A minor but important point is that under the terms of the DCFC referral back to the disciplinary panel they are not allowed to appeal the decision reached, though they may be allowed to question the scale of any penalty
@Erroll_Sims said:
A minor but important point is that under the terms of the DCFC referral back to the disciplinary panel they are not allowed to appeal the decision reached, though they may be allowed to question the scale of any penalty
EFL rules
92.5 The Disciplinary Commission shall have the power to abridge the time period set out in Regulation 94.3 (time limits for appeal) if there is a compelling reason why the appeal (if any) needs to be concluded expeditiously.
94 Disciplinary Appeals
94.1 A party to a Disciplinary Commission may appeal against a final order of the Disciplinary Commission (a ‘Disciplinary Appeal’). A preliminary or procedural ruling by a Disciplinary Commission shall not be subject to a Disciplinary Appeal unless:
94.1.1 such ruling is dispositive (i.e. it amounts to a final resolution of the matter); or
94.1.2 such ruling, though not dispositive of itself, is subsequently incorporated into a final decision.
I think the moral of the story so far as Sheffield Wednesday is concerned is that when dealing with the EFL, never admit you've breached their regulations. Plus, if found guilty, keep appealing any decision until the cows come home.
It'll end up being a fine or points in the future when they are more stable, shouldn't be allowed.
Nothing stops people recklessly overspending like simply telling them it's bad and it'll cost them even more but maybe later. FFP is less of a regulatory system, more of a payday lending scheme.
Indeed @StrongestTeam. This all relates back to the 3 year period ending 2017/18 season and it's why Middlesbrough are so p***ed off by them as Derby effectively "cheated" them out of a play-off spot that season (in which Derby promptly lost).
Although, had Derby been deducted points this season, it could have benefited us we have no right to feel in any sense that Derby have somehow denied us a place in the Championship.
The EFL absolutely need to look at themselves to determine if the FFP rules are fit for purpose as clubs are not punished in the timeframe the breach occured. Derby were originally charged on 25th Jan 2020 I believe.
@Malone said:
Selling your own stadium to fiddle the rules is a bit of a ludicrous one off short term fix isn't it?
The £80-100m received from stadium sales will not last long and if these clubs do not control their spending, they’ll be wondering what else they can pawn off in another two years when they realise they need to balance the books again.
The value of winning promotion to the top flight versus playing with the existence of a football club is certainly not for me.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, and for the avoidance of doubt, Stoke will avoid any sanction from the EFL over the sale of their ground because in itself it's perfectly legitimate.*
That part of the charge against Derby was dismissed - even though they sold an asset others valued at £40M for £80M - and the charge against Sheff Wed revolved around the timing of the sale and NOT the fact of the sale - that was why their appeal was successful and the points deduction reduced.
*As the Derby(?) chairman has been quoted it's no different to the sale of naming rights, shirt sponshorship and advertising to companies, also owed by the club owners, for well over the "going rate" as a way for these clubs to allow their rich owners to pump extra money in and avoid breaching the FFP rules.
The practices stinks and the EFL have been woefully inept at closing the loopholes but while they remain, the rich will always find a way to exploit them to their own advantage.
And in more financial dealings Sheffield Wednesday have asked their players to go on furlough, at least over the summer, to cover part of their wages. Wages which have gone unpaid again.
To me, just because isn’t playing matches, it has not ceased to operate. SW will still be preparing for next season and if they need to use the furlough scheme then they are not viable for next year. Harsh I know, but what’s the difference to Bury?
Covid has not stopped these clubs operating at the moment. They are not playing matches because it’s the close season.
Whilst some smaller firms need support because they have been told they cannot by law operate this is not the case with football clubs. They simply should not be allowed to furlough during close season.
I’m sure many did when the league was suspended - at that time they along with many businesses simply could not operate due to government restrictions and so could legitimately claim support. Now clubs are not being told they can’t operate.
Any clubs furloughing their players after they have played the last season is frankly an absolute disgrace ! It is not what furlough was brought in to do, and I think it's an insult to people and small companies who are genuinely entitled to it.
How can putting your players on furlough be right? I hope they are being monitored and if they partake in ANY football activity on behalf of the club they get nailed.
