@LX1 said:
….I appreciate my experience doesnt encompass the whole stadium though. Security was dreadful on Sunday. How ticketless fans managed to get to the turnstiles I dont know
Fans trying to rush the turnstiles is appalling. But equally appalling to me was the images of a “steward”, presumably trained in crowd management, just wildly kicking the legs away of people running past him. They looked to be vicious kicks and connected with a few.
In the mid /late 90s anyone could be a steward if they were free that day and wanted £15/20. Towards the end of that time a bit of training and screening seemed to be coming through and clubs started to see the value of using regular staff who had some link to the club, you'd hope it's much better now...
Hopefully the leadership is better now too, though from those scenes it does not appear to be the case. I was part of the first part of your post as a teenager in the late 90s, stewarding at Chelsea and Stevenage, with most of the other stewards looking like they were in their teens or early twenties. The actual security heads would give us a pep talk before the game with a few pointers, disappear for the game (usually watching it from a prime spot, from what I know) and if a really difficult job came up that might result in abuse, they would make sure a poorly-paid teenage steward had to do it! Leading from the back at it's most lurid.
Might have bumped into you at Chelsea at some point. Will never forget my first match stewarding at Reading via a HW agency. Most of my class at college were lead towards the away end , told to watch out for Birmingham "Zulus" who might want to try and cut you in a permanent way. That was about all of the training. Got about £14 for that
It might have been the same agency (can't remember) as I did Elm Park once (v Charlton). I only did one season (1996-97) though. Your training sounds about right, too! I remember one security head who had 'war stories' about picking up ripped off ears from the terrace at Upton Park, but he could not hide fast enough at the first sign of crowd trouble.
Yeah, Recruit, opposite the Firkin , think I was probably a year earlier.
Also there was another company round the corner did some posher events, still run by an idiot , saw that guy on TV a few years later failing miserably to stop some random intruder guy giving Hoddle grief at the press conference after he got sacked.
I did a bit of stewarding at Chelsea in the late 80s through an agency on Frogmoor if memory serves. It was very much as @Shev described it, but with a bit more violence.
It's seems two obscure people had their twitter accounts hacked by people who sent out racist messages in their name just after the penalties. These racists computer experts, eh? Targetting innocent estate agents and football coaches. I wonder how many more poor people have had to go in to their boss with that story today?
As an antidote to the stories you'll have been reading about the disgusting behaviour of some people attending the England game (I refuse to call them fans) and the comments seen on social media (I don't use it and am glad) I'm going to tell you of my experience on Sunday.
The background being that one of the abiding memories of my sons childhood, is of him sitting on the sofa when Southgate missed his penalty in 96 and seeing him sobbing his eyes out (sorry son). We're both lifelong Wycombe fans and attend matches together home and away whenever it's possible.
Roll forward to just after the world cup exit in 2018 and he was adamant that we would have a good chance in Euro 2020 and this was our chance to go to some qualifiers - earn the necessary loyalty "caps" - and hopefully watch England at least win a knockout game at a major tournament and maybe make some history.
So it came that we managed to secure tickets for England v Germany, Denmark and Italy. I was able to attend the Germany game which was simply sublime - prior to Sunday, by greatest football memory even above watching Wycombe.
Come Sunday morning I was too nervous to settle and so agreed to meet son and his friends in Marylebone at 3pm rather than later at Wembley. They had started their day by meeting for breakfast, so I thought things might be a bit wild by the time I arrived.
None of it, they were all sober and we chatted about our chances and expectations for the day, sharing the conversation with some Man City fans on the table next to us at the pub. Nothing sinister, just good football fans enjoying themselves on what we hoped would be a great day to remember.
The walk to Marylebone and train to Wembley Stadium was uneventful although it was getting busy when we arrived at 5pm just outside Wembley Arena where son was meeting another group - fans of AFC Wimbledon - that he knows through work and having attended Euro 2016 in France with one of them.
The noise was incredible, but everyone was happy and people were just chatting to each other about could England win. We meet fans from Mexico trying to obtain tickets - they knew the chances were vanishingly small, but were still happy just to be there soaking up the atmosphere.
We listened to a group of Asian young men give their unique rendition of Football's Coming Home, we watching people hugging each other just over the joy of England being in the final. We heard the fans on Wembley Way chanting, singing and dancing.
Yes some flares were let off, yes some fireworks went off, yes there were a lot of empty beer cans and bottles on the ground because the bins couldn't cope but 99% of the people I witnessed put their empties as close to the bin as the could.
