Picking Maguire is like leaving your window open when you go on holiday or making a car roof out of cheese, you might be alright but why in the hell would you take the chance.
It's the one area of concern in this England side. Couldn't be happier with the midfield options, couldn't be much happier on the flanks, couldn't be happier up front. Centre backs, find myself daydreaming about a parallel universe in which Sol Campbell and John Terry hit the scene 20 years later than they did.
I mean, we have one of the best CBs in the world in John Stones - who looks every bit as capable as a 6 now, too. Guehi and Colwill are fantastic prospects (ok, they're slightly beyond 'prospects' now), but we do look a little short after that.
I don't think we're short of centre backs who can do a job, I'd be more worried about wether we'll pick our best players when it matters or continue to favour the boys from the last few years, or even worse; if I have to listen to Graeme Souness talking about it.
I still feel our team selection is too cautious, considering who we have at our disposal. No need for Rice and Phillips together, to my mind.
Southgate managing this English team is like an elderly driver taking a Ferrari out for a spin. The performance will still be there, but there is also a lot of dormant horsepower.
Southgate may be saved from himself by the fact Jude and Rice are both very good players who can adapt and do a job further forward than where they are selected. Also have to bare in mind that we will need to play much better teams than that lot if we want to win anything.
Phillips is actually a decent player too and you'd like to think he'll move in January if pep won't pick him. As for Henderson he'll be a few months older and a bit more out of it and likely a figure around the squad rather than a key choice if he's still there. Maguire it's harder to see getting back into any routine, he's on too much money at Utd and seems to want to stay there and collect his £ rather than rebuild his career elsewhere, that should end his career as much as any performances.
Guehi and Coliwell are indeed great prospects, would be delighted if these two develop into top end internationals that could be mentioned in the same breath as Campbell and Terry. If Guehi could talk Michael Olise into declaring for England, that would be nice too.
Tomori is also quietly winning leagues and playing in Europe with Milan and Dunk doing well with Brighton, White at Arsenal too if he's still in consideration. No real leaders or outstanding proven star types there at the moment but maybe but might be different in a few months. Would rather we had dependable plodders there and better players further forward.
But a lot of people have the perception that on the level of talent we have, that's he underachieved with them and doesn't fully utilise their abilities for some kind of Brazil 70 esque style.
He doesn't - and his cautiousness was a key factor in losing the Euro final - but England also don't have the divine right to win tournaments as some seem to think. They've not been the best team in the world for a very long time (not that the world's best necessarily wins the major silverware, admittedly).
Some clichéd nonsense in this thread. I don't think there are many England fans who believe we have the "divine right to win everything".
Consider where England were when Southgate took over and where we are now, then consider whether he's done a good job (if you need reminding and can bear it, go and rewatch that Iceland game in 2016, it's literally unbelievable)
Southgate may feel he could have done certain things differently but he's accumulating experience and you don't just throw all that away lightly and start again with someone new (have a look at Gareth Ainsworth's career trajectory as Wycombe manager)
He's earned the right to lead us into next summer's tournament and I believe there is a very very good chance we will win it
I think managers - like any professionals - have strengths and weaknesses. They don't always have to be analyzed as sitting on one extreme or the other.
I think Southgate has some great qualities that have indeed pushed England forward - his team building, for instance, has possibly been the best we have known, especially considering some of the (openly acknowledged) tribalism in the "golden generation" years.
That being said, I do think he is massively conservative when he does not always need to be. It is again a mixed bag - I blame him for losing the Euro final (waiting for Italy to score instead of making obvious substitutions to change the game) but he also deserves credit for getting us there, so ultimately he thoroughly deserves that runners up medal both from an earned perspective and a missed opportunity perspective.
It's okay for managers to be talented in some areas and flawed in others, rather than assuming they must be either flawless or completely incompetent.
Reading have been deducted another 3 points,surely if the keep breaking the rules the points deduction should be much bigger or they'll just keep taking the piss.
I never agitate for clubs to go under, but I can imagine Reading going to the wall simply because they are so bland that everyone forgets to save them.
Ainsworth and Blooms now 64th and 65th longest tenured managers of the 92 despite just 201 days in the job each. Make it to a year and they will likely both be more or less top half!
Comments
England are playing wonderfully. An absolute joy to watch these players
Actually, Maddison in his evolved role for Spurs is in the picture too.
Picking Maguire is like leaving your window open when you go on holiday or making a car roof out of cheese, you might be alright but why in the hell would you take the chance.
He's one of several who have overstayed their welcome
It's the one area of concern in this England side. Couldn't be happier with the midfield options, couldn't be much happier on the flanks, couldn't be happier up front. Centre backs, find myself daydreaming about a parallel universe in which Sol Campbell and John Terry hit the scene 20 years later than they did.
