Personally sending him abuse isn't on, but criticising him on a WWFC message board is definitely acceptable.
And there's poor distribution, and what I've seen from WDH. I counted 5 in a row that went nowhere near a blue shirt, and only 2 of them were under any real pressure.
I don't really see why some are suggesting Muller is only 'squad filler'. I'm very hopeful he'll become a mainstay of our team and potentially in contention for player of the season next year. He's exactly what we need in the team - a central defender comfortable on the ball, happy to take his time over a pass, confident, measured, intelligent. From what I've seen he reminds me of Mawson. Not the strongest, not the fiercest, but good at reading the game, good positioning, good at building a move from the back.
Maybe I'm being hopelessly naive, an idealist, a romantic. Sure, he's probably not going to be gracing the Premier League in a couple of years and being talked of as a potential international... But damn it, Ainsworth saw the benefit of playing with one cultured centreback and one man mountain a couple of seasons ago and I like to hope he's prepared to try that again next year. I think Muller and Stewart could be a duo that's talked about for years to come, almost as much as the fabled Mawson Pierre partnership.
The man has just recovered from a very serious injury. Let's not write him off just because he didn't have quite the immediate impact of Scott Kashket.
Harriman and JJ were equally poor distributors on Saturday. In fact I saw Ainswoth berate Harriman for playing a long ball upfield rather than diagonally.
Personally I think the problem with WDH and Muller is not necessarily ability, clearly they both have talent, its largely down to game time and in the latter's case having a decent pre-season behind him.
As a club we have to blood our youngsters in full public eye, we can afford to have a reserve team for them to try things and develop and evolve - and to get things badly wrong. If Steve Hayes tries a back heel in his own area I will shake my head as he should know better, if WDH or Muller or O'Nein or Gape or Kashket make naive mistakes I will be forgiving. Booing, cheering, taking to Twitter to directly abuse that player (FFS what is up with you morons!!!!!) makes absolutely no sense at all in my eyes.
I can make no objective comment on WDH - I don't see enough games. I do find the relatively recent trend to severely abuse own players depressing. seems to me a spillover from the twitter/facebook phenomenon where abuse seems to be par for the course - society thing or just a reflection of the current crop of young supporters?
I can make one objective comment on Andy Graham's post. Pretty sure that even Steve Hayes would agree that his best playing days are behind him..............
I prefer my centre backs to defend first and the last few remarks seem to place quite a high stock on distribution and poise on the ball. Muller does look more composed on the ball than alot of centre backs but for me he has a really slow turning circle and if he gets tight on a forward he is in trouble. Hopefully as he gets fitter he'll get better at this.
@Right_in_the_Middle said:
I prefer my centre backs to defend first and the last few remarks seem to place quite a high stock on distribution and poise on the ball. Muller does look more composed on the ball than alot of centre backs but for me he has a really slow turning circle and if he gets tight on a forward he is in trouble. Hopefully as he gets fitter he'll get better at this.
Pierre gets away with below average distribution because he's an exceptional defender, and his is still better than WDH.
If your distribution is poor, you end up needing to defend twice as much as you're constantly giving the other team the ball. WDH might not be receiving any favours playing with Pierre, as having the two of them together really does make grim watching. We need one ball player out of the two CBs.
@Right_in_the_Middle , yes it takes such expertise to see if a player is clearly struggling and very much the weak link in the team doesn't it.
I think the people who boo him and moan loudly are absolute cretins, but i don't think people saying they're worried he looks so poor on here are the same.
I think we have a huge void to fill when the keeper and very possibly both main centre backs go in the summer.
@Username , do we really need a ball playing centre back in league 2? I'd suggest Mawson was an absolute once a decade league 2 player who may have set us ridiculous expectations going forward.
When a lot of our midfielders are hardly silky, it's a bit unrealistic to expect that of a cenrte back.
A relative ball playing centre half for league 2. Stewart is just about good enough with the ball to qualify as "ball playing" in league two. Pierre is an out and out stopper.
I would speculate that in training WDH shows all the attributes necessary for a CB hence GA putting him above Sido in the pecking order.
I would also theorise his increasing inability to do so in a match environment is a result of a loss of confidence coupled with the pressure of being in a team (almost) in a battle for the play offs.
This time of year experience can count for a lot. What is sure is that the abuse he is receiving will not help his development.
@arnos_grove I wouldn't worry about Brownie. He'd have found out where you lived!
@aloysius Muller reminds you of Mawson ? ??? Maybe if Alfie played with a rucksack of bricks on his back, then there maybe a vague resemblance. I doubt ive ever read a more bizarre comparison.
There's been some good balanced posts in his defence. The anecdotes of people barely acknowledging any good defending de Havilland does but always ready to howl dogs abuse at his at every little mistake brings back some bad memories of the terrible treatment Thommo used to get.