It was chaotic but it wasn't the sea of mindless scum from here to eternity that the media would have you believe we're the only people there.
As 7pm approached we decided it was time to make our way into the stadium and my nerves were really on edge. Would my Covid pass be valid? Would my phone work to activate the ticket, would it get stolen?
As it transpired the process was relatively smooth, yes people were anguish to get through these checks but the stewarding was efficient and everyone was in the same boat so noone was pushing and shoving unduly. I felt perfectly safe and there was no evidence of any threatening behaviour by anyone.
As we walked around the concourse area to entrance gate C, there was signs that the crowds trying to get through turnstiles were being held up as the queues were much greater than at the Germany game but still everyone was in good humour. Even enough time to take a selfie in front of the Bobby Moore statue.
At gate C we duly joined the queue and you could tell everyone was getting jittery we all just wanted to get through the turnstile and into the stadium.
I made sure the young boy and girl in front of me didn't get separated from their father just in front - he had the tickets on his phone. As it was someone else let go go ahead, so they all entered together.
By now it was evident that a few people were hovering by the turnstile entrance trying to tailgate people but to a man the fans with tickets let them know this wasn't acceptable and if they didn't leave things could get ugly. There was one steward that I saw trying to control maybe 200/300 people though about 5 turnstiles. He couldn't do anything to police this on his own.
Finally the moment arrived for me to scan my ticket and walk through. Would it work or would those behind me think I too was trying to scam my way in. Luckily I had the experience of the Germany game to fall back on and knew to push my phone into the scanner as far as possible. The light was green - I could enter!
I had a very anguish wait just inside the stadium as son had fallen behind me in the queue. Would he make it too? As I waited I did witness 2 people being ejected who had clearly tailgated through the turnstile but here they had maybe 2 security staff per turnstile and it was obvious as people entered if two came through on 1 ticket. I don't believe at gate C it was possible to enter without a valid ticket.
Finally son emerged and we had made it. England in the final and we would be there to witness it!
I don't recall much of the 20 minutes prior to kick off standing by our seats other than the tremendous sound and emotion of the fans singing Sweet Caroline - can't deny I shed a few years.
Then finally the teams were out on the pitch and time for the national anthems. Maybe because of the criticism of the booing in earlier games but I only witnessed England fans either stand in silence during the Italian anthem or clapping for the entire duration. Similarly when players took the knee almost everyone around me clapped their support, noone was booing. And these were the fans who'd probably attended most qualifiers so could arguably be the most fanatic England supporters.
You know what happened in the game - sadly - no need for me to say anything except I shed more tears.
After the match had ended and we'd finally recovered enough to leave the stadium we joined the trudge of emotionally drained fans back to Wembley Stadium station in the rain. Stopping only long enough for one final conversation about what positives we could take from the tournament and to acknowledge that it was quite likely there might be some social media criticism of Radford, Sancho and Saka but none of us who were there believed the players had given anything but their best - they had done us proud.
Can't wait for Euro 2024 in Germany, son has said we have to do it all again!
Apologies for the long, tedious, post but I've been devastated the last 2 days to hear and see all the media focusing on the very few mindless scum who tarnish the image of the majority of football fans in this country. My experience on Sunday was enjoyable, safe, multi-cultural, respectful, non-racist and largely sober. I thank my fellow football fans at Wembley and the entire England team for making it by far my best football experience ever.
But mostly I thank my son for being my football buddy and for making me go.
And I’m sure your experience, behaviour, attitude and emotion was the same as 99% of people there but that does not make headlines.
Fans turnstile diving has been going on for as long as I’ve going to football. At the old Wembley I’m sure all of us knew the drain pipe that was frequently shinned up. But again not really that newsworthy
Don't apologise @Twizz , not tedius at all. It would be nice if non football people could realise that it is only a small amount of people that cause the trouble, and that the other 99% are decent honest people
Good read @Twizz, too many twats follow England but plenty of decent folk too, btw if 2024 in Deutschland is anything like 2006 was you'll have a great time.
As @Twizz son in question I can second all of that. All three games were brilliant and I was genuinely shocked to read reports of disturbances.
There are some morons around but in my experience going to England games the overwhelming majority are respectful, decent folk. Basically the same mix as you get at any club game.
My experience in France in 2016 was similar. Newspaper reports would suggest the whole place was a war zone. Meanwhile we were having a few drinks with England supporters and opposing fans alike (we played an hr of table tennis with two Russians before the game against them) and then watching the game without any bother at all.
