I think @Shev has it spot on. I think we’re looking a 4th to 8th/9th side, depending on how we perform. Hopefully we can finish up in the play offs but it’ll depend if we can start getting some momentum again and getting the more creative players back in the side. I think Horgan will be off in the Summer as he doesn’t seem to be getting a look in recently which must be frustrating.
Assuming we’ll be in League 1 again next season, we need to strengthen in a few areas to really challenge at the top.
Tonight was frustrating. But I think it's fair to say that with 18 days without a game, it's going to always be difficult, so I am not worried particularly about tonight's performance in particular.
However, if COVID continues to postpone our games, I feel that it will completely disrupt our flow and momentum and that we may see more performances like tonight, because we are not playing consistently. For me, I just hope we can continue to play as many games as possible, to keep the flow alive, but this will be completely out of our control.
Getting the happy hat back on, I will say that I have massively enjoyed this season overall, and even if we finish 9th, I expect to look back on it with affection.
No threat of relegation.
McLeary in his pomp.
Mustard's absurd moments of magic.
Mehmeti continuing to develop.
Forino and Pendlebury coming through.
Some amazing goals.
Injury time drama.
Plymouth 3-0 away.
Taffs with the last kick.
Goodbye to Bayo.
Bayo scoring!!!
The goal does look grim on Sky, Forino rolled and Stewart seems to be looking elsewhere as his man scores, not sure who he was shouting at afterwards. Kind of shows what can happen and how close it was in the end. They would have been gutted if we'd equalised late on and we've done it many times.
Good list @Shev , will be plenty others , the return of fans at the top.
For me it was a case of realisation that we are not as good as I tell myself we are. I appreciate we have a long term plan etc etc but if we really are serious about competing this season, then we need some quality recruits in the Jan window. Maybe spend a bit of that £3.5M profit.
I know we have put together the development squad and that will get stronger and stronger and develop future first team players and is really great to see.
Probably it is just that my expectation levels are far above reality.
The next 3 games will certainly inform us of exactly where we stand this season. Oxford and Sunderland are both looking very good and Charlton away will be a big test. 6/7 points out of those 3 fixtures would certainly underpin our challenge, whereas 1/2 points would probably see us drop out of the top six.
@Blue_since_1990 said:
For me it was a case of realisation that we are not as good as I tell myself we are. I appreciate we have a long term plan etc etc but if we really are serious about competing this season, then we need some quality recruits in the Jan window. Maybe spend a bit of that £3.5M profit.
I know we have put together the development squad and that will get stronger and stronger and develop future first team players and is really great to see.
Probably it is just that my expectation levels are far above reality.
The next 3 games will certainly inform us of exactly where we stand this season. Oxford and Sunderland are both looking very good and Charlton away will be a big test. 6/7 points out of those 3 fixtures would certainly underpin our challenge, whereas 1/2 points would probably see us drop out of the top six.
Agree the next three games will give a good indication if we can continue to be ‘ in the mix’ for promotion. It will be interesting to see if we recruit in the window to get to full permitted squad numbers.
Very frustrating night. Sure we should have changed things at half time. Born out by Mehmeti coming on & their back line going in to panic mode most times he got the ball. I honestly thought that both sides were rubbish to be honest and looked like two relegation sides in a scrap to avoid the drop.
Pretty sure that I remember Gareth saying that the players work very hard on their weaknesses in training or words to that effect. McCarthy doesn't appear to have taken those points on board. It's like he has totally run out of energy by the time it comes to crossing the ball after steaming down the wing, "appalling" is the term that comes to mind. It was as clear as day that having two in the middle of the park wasn't working, but we still persisted with it.
I only went to the game because I had already promised my lad that I would & it was another tick off. I was feeling absolutely crap before I left and was very jealous of my wife as she was watching on IFollow if front of a wood burning stove. I on the other hand got there early and had a "power nap" in the car just to summons the energy & enthusiasm to get into the ground.
