Personally from what I saw on Sunday, I didn't find Forest's style of play attractive at all, particularly compared with Fulham's more effective style. Their build up was far too slow and I can't see it leading to enough goals to survive in the Premier League unless they splash a lot of cash to sign a couple of quality strikers with pace. However they won't get the thrashings Norwich and Watford got this season.
Being a 'different' team can help you in that first season - see Sheffield United (ok, they were radically different), Leeds and Brentford - it's the second season you've got to watch out for
The Forest way...like the West Ham way is largely a myth. I seem to recall people claiming we were the worst team to win the League never mind the European Cup. Twice😁 As fans of both and Leeds have found out in recent times...the best style is winning enough games to stay up!
French government now stating 70% of tickets being scanned were fake. Not entirely clear as it’s being translated but I think they mean 70% of those scanned at the first checkpoint, rather than those admitted to the stadiums Described as ‘industrial level’ fraud.
The French government can't seem to decide what their story is, but they certainly won't admit the police were in any way at fault (which feels familiar 🤔)...
How does a fake ticket scan differently to one that just hasn’t been printed correctly or one that is loaded up correctly on the base system. Should be very easy for the government to prove.
Saw plenty of people turned away from the Wembley turnstiles last week with tickets not scanning. Don’t ever remember anyone claiming they were fake. It just turned out the software running the scanning was missing a big batch of tickets as well as a batch being cancelled and reissued by the club in the days before.
Can’t see the Liverpool fans backing down on this one so it’s probably advisable the authorities give the facts rather than the propaganda.
Could not make both Wembley finals so kudos to those who did. Lots of my family were in there somewhere. Looking forward to great seasons for Wycombe and Forest next term...but I'm only paying for one! I only have a League One/Championship salary!
I must say having listened to and watched a lot of the build up to the championship play off final I was surprised when I turned it on and discovered that there were actually two teams taking part
The VAR seemed to understand the assignment though
I've really resisted commenting on here after what I witnessed in Paris on Saturday. But I feel as someone who was there and travels around Europe watching Liverpool regularly that a few things need clearing up (moved from Liverpool to Wycombe a long time ago and go to the odd Tuesday night or Saturday Wycombe game with friends).
Firstly, the tickets did not have any holograms on them. They had a QR code on and that's it. The hologram you get on the WWFC ticket is more genuine that the real ticket for the European Cup Final.. let that sink in.
There were reports of up to 6 different checkpoints before the stadium, there were none. I arrived at 1830 and was kettled under the bridge/slope up to the stadium where about 10 'stewards' were trying to do checks. Nowhere near enough and the only checkpoint there was. By 1845ish this was stopped and anyone could get to the ground (including those without tickets, predominantly local youths [google Saint Denis crime and as an area.. for info]).
The main three Liverpool gates were closed as people [again local youths.. check twitter videos for proof] were trying to gain entry without a ticket. The patience and calmness from Liverpool fans was something to behold as people just wanted to go in and watch their team in a European cup final, imagine if that was any Chairboy/girl? Wielding pepper spray and using it at free will was something I never thought I would see at a football game.
I managed to get in and find my friends (circa 1900 - two hours before kick off.....). Outside the stadium was a mess and this was over two hours before kick off, but yet the first excuse given was 'fans turning up late'. Again, video proof proving this to be false.
'It was only the Liverpool end' - again check twitter, ample videos of chaos on the Madrid side. Remember Spanish teams [fans] do not travel well in Europe.
During the game there were many individuals that were clearly not Liverpool fans, (PSG, Brazil and France shirts..) in our end. Again when aggro kicked off, the restraint from Liverpool fans was impressive. No one wants to get nicked or kicked out.
The narrative has now changed to 'fake tickets', two major issues with this. 1) To produce 40,000 fake tickets and distribute these with 3 weeks notice would be some logistical and supply chain miracle. Add in the fact it's illegal and banks have measures to prevent things like this. 2) IF big IF there were fake tickets then many of these would have been filtered out if there was checkpoints before the stadium, there wasn't and this is on UEFA.
Shouts of Hillsborough and Heysel and 'Liverpool should know better' are cheap, weak and frankly disgusting. Point scoring over dead bodies and an establishment cover up (that has been proven in a court of law) can only highlight what type of human you are. What is this was your family? What is this was your friends? What is this was Wycombe in Paris and the media were publishing out right lies?
Coming out of a stadium to gangs of local youths mugging the elderly, female and young children (again, check twitter for video evidence).
As football fans you can make cheap points but what does that achieve, it could have been you.
I'd normally apologise for writing a long post but this deserves it. To go to a football match and not feel safe is something that no one should experience (i've been to Napoli and Belgrade, neither were even close to this).
Happy to disprove any other myths about Liverpool fans if the little bacon rears his head on this post with his vile bigotry.
Great, and important, post @Insider. I have no affinity to Liverpool whatsoever, but I find it genuinely shocking how many intelligent people are ready to believe whatever anti-Liverpool bullsh*t narrative is put out.