This isn’t to pretend that there weren’t issues on Sunday. There is clear evidence of some disturbances. Throwing glass bottles, trying to force the gates etc is idiotic. But we should keep a bit of perspective. These are a minority of plonkers amongst tens of thousands attending the game and literally millions watching elsewhere who were perfectly well behaved.
@ReturnToSenda said:
HIGNFY and Private Eye seem to have a habit of making classist 'jokes' at the expense of football / football fans, and it's kind of fucked.
Big link between the two and you certainly wouldn’t say he was a football expert at all. People tend to mock what they don’t know. It’s best ignored.
Interesting to read all the positive experiences about going to Sunday’s match. They don’t match those I heard from people I know but it’s good to balance
There is an argument that highlighting and tackling the bad behaviour is how it gets reduced but I also know people who have travelled with England for years and never seen any trouble until they watch the news.
On the socials, I’m drawn like a moth to the flame, to the outpourings of marginalised character actor, Laurence ‘Lozza’ Fox. Mainly because I’m convinced it’s all for a film - what other reason can it be?
I did enjoy when he cracked and suddenly got all ‘I was wrong’ before the final, enraging his rabid followers, but within seconds of the defeat he was back rambling on about knee-taking pussies again.
With his combat fatigues, mirror shades and manky little roll up fags, he truly is (as memorably described) the Waitrose Tommy Robinson.
@arnos_grove said:
On the socials, I’m drawn like a moth to the flame, to the outpourings of marginalised character actor, Laurence ‘Lozza’ Fox. Mainly because I’m convinced it’s all for a film - what other reason can it be?
I did enjoy when he cracked and suddenly got all ‘I was wrong’ before the final, enraging his rabid followers, but within seconds of the defeat he was back rambling on about knee-taking pussies again.
With his combat fatigues, mirror shades and manky little roll up fags, he truly is (as memorably described) the Waitrose Tommy Robinson.
Some of the far right shitehawks who've made gains (both in numbers and shady £ support) are boxing themselves into corners, they gain their successes by using the most rabid to do the rousing and leg work whilst appearing at least semi reasonable to attract wider sympathy. Hopefully what we are seeing with some of these goons (including some in government) is that when they show there true colours making themselves unpalatable to the mainstream they either lie, in which case people keep receipts and need to call them out, and then they climb down and thereby also alienate their bases.
I assume unless he starts appearing in some Stephen seagall straight to videos or teams up with the Brexit Mumford to make sweet folk music for skinheads, Mr Fox needs to keep the Gammon pound streaming in to his 'political party' to keep him and his mates in expensive non-social distancing dinners and rizlas.
Comments
Yeah, Recruit, opposite the Firkin , think I was probably a year earlier.
Also there was another company round the corner did some posher events, still run by an idiot , saw that guy on TV a few years later failing miserably to stop some random intruder guy giving Hoddle grief at the press conference after he got sacked.
We are going to get the book absolutely hurled at us https://theathletic.com/2703455/2021/07/13/english-footballs-day-of-embarrassment-and-why-it-has-damaged-2030-world-cup-bid
I did a bit of stewarding at Chelsea in the late 80s through an agency on Frogmoor if memory serves. It was very much as @Shev described it, but with a bit more violence.
It's seems two obscure people had their twitter accounts hacked by people who sent out racist messages in their name just after the penalties. These racists computer experts, eh? Targetting innocent estate agents and football coaches. I wonder how many more poor people have had to go in to their boss with that story today?
As an antidote to the stories you'll have been reading about the disgusting behaviour of some people attending the England game (I refuse to call them fans) and the comments seen on social media (I don't use it and am glad) I'm going to tell you of my experience on Sunday.
The background being that one of the abiding memories of my sons childhood, is of him sitting on the sofa when Southgate missed his penalty in 96 and seeing him sobbing his eyes out (sorry son). We're both lifelong Wycombe fans and attend matches together home and away whenever it's possible.
Roll forward to just after the world cup exit in 2018 and he was adamant that we would have a good chance in Euro 2020 and this was our chance to go to some qualifiers - earn the necessary loyalty "caps" - and hopefully watch England at least win a knockout game at a major tournament and maybe make some history.
So it came that we managed to secure tickets for England v Germany, Denmark and Italy. I was able to attend the Germany game which was simply sublime - prior to Sunday, by greatest football memory even above watching Wycombe.