Ah well, on the plus side we got home in one piece, went straight to bed and slept like a log. Trying to look at the positive side of life, I have health, a great family & plenty of other good things in my life to put this in to perspective. This time tomorrow it will be just a distant memory and shall be looking forward to the Charlton game with optimism, I hope!
@EwanHoosaami said:
Very frustrating night. Sure we should have changed things at half time. Born out by Mehmeti coming on & their back line going in to panic mode most times he got the ball. I honestly thought that both sides were rubbish to be honest and looked like two relegation sides in a scrap to avoid the drop.
Pretty sure that I remember Gareth saying that the players work very hard on their weaknesses in training or words to that effect. McCarthy doesn't appear to have taken those points on board. It's like he has totally run out of energy by the time it comes to crossing the ball after steaming down the wing, "appalling" is the term that comes to mind. It was as clear as day that having two in the middle of the park wasn't working, but we still persisted with it.
I only went to the game because I had already promised my lad that I would & it was another tick off. I was feeling absolutely crap before I left and was very jealous of my wife as she was watching on IFollow if front of a wood burning stove. I on the other hand got there early and had a "power nap" in the car just to summons the energy & enthusiasm to get into the ground.
Ah well, on the plus side we got home in one piece, went straight to bed and slept like a log. Trying to look at the positive side of life, I have health, a great family & plenty of other good things in my life to put this in to perspective. This time tomorrow it will be just a distant memory and shall be looking forward to the Charlton game with optimism, I hope!
Amen to that brother. I do feel we might need a couple of recruits. Preferably someone who can cross a ball with accuracy. Of course JJ used to be that guy but is now unable to work the flanks. Surely some top loan prospects available in this window …
I think in any other L1 season we’d be serious automatic promotion contenders, but I wouldn’t be surprised this year if we fell just short of playoffs.
Would still be a good season for us, but the pace of some of the other teams at the moment is just relentless.
But anything can happen - easy to be negative after a flat defeat.
Tbh I've never thought that autos were on this season, we probably need another couple of players for that. But I do think the play offs are realistic, but as others have said, it's a strong division this season and 7 or 8 teams will be thinking exactly the same. So, see what happens and go with the flow and enjoy all the good moments and whatever happens, happens. We've still got a club we can support and no danger of relegation at all.
I thought we looked like a side that hadn't played competitive football for 18 days; just a yard or so off the pace and rusty.
The final third balls into the box were very poor generally.
I think we're still well in there with a shout of promotion, unfortunately the continuing ineptitude of the EFL allowing clubs to exploit the system, by using covid as a smokescreen for not being able to field their best 11, has cost us some valuable momentum.
It's frustrating, but I think that game will have sharpened us up match wise. Onto the valley! See you all there! COYB
Great posts from my neighbours - @EwanHoosaami and @HolmerBlue. I thought the quality of football - a great deal of hit and hope by both sides - was very poor for clubs with serious promotion aspirations. Harsh to be over critical in present circumstances but I think calls for loan players to be brought in (very unlikely, I think) or “a bit of that £3.5 million profit “ to be spent are unlikely to be answered.
The eleven who started last night have shown many times this season that they are capable of playing controlled, passing football and they will do so again.
Having said all that, I think the balance between midfield and attack is wrong at present. Individually, all our attacking players are very capable but it’s almost as if they are getting in each other’s way at times. Uche Ikpeazu was a big loss. In my mind’s eye I can see him winning the ball repeatedly and regularly tormenting opposition defences. Scoring goals, too!
We really miss that.
A nothing sort of games that probably should have been a draw, against a team in a false position.
Coming after a very unusual long spell without a game.
We're still well in the mix near the top so nothing to go too overboard just yet .
Critical period coming up though.
@StrongestTeam said:
The goal does look grim on Sky, Forino rolled and Stewart seems to be looking elsewhere as his man scores, not sure who he was shouting at afterwards. Kind of shows what can happen and how close it was in the end. They would have been gutted if we'd equalised late on and we've done it many times.
Good list @Shev , will be plenty others , the return of fans at the top.
