Fully agree @LX1 - providing we can get a competent Board to run it.
Do you honestly believe that having a different set of people in charge would turn a substantial deficit into a profit or even a break even scenario? And who would this new look board consist of? As far as I’m aware, even the most vociferous critics of the current board have not expressed any interest in volunteering to take their places.
I think some people on here seem to forget that our board members have full-time jobs (in the main) in addition to their role for our club.
Without knowing every single little detail of each and every deal they have made to bring income to the club how does anyone know if those deals were poor value for money.
As a part owner of a business with roughly the same turnover per annum as Wycombe I'm well aware of the juggling that sometimes is required to balance the books at the end of the month.
However I know that there are things I can do in my business that can lower the outgoings and increase the incomings.
Football clubs simply can't do this easily.
At the start of each season you can pretty much work out your outgoings (wages, running costs etc) however what you don't know is what your income will be apart from early season ticket sales and income from Football League / TV revenue.
The monthly incomings must be a nightmare to predict.
You will never know if that 'big' game due to take place on a Saturday in December will be postponed due to weather / cup games / internationals this would have serious affects on your monthly income.
Equally if you don't invest in the squad at the start of a season (increase in outgoings) and the team then struggles this could have a knock-on affect of lower crowds thus decreased incomings.
Anyone that claims they can understand football finance at the level Wycombe operate is lying. There are just too many unknown variables each and every month to accurately predict cashflow
I fully expect to get shouted down by certain posters but hey what the f##k
Appreciate that but is it reason to relinquish Trust ownership?
@ValleyWanderer said:
Thank you @glasshalffull, that is exactly what I've been saying on here for quite some time. Trust owned and run by volunteers sounds nice but I have little faith that the requisite 'boots' can be filled successfully or provide the time required to run the club properly. WWFC is million pound (plus) business and many people rely on it for their income. Playing around with volunteers, with the best will in the world, is not really the way to treat professionals or the way forward IMHO.
Oops! Apologies to @Guppys_Left_Leg, I some how missed your excellent and incisive post prior to reading @glasshalffull.
Appreciate that but is it reason to relinquish Trust ownership?
Where in there did I say it was? I do believe under either ownership structure the running of a football club of our size is a near impossible and thankless job
Comments
That we tried to get clubs to take saunders and ended up paying him off?
Doesn't seem a stunning revelation to me. Bearing in mind the same happened at Brentford.
I don’t know about Dev’s claim that marlowchair has actually done any harm, but here’s a serious question:
Does a club ‘insider’ leaking confidential information and making unsubstantiated accusations actually help WWFC in any way?
well that all depends doesn't it?
If a whistleblower is leaking information about behaviour that is damaging the club and exposing it puts an end to it then it would help wouldn't it?
Only if those revelations could be effective in bringing about a change or end to that behaviour. As many people have said, I’m not sure that this forum is influential enough to achieve that.
You're probably right.
That said, the black and white campaign for more information surrounding the proposed new stadium played a part in that not going through and was brought to life on the old gasroom
Always worth remembering that "the Gasroom" isn't a sentient being, but a collection of (mainly) Wycombe Wanderers supporters. Would probably be more helpful to describe it as "some fans" rather than "The Gasroom" when referring to something we've read here
One post on this thread during the match yesterday. @marlowchair
You can fool some of the people
Is it conceivable that the reason tonight’s meeting is cancelled is due to the fact, that they now seek at 49% minority, then a majority later. Hence no vote would be needed on a minority. Just a thought
That level of optimism is on a par with @ryan_w_kirkby’s 3 year old daugher @TrueBlu
What a shower of shit this thread has become, I stopped by to see what was happening to our club but it seems infighting is the order of the day. Pity
One could also use the view that " for evil to succeed, it is only necessary for good men to do nothing"? Revolution has to start somewhere.
Just an observation, not meant as a personal insult Mr P. Let's be upfront here, there is clearly some "backroom" issues here and for once I agree with @DevC in his feelings that the USA deal is dead in the water and the Trust are looking at ways of "dressing the turd sandwich" before presentation. Hope I am wrong, but information voids are not helping.
The Americans have been very patient and understanding up to now despite a delay in negotiations caused by the alternative bid. I very much hope that this hiccup is genuine and unavoidable, but I genuinely have no idea as I’m no longer ‘in the loop’ when it comes to insider information.
With 3 historic clubs Bury, Bolton and Notts County in the news today, staring into the abyss, why on earth would anyone consider relinquishing trust ownership?
Let's take a lead and break the wheel
Fully agree @LX1 - providing we can get a competent Board to run it.
