You can't really have "in person" lessons whilst quarantining. Far from overplaying it the suggestion is that far more would have tested positive if they could actually get tests.
No wonder really that those (however few) who spent their £9k fees plus rent and travelled across the country as directed are pissed at being held on immediate lockdown.
Business-lead pushes use agreeable papers to pressure politicians. Most of the larger ones are losing money now and probably only still exist to provide a bit of influence for their owners.
If it helps inform the debate I have twins who both started Uni in halls of residence this year. The one in Sheffield (moved in listening to the Blackburn scores come through) is in full isolation and lockdown with 3 positives in her bubble of 10.
The other, down at Harrow (moved in listening to the Rotherham result), is currently having a whale of a time with a mixed batch of in-person and on-line learning and heading into Central London fairly often.
That's not surprising, the number of conspiracy theorists sharing that fringe report was shocking.
Working in a vaguely related field within science and still having visibility of lots of people I met at University on my course/related courses via social media, it's obviously a tiny minority that think follow the thinking of that letter. I suppose for people that have no link into "the world of science" it was an easy thing for them to grab onto that fits their chosen narrative
It is a minority, but just to show how access to information doesn't easily bring clarity there were also those further on the scientific fringe arguing the Barrington declaration was also missing the point. You can of course get legitimate dissent within the scientific community, where knowledge of an issue is growing over time. This is why clear messages from government, proper numbers and a competent action plan were critical to public confidence, and we've not had that.
Is it bonkers though? The club wants to maximise matchday revenue, that means selling hospitality packages to sponsors and other businesses (see thread on Woodlands Lounge). This will allow them to do that, with the enticement of meeting players not in the matchday squad etc. At the same time, numbers will be small enough to be able to provide the table service with social distancing demanded by the govt.
Is it unfair that people paying for hospitality will get to watch the match in the flesh while others won't (and let's not be naive - clearly they'll spill out of the Woodlands and into the executive boxes while the match is underway)? Certainly. But will they be able to get in and out of the ground safely because of the small numbers? Yes. And will they be the sort of supporters who celebrate a Wycombe goal in the middle of a pandemic by attempting a conga? Probably not.
Clubs need the revenue, fine, but it's bonkers - although not surprising - that there are more and more indoor events/gatherings being allowed yet we still can't go and sit in the open air.
More crazy that this is being considered at a time that more and more areas of the country look like they'll be under measures that shut all hospitality full stop
If they had a proper testing regime and track and trace system in place the above would be entirely possible. They haven't. It isn't. Some 'perfectly healthy' people contracted it and some of them even died. Government have had six months to make vital decisions...they have managed to make Nicola Sturgeon look like a stateswoman.
Nicola Sturgeon doesn’t faff about. Her messages are clear and to the point, uncluttered with the histrionics and mannerisms further muddying the already convoluted utterances of our own bumbling “leader”.
She does faff about... that smp that decided to come down on the train with covid and go back again just so she could claim her expenses should've been sacked over a week ago, but wee Jimmy krankie was probably laughing as she hates the Englush
@HolmerBlue said:
She does faff about... that smp that decided to come down on the train with covid and go back again just so she could claim her expenses should've been sacked over a week ago, but wee Jimmy krankie was probably laughing as she hates the Englush
She was expelled from the SNP and is now an independent. Just as Johnson can’t sack an opposition MP, there is no mechanism for Sturgeon to sack her either.
To be fair, I was referring to the clarity of Ms Sturgeon’s guidance on what the great Scottish public needed to do to limit the spread of infection. I try to avoid quintessentially political matters.
That's the biggest contradiction for me, that you can wander around the shops and pass probably hundreds of people, many at close proximity, yet you can't sit on your arse well spaced out in the open air for a couple of hours.
Allowed: socially distanced queueing into shop, everyone wearing face masks, hands sanitiser on entrance, people walking about rather than standing next to each other for prolonged period when inside, contactless payment and plexiglass at till.