I mean, we have one of the best CBs in the world in John Stones - who looks every bit as capable as a 6 now, too. Guehi and Colwill are fantastic prospects (ok, they're slightly beyond 'prospects' now), but we do look a little short after that.
I don't think we're short of centre backs who can do a job, I'd be more worried about wether we'll pick our best players when it matters or continue to favour the boys from the last few years, or even worse; if I have to listen to Graeme Souness talking about it.
I still feel our team selection is too cautious, considering who we have at our disposal. No need for Rice and Phillips together, to my mind.
Southgate managing this English team is like an elderly driver taking a Ferrari out for a spin. The performance will still be there, but there is also a lot of dormant horsepower.
Love your terminology "an elderly" @Shev , though I prefer the description as "senior" as I have got older! 😉
Southgate may be saved from himself by the fact Jude and Rice are both very good players who can adapt and do a job further forward than where they are selected. Also have to bare in mind that we will need to play much better teams than that lot if we want to win anything.
Phillips is actually a decent player too and you'd like to think he'll move in January if pep won't pick him. As for Henderson he'll be a few months older and a bit more out of it and likely a figure around the squad rather than a key choice if he's still there. Maguire it's harder to see getting back into any routine, he's on too much money at Utd and seems to want to stay there and collect his £ rather than rebuild his career elsewhere, that should end his career as much as any performances.
Guehi and Coliwell are indeed great prospects, would be delighted if these two develop into top end internationals that could be mentioned in the same breath as Campbell and Terry. If Guehi could talk Michael Olise into declaring for England, that would be nice too.
Tomori is also quietly winning leagues and playing in Europe with Milan and Dunk doing well with Brighton, White at Arsenal too if he's still in consideration. No real leaders or outstanding proven star types there at the moment but maybe but might be different in a few months. Would rather we had dependable plodders there and better players further forward.
I know he lacks the pizzazz of El Tel but isn't Southgate one of our most successful England managers?
On stats and tournament progression yes.
But a lot of people have the perception that on the level of talent we have, that's he underachieved with them and doesn't fully utilise their abilities for some kind of Brazil 70 esque style.
He doesn't - and his cautiousness was a key factor in losing the Euro final - but England also don't have the divine right to win tournaments as some seem to think. They've not been the best team in the world for a very long time (not that the world's best necessarily wins the major silverware, admittedly).
Sort of good results covering up for poor performances? (I'm gradually getting the hang of this football lark.)
Some clichéd nonsense in this thread. I don't think there are many England fans who believe we have the "divine right to win everything".
Consider where England were when Southgate took over and where we are now, then consider whether he's done a good job (if you need reminding and can bear it, go and rewatch that Iceland game in 2016, it's literally unbelievable)
Southgate may feel he could have done certain things differently but he's accumulating experience and you don't just throw all that away lightly and start again with someone new (have a look at Gareth Ainsworth's career trajectory as Wycombe manager)
He's earned the right to lead us into next summer's tournament and I believe there is a very very good chance we will win it
I'm struggling to see where anyone said England had "the divine right to win everything".
I think managers - like any professionals - have strengths and weaknesses. They don't always have to be analyzed as sitting on one extreme or the other.
I think Southgate has some great qualities that have indeed pushed England forward - his team building, for instance, has possibly been the best we have known, especially considering some of the (openly acknowledged) tribalism in the "golden generation" years.
That being said, I do think he is massively conservative when he does not always need to be. It is again a mixed bag - I blame him for losing the Euro final (waiting for Italy to score instead of making obvious substitutions to change the game) but he also deserves credit for getting us there, so ultimately he thoroughly deserves that runners up medal both from an earned perspective and a missed opportunity perspective.
It's okay for managers to be talented in some areas and flawed in others, rather than assuming they must be either flawless or completely incompetent.
Reading docked three more points: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/66802229. It's looking pretty grim there, in spite of having a talented bunch of young players.
Reading have been deducted another 3 points,surely if the keep breaking the rules the points deduction should be much bigger or they'll just keep taking the piss.
I couldn't believe people (not even their own fans) were tipping Reading for play-offs. They're a basket case.
...Or that he deserves the sack.
But not picking players who were great for him a couple of years ago but now don't play at all would help.
Reading forum seems to have reached 'acceptance' in the 5 stages of grief
Another day another deduction. Chap in charge is just lying now.
@StrongestTeam: Declan and Bellingham are also very good players.
To be fair, @ReturnToSenda, you did say that some seemed to think it, whether they believed it or not.
I never agitate for clubs to go under, but I can imagine Reading going to the wall simply because they are so bland that everyone forgets to save them.
Ainsworth and Blooms now 64th and 65th longest tenured managers of the 92 despite just 201 days in the job each. Make it to a year and they will likely both be more or less top half!
You literally wrote "also don't have the divine right to win tournaments as some seem to think."
Madness