Having lived & worked in Paris I am not at all surprised by
a) The shockingly poor organisation at Stade de France - it has always been crap
b) The police approach being based on "reputation" & "supposition" rather than actual behaviour - this really is par for the course with the police not just in Paris but generally across France
c) The gangs from the local estates seeing this as an opportunity to acquire phones, papers, cash, cards - St Denis has a been a hot bed of marginalised youth & criminality for well over 40 years
d) French political classes & EUFA blaming anyone but the real culprits, namely themselves...
I do think from what I have seen on social media etc. that the vast majority of fans (especially those supporting Liverpool) behaved with remarkable patience & restraint.
I’m not waiting for anything in particular @mooneyman other than, as our delightful son-in- law would put it, being in God’s waiting room. My impression of Forest as a side playing attractive football is based on limited observation and I didn’t think their performance at Wembley was truly representative. Brennan Johnson is usually a major attacking force but seemed somewhat subdued on Sunday.
British Gas engineer arrived as I was typing this and I’d forgotten all about it. In the meantime, I’ve caught up with all the insightful posts about the Stade de France shambles. My post feels very trite in comparison but, having written it, I felt I might as well post it, not least because, not for the first time, I was slightly bemused by @mooneyman’s comment.
Sadly I think this probably is the factor most likely to trigger a rethink at Uefa. Sponsors pay for brand visibility and the opportunity to take clients/staff/contacts to the game. Clearly, those on a corporate jolly will not have found the experience as they expected. Sponsors will want to see proper evidence that Uefa are able to prevent similar events in future or they will take their money elsewhere.
Comments
Not sure a season struggling to survive will necessarily produce footy to grace the Premier league but it's been a long time coming!
Personally from what I saw on Sunday, I didn't find Forest's style of play attractive at all, particularly compared with Fulham's more effective style. Their build up was far too slow and I can't see it leading to enough goals to survive in the Premier League unless they splash a lot of cash to sign a couple of quality strikers with pace. However they won't get the thrashings Norwich and Watford got this season.
I hope you don't tip over waiting @micra!!
Being a 'different' team can help you in that first season - see Sheffield United (ok, they were radically different), Leeds and Brentford - it's the second season you've got to watch out for
The Forest way...like the West Ham way is largely a myth. I seem to recall people claiming we were the worst team to win the League never mind the European Cup. Twice😁 As fans of both and Leeds have found out in recent times...the best style is winning enough games to stay up!
French government now stating 70% of tickets being scanned were fake. Not entirely clear as it’s being translated but I think they mean 70% of those scanned at the first checkpoint, rather than those admitted to the stadiums Described as ‘industrial level’ fraud.
The French government can't seem to decide what their story is, but they certainly won't admit the police were in any way at fault (which feels familiar 🤔)...
How does a fake ticket scan differently to one that just hasn’t been printed correctly or one that is loaded up correctly on the base system. Should be very easy for the government to prove.
Saw plenty of people turned away from the Wembley turnstiles last week with tickets not scanning. Don’t ever remember anyone claiming they were fake. It just turned out the software running the scanning was missing a big batch of tickets as well as a batch being cancelled and reissued by the club in the days before.
Can’t see the Liverpool fans backing down on this one so it’s probably advisable the authorities give the facts rather than the propaganda.
Presume these tickets were "proper" tickets with barcodes/holograms or the like.
As opposed to the slightly dodgy "print at home" type fare of our game. Those just scream for unscrupulous touts to make a killing printing loads off.
Apparently 100-odd members of the prawn sandwich brigade were caught up in bottlenecks too, so UEFA will probably take it seriously now
There were certainly a few queues at St Pancras though. A similar shambles to Chiltern’s service last week.
That said, East Midlands Railway are absolutely dire most of the time.
Could not make both Wembley finals so kudos to those who did. Lots of my family were in there somewhere. Looking forward to great seasons for Wycombe and Forest next term...but I'm only paying for one! I only have a League One/Championship salary!
On a par with Wayne Rooney?
I cannot afford new 40 players...
This isn’t going to help
https://mobile.twitter.com/SRFC_Infinity35/status/1531000939733196800?cxt=HBwWgICxucfPmr8qAAAA&cn=ZmxleGlibGVfcmVjcw%3D%3D&refsrc=email
Yeah, that was absolutely mental
I must say having listened to and watched a lot of the build up to the championship play off final I was surprised when I turned it on and discovered that there were actually two teams taking part
The VAR seemed to understand the assignment though
Jon Moss AND VAR @eric_plant give credit where it is due.
I've got a funny feeling that Port Vale might do well next season...
https://twitter.com/wanderersafc/status/1531279210546872320?t=lohpOs3d3e65p9xqvFYfxQ&s=19
Don't think they will come close to selling out.