We’ve conceded similar goals before. I think Sunderland away this season but may be wrong. Basically they shouldn’t be able to throw directly to someone’s feet 1v1 in the box. There should be a screen in front of that player, forcing them to thrown down the line or backward. Dreadful defending.
We also had a nightmare with the header Stocking saved earlier on. Forino steps out of the middle and Stewart/JJ inexplicably leave the striker unmarked bang in the middle of the goal.
I'm surprised to see Forino ahead of Grimmer in the pecking order in central defence now. He has more height but against a team like Ipswich I'd have thought experience and guile would count for more. Grimmer on the pitch and we probably wouldn't have conceded that goal, and 0-0 against Ipswich is a decent enough result.
Whatever, I will always support the Chairboys and where we are now is a million miles away from that day we all travelled to Torquay half expecting it to be our last league game for quite a while.
@aloysius agree that I was surprised Grimmer wasn’t in the starting 11 ahead of Forino. Think Forino has done ok but not ready to be a regular centre back for a top half team. It highlights that we really do need another centre back into the squad in January and move back to a back 4 regularly - the back 5 isn’t working any more as we just don’t have the threat out wide you need in that system (Fred in left last season and McCarthy on fire in that period).
Gape is out long term again and Pendlebury is not quite ready. Wheeler is not a central midfielder. We need more cover there too in the Adeniran mould.
Up front and attacking wise we’re ok if we can improve the quality into them, I’d like Uche back but that’s not likely.
It all depends what we’re happy with this season - stay the same and we may have enough to get into the play offs or be a top 8 side. A few additions could push us up to a definite play off team.
Considering it was only his second league game in professional football I thought Forino looked very comfortable yesterday against two very strong League One forwards in Norwood and Bonne. Maybe slightly at fault (along with 2 others) for the unfortunate goal, but rarely troubled all game. He certainly seems another great find by the management team.
I thought we’d just miss out on the playoffs at the start of the season, and apart from the morning after the Plymouth game I haven’t really changed my mind. 7th-10th would still represent about the fourth best season in our 135ish year history. Lots to be positive about.
I would echo the thoughts of posters who thought that was two teams playing poorly (one of them very rusty and missing game time) and their goal was quite fortuitous coming off a knee in the same way Stewart's miss was unfortunate. Not too much in it for me, we could still have snatched a point. We are still in the mix. Good times.
I think also Ipswich simply played very well, and showed a good combination of physicality and skill.
In particular, I thought their back line was (sadly) very solid. Phil Catchpole referred to this in the commentary too, but we certainly never saw anything in Donacien to suggest he’d develop into the player he is now.
In particular, their defence seemed to boss us out of the picture when it came to winning headers from long balls.
So if you combine that with the generally dire quality of our crosses, you can see why we weren’t creating too much in terms of chances.
I’m not the biggest fan of Horgan, but he can put in a cross - personally I would have liked to see him come on for Hanlan.
The Forino for Beast sub was brave though (I don’t mean that sarcastically) and would nearly have been vindicated had Stewart put that chance away. But Stewart’s saved us on occasions that he had no right to, as well, so I guess it balances out.
Sorry @PBo but I genuinely didn't think Ipswich played very well at all. We played with two midfielders which allowed their centre backs plenty of time to waltz through to within 25 yards of our goal. Surrendering ground is not the same as they played well. Their back line was only "looking" solid because we lacked anything including numbers going forward.
Surprised that there isn't any mention of the defenders blatant push on McCarthy when he was through? Surely worthy of a red as it denied a clear goal scoring opportunity. Mind you if the ref knew anything of McCarthys finishing in that he couldn't hit a cows are with a shovel, then not difficult to empathise with his decision of a yellow!
I was impressed with Forino. Showed good positional sense and won many important headers. Some of his distribution was good, too, in a game when we gave the ball away too hurriedly and too often. Huge potential.
I’m not convinced that the chance which Stewart missed was as easy as most seem to think. There were two recumbent defenders (plus the goalkeeper) more or less lying on his feet when the ball reached him.