Comments
Personally sending him abuse isn't on, but criticising him on a WWFC message board is definitely acceptable.
And there's poor distribution, and what I've seen from WDH. I counted 5 in a row that went nowhere near a blue shirt, and only 2 of them were under any real pressure.
I don't really see why some are suggesting Muller is only 'squad filler'. I'm very hopeful he'll become a mainstay of our team and potentially in contention for player of the season next year. He's exactly what we need in the team - a central defender comfortable on the ball, happy to take his time over a pass, confident, measured, intelligent. From what I've seen he reminds me of Mawson. Not the strongest, not the fiercest, but good at reading the game, good positioning, good at building a move from the back.
Maybe I'm being hopelessly naive, an idealist, a romantic. Sure, he's probably not going to be gracing the Premier League in a couple of years and being talked of as a potential international... But damn it, Ainsworth saw the benefit of playing with one cultured centreback and one man mountain a couple of seasons ago and I like to hope he's prepared to try that again next year. I think Muller and Stewart could be a duo that's talked about for years to come, almost as much as the fabled Mawson Pierre partnership.
The man has just recovered from a very serious injury. Let's not write him off just because he didn't have quite the immediate impact of Scott Kashket.
Harriman and JJ were equally poor distributors on Saturday. In fact I saw Ainswoth berate Harriman for playing a long ball upfield rather than diagonally.
Personally I think the problem with WDH and Muller is not necessarily ability, clearly they both have talent, its largely down to game time and in the latter's case having a decent pre-season behind him.
As a club we have to blood our youngsters in full public eye, we can afford to have a reserve team for them to try things and develop and evolve - and to get things badly wrong. If Steve Hayes tries a back heel in his own area I will shake my head as he should know better, if WDH or Muller or O'Nein or Gape or Kashket make naive mistakes I will be forgiving. Booing, cheering, taking to Twitter to directly abuse that player (FFS what is up with you morons!!!!!) makes absolutely no sense at all in my eyes.
I can make no objective comment on WDH - I don't see enough games. I do find the relatively recent trend to severely abuse own players depressing. seems to me a spillover from the twitter/facebook phenomenon where abuse seems to be par for the course - society thing or just a reflection of the current crop of young supporters?
I can make one objective comment on Andy Graham's post. Pretty sure that even Steve Hayes would agree that his best playing days are behind him..............
I prefer my centre backs to defend first and the last few remarks seem to place quite a high stock on distribution and poise on the ball. Muller does look more composed on the ball than alot of centre backs but for me he has a really slow turning circle and if he gets tight on a forward he is in trouble. Hopefully as he gets fitter he'll get better at this.
Pierre gets away with below average distribution because he's an exceptional defender, and his is still better than WDH.
If your distribution is poor, you end up needing to defend twice as much as you're constantly giving the other team the ball. WDH might not be receiving any favours playing with Pierre, as having the two of them together really does make grim watching. We need one ball player out of the two CBs.
@Right_in_the_Middle , yes it takes such expertise to see if a player is clearly struggling and very much the weak link in the team doesn't it.
I think the people who boo him and moan loudly are absolute cretins, but i don't think people saying they're worried he looks so poor on here are the same.
I think we have a huge void to fill when the keeper and very possibly both main centre backs go in the summer.
Steve Hayes is more likely to play a back-hander than a back-heel.
@Username , do we really need a ball playing centre back in league 2? I'd suggest Mawson was an absolute once a decade league 2 player who may have set us ridiculous expectations going forward.
When a lot of our midfielders are hardly silky, it's a bit unrealistic to expect that of a cenrte back.
A relative ball playing centre half for league 2. Stewart is just about good enough with the ball to qualify as "ball playing" in league two. Pierre is an out and out stopper.
I would speculate that in training WDH shows all the attributes necessary for a CB hence GA putting him above Sido in the pecking order.
I would also theorise his increasing inability to do so in a match environment is a result of a loss of confidence coupled with the pressure of being in a team (almost) in a battle for the play offs.
This time of year experience can count for a lot. What is sure is that the abuse he is receiving will not help his development.
@arnos_grove I wouldn't worry about Brownie. He'd have found out where you lived!
@aloysius Muller reminds you of Mawson ? ??? Maybe if Alfie played with a rucksack of bricks on his back, then there maybe a vague resemblance. I doubt ive ever read a more bizarre comparison.
Oh but Hayes said....
Is Will de Havilland a Andy Thomson-type hate figure for the social media age?
Who will be his William Poths?
There's been some good balanced posts in his defence. The anecdotes of people barely acknowledging any good defending de Havilland does but always ready to howl dogs abuse at his at every little mistake brings back some bad memories of the terrible treatment Thommo used to get.
My man was Richard Harris. I'd defend him all day long and his subsequent personal trainer/gig promoter career.
Landed on his feet with Harry Potter.