Don’t worry @glasshalffull. @marlowchair is clearly ‘in the loop’ so we lucky souls on here are privileged to be kept in the know about what the Board is up to
If you play the game of chairs, you win. Or you die.
Sorry @glasshalffull but what is there to keep negotiating about? Surely they had a bid ready which was going to be presented to us months ago. There is no other bid now. All this horlicks that there were a few bits at the solicitors still to iron out, (hence no details could be issued for our edification), last Friday, is getting very hard to swallow/believe. It would be easier if there was a reason given for them not being able to make it, such as illness in the family or other business needs took priority. Can't make it, simply doesn't cut the mustard. Yet you will comment when speculation abounds. The trust need to let us know or come up with "plan C".
Apparently now the club owe some yanks half a million quid the bidders have lost interest...
I have another theory though it's based on nothing more than intuition.
The Americans know the 75% threshold is an extremely high bar to jump over, which at the moment it's hard to see happening. So why not pretend to get cold feet once you know there are no other bids left on the table, leaving the club staring into the abyss? Then, when enough people have worked themselves into a frenzy worrying how the tax bill will be paid (or utilities, Dev, you take your pick) they ride back into town and everyone is so absurdly grateful that the 75% bar becomes more summountable.
It also buys them a little more time in case we do go down, when a retabled offer might all of a sudden become a little lower than before.
I've no idea whether any of that is likely, but it's certainly how I'd play it if making a bid myself.
Is the 75% an extremely high bar? How many does that need to vote for?
I'm not sure it is being debated as widely in the real world as it is in Gasroomia...
Other than that you may well be right @aloysius if of course you discount 'the Wycombe bug' and the expected fun journey...
We certainly fell for those tactics with the Hayes debacle @aloysius, so no reason why we couldn't be conned again.
Do you honestly believe that having a different set of people in charge would turn a substantial deficit into a profit or even a break even scenario? And who would this new look board consist of? As far as I’m aware, even the most vociferous critics of the current board have not expressed any interest in volunteering to take their places.
surely @marlowchair is the only viable option...he knows where it is all going wrong and how to fix it. If the deal fails, get him and his hand-picked team in (not a power group) He's got my legacy vote.
@glasshalffull - If you honestly believe that the American's could turn us in to a profit making or break even business, why do you think it impossible for a competent Trust Board to do the same.
I agree we may not have the necessary talent within the supporter base, but we need to try a new approach, particularly if the Americans withdraw their bid.
Well said @glasshalffull
I think some people on here seem to forget that our board members have full-time jobs (in the main) in addition to their role for our club.
Without knowing every single little detail of each and every deal they have made to bring income to the club how does anyone know if those deals were poor value for money.
As a part owner of a business with roughly the same turnover per annum as Wycombe I'm well aware of the juggling that sometimes is required to balance the books at the end of the month.
However I know that there are things I can do in my business that can lower the outgoings and increase the incomings.
Football clubs simply can't do this easily.
At the start of each season you can pretty much work out your outgoings (wages, running costs etc) however what you don't know is what your income will be apart from early season ticket sales and income from Football League / TV revenue.
The monthly incomings must be a nightmare to predict.
You will never know if that 'big' game due to take place on a Saturday in December will be postponed due to weather / cup games / internationals this would have serious affects on your monthly income.
Equally if you don't invest in the squad at the start of a season (increase in outgoings) and the team then struggles this could have a knock-on affect of lower crowds thus decreased incomings.
Anyone that claims they can understand football finance at the level Wycombe operate is lying. There are just too many unknown variables each and every month to accurately predict cashflow
I fully expect to get shouted down by certain posters but hey what the f##k
Thank you @glasshalffull, that is exactly what I've been saying on here for quite some time. Trust owned and run by volunteers sounds nice but I have little faith that the requisite 'boots' can be filled successfully or provide the time required to run the club properly. WWFC is million pound (plus) business and many people rely on it for their income. Playing around with volunteers, with the best will in the world, is not really the way to treat professionals or the way forward IMHO.
I didn’t say that the Americans would have all the answers. I asked if you believed a different board drawn from Trust members could improve matters significantly.
You agree that it’s unlikely and that a new approach is needed and surely that is exactly what the Trust board has said.
What a great post @Guppys_Left_Leg
Appreciate that but is it reason to relinquish Trust ownership?
Oops! Apologies to @Guppys_Left_Leg, I some how missed your excellent and incisive post prior to reading @glasshalffull.
Where in there did I say it was? I do believe under either ownership structure the running of a football club of our size is a near impossible and thankless job