I hate to be a pessimist but I watched the game on i player last night and I was thoroughly dissapointed. Two poor teams and neither promotion candidates in my opinion. For a long time now we have been saying that our final pass into the box is awful.So no improvement there then. A very lethargic performance with a very poor goal given away and a midfield overun. Without investment in the January transfer window I am afraid that I can't see us going anywhere fast. We may have some good academy players but they will take some time to develop. Sorry to be such a doom -monger going into the New Year
On BBC Radio Suffolk after the game Mick Mills didn’t think Ipswich played very well & were very pleased to get the 3 points. He also questioned whether Norwood and Bonne could play together up front.
He was looking from the Ipswich perspective obviously but seem to imply Ipswich got the 3 points due mainly to a dogged defensive display.
Personally, I thought our substitutions were too late & I’d have preferred to see Mehmeti attack Ipswich down the middle instead of going wide a lot of the time. Hopefully we can rectify this at Charlton but the real test will be Sunderland, Oxford & the franchise at home in January.
Comments
@ReturnToSenda hope you had a top night down there despite the result
Nice to get a taste of the kind of crowds we'll be playing in front of every other week next season
Top lad!
I think @Shev has it spot on. I think we’re looking a 4th to 8th/9th side, depending on how we perform. Hopefully we can finish up in the play offs but it’ll depend if we can start getting some momentum again and getting the more creative players back in the side. I think Horgan will be off in the Summer as he doesn’t seem to be getting a look in recently which must be frustrating.
Assuming we’ll be in League 1 again next season, we need to strengthen in a few areas to really challenge at the top.
Playoffs would represent a very decent season given the strength of the division this year. And then anything can happen.
Tonight was frustrating. But I think it's fair to say that with 18 days without a game, it's going to always be difficult, so I am not worried particularly about tonight's performance in particular.
However, if COVID continues to postpone our games, I feel that it will completely disrupt our flow and momentum and that we may see more performances like tonight, because we are not playing consistently. For me, I just hope we can continue to play as many games as possible, to keep the flow alive, but this will be completely out of our control.
Getting the happy hat back on, I will say that I have massively enjoyed this season overall, and even if we finish 9th, I expect to look back on it with affection.
No threat of relegation.
McLeary in his pomp.
Mustard's absurd moments of magic.
Mehmeti continuing to develop.
Forino and Pendlebury coming through.
Some amazing goals.
Injury time drama.
Plymouth 3-0 away.
Taffs with the last kick.
Goodbye to Bayo.
Bayo scoring!!!
And on and on.
The goal does look grim on Sky, Forino rolled and Stewart seems to be looking elsewhere as his man scores, not sure who he was shouting at afterwards. Kind of shows what can happen and how close it was in the end. They would have been gutted if we'd equalised late on and we've done it many times.
Good list @Shev , will be plenty others , the return of fans at the top.
We narrowly lost away to Ipswich in a game we could easily could have won! Sense of reality needed
For me it was a case of realisation that we are not as good as I tell myself we are. I appreciate we have a long term plan etc etc but if we really are serious about competing this season, then we need some quality recruits in the Jan window. Maybe spend a bit of that £3.5M profit.
I know we have put together the development squad and that will get stronger and stronger and develop future first team players and is really great to see.
Probably it is just that my expectation levels are far above reality.
The next 3 games will certainly inform us of exactly where we stand this season. Oxford and Sunderland are both looking very good and Charlton away will be a big test. 6/7 points out of those 3 fixtures would certainly underpin our challenge, whereas 1/2 points would probably see us drop out of the top six.
Agree the next three games will give a good indication if we can continue to be ‘ in the mix’ for promotion. It will be interesting to see if we recruit in the window to get to full permitted squad numbers.
Very frustrating night. Sure we should have changed things at half time. Born out by Mehmeti coming on & their back line going in to panic mode most times he got the ball. I honestly thought that both sides were rubbish to be honest and looked like two relegation sides in a scrap to avoid the drop.
Pretty sure that I remember Gareth saying that the players work very hard on their weaknesses in training or words to that effect. McCarthy doesn't appear to have taken those points on board. It's like he has totally run out of energy by the time it comes to crossing the ball after steaming down the wing, "appalling" is the term that comes to mind. It was as clear as day that having two in the middle of the park wasn't working, but we still persisted with it.