Not allowed: people getting pissed in the carpark before entering a stadium at the same time, using the toilets at same time, queuing for the tea bar at half time, chanting and shouting together during the match, doing the conga together when their club score a goal, leaving en-masse via one exit and a narrow road.
Someone posted a photo from the Banbury match on the Wycombe Facebook group yesterday. People clutching beer, standing next to each other, no face masks. Another commented that at the match he went to, as soon as it rained people ignored social distancing and sheltered together in the small area with a covered stand. I'm afraid football fans really don't help themselves in this country. If I were Boris tomorrow I'd stop all crowds at non league level as well.
Yes, you don't have to have Aloysius' super cynical/negative take on things to see the difference.
A better comparison is allowing a few hundred in the really low non league levels, but not allowing anyone in much bigger grounds at higher levels. That doesn't make much sense.
I can't remember the last time I saw a queue to get into a shop - and people don't pay much attention to the spacers inside anymore either. Surely it's much easier to enforce things where people are made to so down. As for leaving grounds, that would be done in a controlled, staggered way in accordance with layout, surrounding area etc. Idiots are not exclusive to football.
@Malone said:
Yes, you don't have to have Aloysius' super cynical/negative take on things to see the difference.
A better comparison is allowing a few hundred in the really low non league levels, but not allowing anyone in much bigger grounds at higher levels. That doesn't make much sense.
If I remember correctly, Chesham are capping attendance at 800 (or they were for the Wycombe game at least) in a ground with a capacity of 5,000 - almost entirely standing - and with even worse access than Adams Park - one fairly narrow road in and out. No staggered exit and no enforcement of social distancing - both of which you would get at a League ground. It wasn't perfect, but apart from the completely uncontrolled toilets, I thought it was well run considering. We need to get on with things and I see no reason why we can't have even 1,000 fans at grounds of AP's capacity and more.
Comments
You can't really have "in person" lessons whilst quarantining. Far from overplaying it the suggestion is that far more would have tested positive if they could actually get tests.
No wonder really that those (however few) who spent their £9k fees plus rent and travelled across the country as directed are pissed at being held on immediate lockdown.
Business-lead pushes use agreeable papers to pressure politicians. Most of the larger ones are losing money now and probably only still exist to provide a bit of influence for their owners.
If it helps inform the debate I have twins who both started Uni in halls of residence this year. The one in Sheffield (moved in listening to the Blackburn scores come through) is in full isolation and lockdown with 3 positives in her bubble of 10.
The other, down at Harrow (moved in listening to the Rotherham result), is currently having a whale of a time with a mixed batch of in-person and on-line learning and heading into Central London fairly often.
So it goes...
https://news.sky.com/story/coronvairus-dr-johnny-bananas-and-dr-person-fakename-among-medical-signatories-on-herd-immunity-open-letter-12099947
That's not surprising, the number of conspiracy theorists sharing that fringe report was shocking.
Working in a vaguely related field within science and still having visibility of lots of people I met at University on my course/related courses via social media, it's obviously a tiny minority that think follow the thinking of that letter. I suppose for people that have no link into "the world of science" it was an easy thing for them to grab onto that fits their chosen narrative
It is a minority, but just to show how access to information doesn't easily bring clarity there were also those further on the scientific fringe arguing the Barrington declaration was also missing the point. You can of course get legitimate dissent within the scientific community, where knowledge of an issue is growing over time. This is why clear messages from government, proper numbers and a competent action plan were critical to public confidence, and we've not had that.
Absolutely bonkers
@chairboyscentral, seems as always it's a case of follow the money ...
Crazy
Is it bonkers though? The club wants to maximise matchday revenue, that means selling hospitality packages to sponsors and other businesses (see thread on Woodlands Lounge). This will allow them to do that, with the enticement of meeting players not in the matchday squad etc. At the same time, numbers will be small enough to be able to provide the table service with social distancing demanded by the govt.