Come Sunday morning I was too nervous to settle and so agreed to meet son and his friends in Marylebone at 3pm rather than later at Wembley. They had started their day by meeting for breakfast, so I thought things might be a bit wild by the time I arrived.
None of it, they were all sober and we chatted about our chances and expectations for the day, sharing the conversation with some Man City fans on the table next to us at the pub. Nothing sinister, just good football fans enjoying themselves on what we hoped would be a great day to remember.
The walk to Marylebone and train to Wembley Stadium was uneventful although it was getting busy when we arrived at 5pm just outside Wembley Arena where son was meeting another group - fans of AFC Wimbledon - that he knows through work and having attended Euro 2016 in France with one of them.
The noise was incredible, but everyone was happy and people were just chatting to each other about could England win. We meet fans from Mexico trying to obtain tickets - they knew the chances were vanishingly small, but were still happy just to be there soaking up the atmosphere.
We listened to a group of Asian young men give their unique rendition of Football's Coming Home, we watching people hugging each other just over the joy of England being in the final. We heard the fans on Wembley Way chanting, singing and dancing.
Yes some flares were let off, yes some fireworks went off, yes there were a lot of empty beer cans and bottles on the ground because the bins couldn't cope but 99% of the people I witnessed put their empties as close to the bin as the could.
It was chaotic but it wasn't the sea of mindless scum from here to eternity that the media would have you believe we're the only people there.
As 7pm approached we decided it was time to make our way into the stadium and my nerves were really on edge. Would my Covid pass be valid? Would my phone work to activate the ticket, would it get stolen?
As it transpired the process was relatively smooth, yes people were anguish to get through these checks but the stewarding was efficient and everyone was in the same boat so noone was pushing and shoving unduly. I felt perfectly safe and there was no evidence of any threatening behaviour by anyone.
As we walked around the concourse area to entrance gate C, there was signs that the crowds trying to get through turnstiles were being held up as the queues were much greater than at the Germany game but still everyone was in good humour. Even enough time to take a selfie in front of the Bobby Moore statue.
At gate C we duly joined the queue and you could tell everyone was getting jittery we all just wanted to get through the turnstile and into the stadium.
I made sure the young boy and girl in front of me didn't get separated from their father just in front - he had the tickets on his phone. As it was someone else let go go ahead, so they all entered together.
By now it was evident that a few people were hovering by the turnstile entrance trying to tailgate people but to a man the fans with tickets let them know this wasn't acceptable and if they didn't leave things could get ugly. There was one steward that I saw trying to control maybe 200/300 people though about 5 turnstiles. He couldn't do anything to police this on his own.
Finally the moment arrived for me to scan my ticket and walk through. Would it work or would those behind me think I too was trying to scam my way in. Luckily I had the experience of the Germany game to fall back on and knew to push my phone into the scanner as far as possible. The light was green - I could enter!
I had a very anguish wait just inside the stadium as son had fallen behind me in the queue. Would he make it too? As I waited I did witness 2 people being ejected who had clearly tailgated through the turnstile but here they had maybe 2 security staff per turnstile and it was obvious as people entered if two came through on 1 ticket. I don't believe at gate C it was possible to enter without a valid ticket.
Finally son emerged and we had made it. England in the final and we would be there to witness it!
I don't recall much of the 20 minutes prior to kick off standing by our seats other than the tremendous sound and emotion of the fans singing Sweet Caroline - can't deny I shed a few years.
Then finally the teams were out on the pitch and time for the national anthems. Maybe because of the criticism of the booing in earlier games but I only witnessed England fans either stand in silence during the Italian anthem or clapping for the entire duration. Similarly when players took the knee almost everyone around me clapped their support, noone was booing. And these were the fans who'd probably attended most qualifiers so could arguably be the most fanatic England supporters.
You know what happened in the game - sadly - no need for me to say anything except I shed more tears.
After the match had ended and we'd finally recovered enough to leave the stadium we joined the trudge of emotionally drained fans back to Wembley Stadium station in the rain. Stopping only long enough for one final conversation about what positives we could take from the tournament and to acknowledge that it was quite likely there might be some social media criticism of Radford, Sancho and Saka but none of us who were there believed the players had given anything but their best - they had done us proud.
Can't wait for Euro 2024 in Germany, son has said we have to do it all again!