I only went to the game because I had already promised my lad that I would & it was another tick off. I was feeling absolutely crap before I left and was very jealous of my wife as she was watching on IFollow if front of a wood burning stove. I on the other hand got there early and had a "power nap" in the car just to summons the energy & enthusiasm to get into the ground.
Ah well, on the plus side we got home in one piece, went straight to bed and slept like a log. Trying to look at the positive side of life, I have health, a great family & plenty of other good things in my life to put this in to perspective. This time tomorrow it will be just a distant memory and shall be looking forward to the Charlton game with optimism, I hope!
Amen to that brother. I do feel we might need a couple of recruits. Preferably someone who can cross a ball with accuracy. Of course JJ used to be that guy but is now unable to work the flanks. Surely some top loan prospects available in this window …
I think in any other L1 season we’d be serious automatic promotion contenders, but I wouldn’t be surprised this year if we fell just short of playoffs.
Would still be a good season for us, but the pace of some of the other teams at the moment is just relentless.
But anything can happen - easy to be negative after a flat defeat.
Tbh I've never thought that autos were on this season, we probably need another couple of players for that. But I do think the play offs are realistic, but as others have said, it's a strong division this season and 7 or 8 teams will be thinking exactly the same. So, see what happens and go with the flow and enjoy all the good moments and whatever happens, happens. We've still got a club we can support and no danger of relegation at all.
General thoughts on last night:
I thought we looked like a side that hadn't played competitive football for 18 days; just a yard or so off the pace and rusty.
The final third balls into the box were very poor generally.
I think we're still well in there with a shout of promotion, unfortunately the continuing ineptitude of the EFL allowing clubs to exploit the system, by using covid as a smokescreen for not being able to field their best 11, has cost us some valuable momentum.
It's frustrating, but I think that game will have sharpened us up match wise. Onto the valley! See you all there! COYB
Great posts from my neighbours - @EwanHoosaami and @HolmerBlue. I thought the quality of football - a great deal of hit and hope by both sides - was very poor for clubs with serious promotion aspirations. Harsh to be over critical in present circumstances but I think calls for loan players to be brought in (very unlikely, I think) or “a bit of that £3.5 million profit “ to be spent are unlikely to be answered.
The eleven who started last night have shown many times this season that they are capable of playing controlled, passing football and they will do so again.
Having said all that, I think the balance between midfield and attack is wrong at present. Individually, all our attacking players are very capable but it’s almost as if they are getting in each other’s way at times. Uche Ikpeazu was a big loss. In my mind’s eye I can see him winning the ball repeatedly and regularly tormenting opposition defences. Scoring goals, too!
We really miss that.
Having read those last pages, cheer up everyone!
A nothing sort of games that probably should have been a draw, against a team in a false position.
Coming after a very unusual long spell without a game.
We're still well in the mix near the top so nothing to go too overboard just yet .
Critical period coming up though.
We’ve conceded similar goals before. I think Sunderland away this season but may be wrong. Basically they shouldn’t be able to throw directly to someone’s feet 1v1 in the box. There should be a screen in front of that player, forcing them to thrown down the line or backward. Dreadful defending.
We also had a nightmare with the header Stocking saved earlier on. Forino steps out of the middle and Stewart/JJ inexplicably leave the striker unmarked bang in the middle of the goal.
I'm surprised to see Forino ahead of Grimmer in the pecking order in central defence now. He has more height but against a team like Ipswich I'd have thought experience and guile would count for more. Grimmer on the pitch and we probably wouldn't have conceded that goal, and 0-0 against Ipswich is a decent enough result.
Expectation can really get at you at times.
Whatever, I will always support the Chairboys and where we are now is a million miles away from that day we all travelled to Torquay half expecting it to be our last league game for quite a while.
Wycombe till I die!!!!!