Is it unfair that people paying for hospitality will get to watch the match in the flesh while others won't (and let's not be naive - clearly they'll spill out of the Woodlands and into the executive boxes while the match is underway)? Certainly. But will they be able to get in and out of the ground safely because of the small numbers? Yes. And will they be the sort of supporters who celebrate a Wycombe goal in the middle of a pandemic by attempting a conga? Probably not.
Clubs need the revenue, fine, but it's bonkers - although not surprising - that there are more and more indoor events/gatherings being allowed yet we still can't go and sit in the open air.
The idea that those in a box behave impeccably isn't exactly true either.
More crazy that this is being considered at a time that more and more areas of the country look like they'll be under measures that shut all hospitality full stop
If they had a proper testing regime and track and trace system in place the above would be entirely possible. They haven't. It isn't. Some 'perfectly healthy' people contracted it and some of them even died. Government have had six months to make vital decisions...they have managed to make Nicola Sturgeon look like a stateswoman.
Nicola Sturgeon doesn’t faff about. Her messages are clear and to the point, uncluttered with the histrionics and mannerisms further muddying the already convoluted utterances of our own bumbling “leader”.
She does faff about... that smp that decided to come down on the train with covid and go back again just so she could claim her expenses should've been sacked over a week ago, but wee Jimmy krankie was probably laughing as she hates the Englush
Pretty confident post from someone who doesn't seem to understand much
She can't sack her
She was expelled from the SNP and is now an independent. Just as Johnson can’t sack an opposition MP, there is no mechanism for Sturgeon to sack her either.
I stand corrected
To be fair, I was referring to the clarity of Ms Sturgeon’s guidance on what the great Scottish public needed to do to limit the spread of infection. I try to avoid quintessentially political matters.
Said the man in the orthopaedic shoe.
Sorry, been watching to too much Alan Partridge recently and couldn’t resist. A-haaaa!
Not been expelled yet, currently suspended whilst they go through the process to kick her out of the snp.
Thanks for the correction, appreciated. It’s hard to keep up with everything at the minute.
Read it on the Beeb this morning whilst having my Sunday morning cuppa.
That's the biggest contradiction for me, that you can wander around the shops and pass probably hundreds of people, many at close proximity, yet you can't sit on your arse well spaced out in the open air for a couple of hours.
Allowed: socially distanced queueing into shop, everyone wearing face masks, hands sanitiser on entrance, people walking about rather than standing next to each other for prolonged period when inside, contactless payment and plexiglass at till.
Not allowed: people getting pissed in the carpark before entering a stadium at the same time, using the toilets at same time, queuing for the tea bar at half time, chanting and shouting together during the match, doing the conga together when their club score a goal, leaving en-masse via one exit and a narrow road.
Someone posted a photo from the Banbury match on the Wycombe Facebook group yesterday. People clutching beer, standing next to each other, no face masks. Another commented that at the match he went to, as soon as it rained people ignored social distancing and sheltered together in the small area with a covered stand. I'm afraid football fans really don't help themselves in this country. If I were Boris tomorrow I'd stop all crowds at non league level as well.
Yes, you don't have to have Aloysius' super cynical/negative take on things to see the difference.
A better comparison is allowing a few hundred in the really low non league levels, but not allowing anyone in much bigger grounds at higher levels. That doesn't make much sense.
I can't remember the last time I saw a queue to get into a shop - and people don't pay much attention to the spacers inside anymore either. Surely it's much easier to enforce things where people are made to so down. As for leaving grounds, that would be done in a controlled, staggered way in accordance with layout, surrounding area etc. Idiots are not exclusive to football.
If I remember correctly, Chesham are capping attendance at 800 (or they were for the Wycombe game at least) in a ground with a capacity of 5,000 - almost entirely standing - and with even worse access than Adams Park - one fairly narrow road in and out. No staggered exit and no enforcement of social distancing - both of which you would get at a League ground. It wasn't perfect, but apart from the completely uncontrolled toilets, I thought it was well run considering. We need to get on with things and I see no reason why we can't have even 1,000 fans at grounds of AP's capacity and more.