Apologies for the long, tedious, post but I've been devastated the last 2 days to hear and see all the media focusing on the very few mindless scum who tarnish the image of the majority of football fans in this country. My experience on Sunday was enjoyable, safe, multi-cultural, respectful, non-racist and largely sober. I thank my fellow football fans at Wembley and the entire England team for making it by far my best football experience ever.
But mostly I thank my son for being my football buddy and for making me go.
Thank you for taking the time to post that, @Twizz. Very heartening to hear about the better side of things!
@Twizz not jealous at all at your experience.
And I’m sure your experience, behaviour, attitude and emotion was the same as 99% of people there but that does not make headlines.
Fans turnstile diving has been going on for as long as I’ve going to football. At the old Wembley I’m sure all of us knew the drain pipe that was frequently shinned up. But again not really that newsworthy
Even more so when you know there's 30,000 empty seats in there once you get in!
Not at all tedious @Twizz, thank you for sharing. I hope you sent the same thoughts to all the major media outlets? You should.
Don't apologise @Twizz , not tedius at all. It would be nice if non football people could realise that it is only a small amount of people that cause the trouble, and that the other 99% are decent honest people
Good read @Twizz, too many twats follow England but plenty of decent folk too, btw if 2024 in Deutschland is anything like 2006 was you'll have a great time.
As @Twizz son in question I can second all of that. All three games were brilliant and I was genuinely shocked to read reports of disturbances.
There are some morons around but in my experience going to England games the overwhelming majority are respectful, decent folk. Basically the same mix as you get at any club game.
My experience in France in 2016 was similar. Newspaper reports would suggest the whole place was a war zone. Meanwhile we were having a few drinks with England supporters and opposing fans alike (we played an hr of table tennis with two Russians before the game against them) and then watching the game without any bother at all.
This isn’t to pretend that there weren’t issues on Sunday. There is clear evidence of some disturbances. Throwing glass bottles, trying to force the gates etc is idiotic. But we should keep a bit of perspective. These are a minority of plonkers amongst tens of thousands attending the game and literally millions watching elsewhere who were perfectly well behaved.
F.A.O. Twizz - that was brilliant, thank you.
You must be a touch typist.
HIGNFY and Private Eye seem to have a habit of making classist 'jokes' at the expense of football / football fans, and it's kind of fucked.
They're public schoolboys with contempt for the working class.
Big link between the two and you certainly wouldn’t say he was a football expert at all. People tend to mock what they don’t know. It’s best ignored.
Interesting to read all the positive experiences about going to Sunday’s match. They don’t match those I heard from people I know but it’s good to balance
There is an argument that highlighting and tackling the bad behaviour is how it gets reduced but I also know people who have travelled with England for years and never seen any trouble until they watch the news.
On the socials, I’m drawn like a moth to the flame, to the outpourings of marginalised character actor, Laurence ‘Lozza’ Fox. Mainly because I’m convinced it’s all for a film - what other reason can it be?
I did enjoy when he cracked and suddenly got all ‘I was wrong’ before the final, enraging his rabid followers, but within seconds of the defeat he was back rambling on about knee-taking pussies again.
With his combat fatigues, mirror shades and manky little roll up fags, he truly is (as memorably described) the Waitrose Tommy Robinson.
I’m sure it’s not good for me, but I admit I’m addicted. And talking of which, this was a great read on the subject https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/07/twitter-addict-realizes-she-needs-rehab/619343/
Some of the far right shitehawks who've made gains (both in numbers and shady £ support) are boxing themselves into corners, they gain their successes by using the most rabid to do the rousing and leg work whilst appearing at least semi reasonable to attract wider sympathy. Hopefully what we are seeing with some of these goons (including some in government) is that when they show there true colours making themselves unpalatable to the mainstream they either lie, in which case people keep receipts and need to call them out, and then they climb down and thereby also alienate their bases.
I assume unless he starts appearing in some Stephen seagall straight to videos or teams up with the Brexit Mumford to make sweet folk music for skinheads, Mr Fox needs to keep the Gammon pound streaming in to his 'political party' to keep him and his mates in expensive non-social distancing dinners and rizlas.
Fox went from just being an extremely ignorant ex public school boy to fash for cash grifter in record time.
If you've ever heard any of his music, that was never going to be his route to riches.
Italy were fabulous during the euros...a breath of fresh air #forzaazzurr
What an obnoxious character. And I only know anything about him from his appearances on Celebrity Gogglebox. At least I assume it’s him.
Thanks @Twizz great post I felt I was there rather than drinking chocolate Horlicks and going through a packet of jammy dodgers at home.