@aloysius agree that I was surprised Grimmer wasn’t in the starting 11 ahead of Forino. Think Forino has done ok but not ready to be a regular centre back for a top half team. It highlights that we really do need another centre back into the squad in January and move back to a back 4 regularly - the back 5 isn’t working any more as we just don’t have the threat out wide you need in that system (Fred in left last season and McCarthy on fire in that period).
Gape is out long term again and Pendlebury is not quite ready. Wheeler is not a central midfielder. We need more cover there too in the Adeniran mould.
Up front and attacking wise we’re ok if we can improve the quality into them, I’d like Uche back but that’s not likely.
It all depends what we’re happy with this season - stay the same and we may have enough to get into the play offs or be a top 8 side. A few additions could push us up to a definite play off team.
Considering it was only his second league game in professional football I thought Forino looked very comfortable yesterday against two very strong League One forwards in Norwood and Bonne. Maybe slightly at fault (along with 2 others) for the unfortunate goal, but rarely troubled all game. He certainly seems another great find by the management team.
I thought we’d just miss out on the playoffs at the start of the season, and apart from the morning after the Plymouth game I haven’t really changed my mind. 7th-10th would still represent about the fourth best season in our 135ish year history. Lots to be positive about.
I would echo the thoughts of posters who thought that was two teams playing poorly (one of them very rusty and missing game time) and their goal was quite fortuitous coming off a knee in the same way Stewart's miss was unfortunate. Not too much in it for me, we could still have snatched a point. We are still in the mix. Good times.
I think also Ipswich simply played very well, and showed a good combination of physicality and skill.
In particular, I thought their back line was (sadly) very solid. Phil Catchpole referred to this in the commentary too, but we certainly never saw anything in Donacien to suggest he’d develop into the player he is now.
In particular, their defence seemed to boss us out of the picture when it came to winning headers from long balls.
So if you combine that with the generally dire quality of our crosses, you can see why we weren’t creating too much in terms of chances.
I’m not the biggest fan of Horgan, but he can put in a cross - personally I would have liked to see him come on for Hanlan.
The Forino for Beast sub was brave though (I don’t mean that sarcastically) and would nearly have been vindicated had Stewart put that chance away. But Stewart’s saved us on occasions that he had no right to, as well, so I guess it balances out.
Sorry @PBo but I genuinely didn't think Ipswich played very well at all. We played with two midfielders which allowed their centre backs plenty of time to waltz through to within 25 yards of our goal. Surrendering ground is not the same as they played well. Their back line was only "looking" solid because we lacked anything including numbers going forward.
Surprised that there isn't any mention of the defenders blatant push on McCarthy when he was through? Surely worthy of a red as it denied a clear goal scoring opportunity. Mind you if the ref knew anything of McCarthys finishing in that he couldn't hit a cows are with a shovel, then not difficult to empathise with his decision of a yellow!
I was impressed with Forino. Showed good positional sense and won many important headers. Some of his distribution was good, too, in a game when we gave the ball away too hurriedly and too often. Huge potential.
I’m not convinced that the chance which Stewart missed was as easy as most seem to think. There were two recumbent defenders (plus the goalkeeper) more or less lying on his feet when the ball reached him.
I hate to be a pessimist but I watched the game on i player last night and I was thoroughly dissapointed. Two poor teams and neither promotion candidates in my opinion. For a long time now we have been saying that our final pass into the box is awful.So no improvement there then. A very lethargic performance with a very poor goal given away and a midfield overun. Without investment in the January transfer window I am afraid that I can't see us going anywhere fast. We may have some good academy players but they will take some time to develop. Sorry to be such a doom -monger going into the New Year
On BBC Radio Suffolk after the game Mick Mills didn’t think Ipswich played very well & were very pleased to get the 3 points. He also questioned whether Norwood and Bonne could play together up front.
He was looking from the Ipswich perspective obviously but seem to imply Ipswich got the 3 points due mainly to a dogged defensive display.
Personally, I thought our substitutions were too late & I’d have preferred to see Mehmeti attack Ipswich down the middle instead of going wide a lot of the time. Hopefully we can rectify this at Charlton but the real test will be Sunderland, Oxford & the franchise at home in January.