Remember going to some horrible NFL Europe games there in the past. Not a stadium for a small ground
I've really resisted commenting on here after what I witnessed in Paris on Saturday. But I feel as someone who was there and travels around Europe watching Liverpool regularly that a few things need clearing up (moved from Liverpool to Wycombe a long time ago and go to the odd Tuesday night or Saturday Wycombe game with friends).
Firstly, the tickets did not have any holograms on them. They had a QR code on and that's it. The hologram you get on the WWFC ticket is more genuine that the real ticket for the European Cup Final.. let that sink in.
There were reports of up to 6 different checkpoints before the stadium, there were none. I arrived at 1830 and was kettled under the bridge/slope up to the stadium where about 10 'stewards' were trying to do checks. Nowhere near enough and the only checkpoint there was. By 1845ish this was stopped and anyone could get to the ground (including those without tickets, predominantly local youths [google Saint Denis crime and as an area.. for info]).
The main three Liverpool gates were closed as people [again local youths.. check twitter videos for proof] were trying to gain entry without a ticket. The patience and calmness from Liverpool fans was something to behold as people just wanted to go in and watch their team in a European cup final, imagine if that was any Chairboy/girl? Wielding pepper spray and using it at free will was something I never thought I would see at a football game.
I managed to get in and find my friends (circa 1900 - two hours before kick off.....). Outside the stadium was a mess and this was over two hours before kick off, but yet the first excuse given was 'fans turning up late'. Again, video proof proving this to be false.
'It was only the Liverpool end' - again check twitter, ample videos of chaos on the Madrid side. Remember Spanish teams [fans] do not travel well in Europe.
During the game there were many individuals that were clearly not Liverpool fans, (PSG, Brazil and France shirts..) in our end. Again when aggro kicked off, the restraint from Liverpool fans was impressive. No one wants to get nicked or kicked out.
The narrative has now changed to 'fake tickets', two major issues with this. 1) To produce 40,000 fake tickets and distribute these with 3 weeks notice would be some logistical and supply chain miracle. Add in the fact it's illegal and banks have measures to prevent things like this. 2) IF big IF there were fake tickets then many of these would have been filtered out if there was checkpoints before the stadium, there wasn't and this is on UEFA.
Shouts of Hillsborough and Heysel and 'Liverpool should know better' are cheap, weak and frankly disgusting. Point scoring over dead bodies and an establishment cover up (that has been proven in a court of law) can only highlight what type of human you are. What is this was your family? What is this was your friends? What is this was Wycombe in Paris and the media were publishing out right lies?
Coming out of a stadium to gangs of local youths mugging the elderly, female and young children (again, check twitter for video evidence).
As football fans you can make cheap points but what does that achieve, it could have been you.
I'd normally apologise for writing a long post but this deserves it. To go to a football match and not feel safe is something that no one should experience (i've been to Napoli and Belgrade, neither were even close to this).
Happy to disprove any other myths about Liverpool fans if the little bacon rears his head on this post with his vile bigotry.
Really glad you shared this @Insider, thanks.
Thanks @Insider I am no expert but even I thought the 70% (or similar figure) of fans had fake tickets claim was ludicrous.
Great, and important, post @Insider. I have no affinity to Liverpool whatsoever, but I find it genuinely shocking how many intelligent people are ready to believe whatever anti-Liverpool bullsh*t narrative is put out.
Having lived & worked in Paris I am not at all surprised by
a) The shockingly poor organisation at Stade de France - it has always been crap
b) The police approach being based on "reputation" & "supposition" rather than actual behaviour - this really is par for the course with the police not just in Paris but generally across France
c) The gangs from the local estates seeing this as an opportunity to acquire phones, papers, cash, cards - St Denis has a been a hot bed of marginalised youth & criminality for well over 40 years
d) French political classes & EUFA blaming anyone but the real culprits, namely themselves...
I do think from what I have seen on social media etc. that the vast majority of fans (especially those supporting Liverpool) behaved with remarkable patience & restraint.
I’m not waiting for anything in particular @mooneyman other than, as our delightful son-in- law would put it, being in God’s waiting room. My impression of Forest as a side playing attractive football is based on limited observation and I didn’t think their performance at Wembley was truly representative. Brennan Johnson is usually a major attacking force but seemed somewhat subdued on Sunday.
British Gas engineer arrived as I was typing this and I’d forgotten all about it. In the meantime, I’ve caught up with all the insightful posts about the Stade de France shambles. My post feels very trite in comparison but, having written it, I felt I might as well post it, not least because, not for the first time, I was slightly bemused by @mooneyman’s comment.
Sadly I think this probably is the factor most likely to trigger a rethink at Uefa. Sponsors pay for brand visibility and the opportunity to take clients/staff/contacts to the game. Clearly, those on a corporate jolly will not have found the experience as they expected. Sponsors will want to see proper evidence that Uefa are able to prevent similar events in future or they will take their money elsewhere.
https://youtu.be/U9tVw8RZ-58
Incredible commentary. Shades of the one-sided Rovers commentator on that highlights clip from the 90s.
I see they've just hiked their ST prices massively
Wrexham, that is