I suspect they will argue that, while elite sport has been able to continue during the pandemic giving us all something to watch/argue about, they have lost out on considerable match day revenue and using the furlough scheme is entirely justified.
However were I a supporter of either Coventry or Sheff Wed I'd be rather ashamed of my club right now.
"Positive Rob" (if I dare still call him that), kept mentioning the Championship the other day as if he hasn't closed the door on it. I'd have to listen again to see if he was in some way referring to us being a championship level club (now we've spent a year there), or whether it's where he expects us to be, and then stay, after next season, or whatever. But he mentioned the championship several times, and L1 not once. Still in denial?
Comments
Club?!!
Of course, I stand corrected!
Sorry @Gary. Just something that grated. Glad you took it with such good grace.
A minor but important point is that under the terms of the DCFC referral back to the disciplinary panel they are not allowed to appeal the decision reached, though they may be allowed to question the scale of any penalty
An 'Allo 'Allo reference. Lovely
EFL rules
92.5 The Disciplinary Commission shall have the power to abridge the time period set out in Regulation 94.3 (time limits for appeal) if there is a compelling reason why the appeal (if any) needs to be concluded expeditiously.
94 Disciplinary Appeals
94.1 A party to a Disciplinary Commission may appeal against a final order of the Disciplinary Commission (a ‘Disciplinary Appeal’). A preliminary or procedural ruling by a Disciplinary Commission shall not be subject to a Disciplinary Appeal unless:
94.1.1 such ruling is dispositive (i.e. it amounts to a final resolution of the matter); or
94.1.2 such ruling, though not dispositive of itself, is subsequently incorporated into a final decision.
We all know that they will get away with it
I don't think they will entirely.
It'll just take ages and be a lesser punishment than it should be.
Sheffield Wed should be fuming really.
I think the moral of the story so far as Sheffield Wednesday is concerned is that when dealing with the EFL, never admit you've breached their regulations. Plus, if found guilty, keep appealing any decision until the cows come home.
They (Sheffield) didn't (admit they did wrong) and they did (appeal and won, that's why the 12 point deduction was reduced to 6).
It'll end up being a fine or points in the future when they are more stable, shouldn't be allowed.
Nothing stops people recklessly overspending like simply telling them it's bad and it'll cost them even more but maybe later. FFP is less of a regulatory system, more of a payday lending scheme.
Indeed @StrongestTeam. This all relates back to the 3 year period ending 2017/18 season and it's why Middlesbrough are so p***ed off by them as Derby effectively "cheated" them out of a play-off spot that season (in which Derby promptly lost).
Although, had Derby been deducted points this season, it could have benefited us we have no right to feel in any sense that Derby have somehow denied us a place in the Championship.
The EFL absolutely need to look at themselves to determine if the FFP rules are fit for purpose as clubs are not punished in the timeframe the breach occured. Derby were originally charged on 25th Jan 2020 I believe.
How about stadium sales to oneself are just not counted towards satisfying FFP?
How is a system designed to promote financial fair play forcing clubs to sell their stadiums?
Surely that is the last thing that should be happening and the easiest thing to stop.
Selling your own stadium to fiddle the rules is a bit of a ludicrous one off short term fix isn't it?
I'm (not remotely) amazed they didn't close that loophole after Wednesday and Derby sold their stadiums.
The £80-100m received from stadium sales will not last long and if these clubs do not control their spending, they’ll be wondering what else they can pawn off in another two years when they realise they need to balance the books again.
The value of winning promotion to the top flight versus playing with the existence of a football club is certainly not for me.
Stoke will probably avoid any action on FFP as their Chief Executive is in the running to join the EFL Board.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, and for the avoidance of doubt, Stoke will avoid any sanction from the EFL over the sale of their ground because in itself it's perfectly legitimate.*
That part of the charge against Derby was dismissed - even though they sold an asset others valued at £40M for £80M - and the charge against Sheff Wed revolved around the timing of the sale and NOT the fact of the sale - that was why their appeal was successful and the points deduction reduced.
*As the Derby(?) chairman has been quoted it's no different to the sale of naming rights, shirt sponshorship and advertising to companies, also owed by the club owners, for well over the "going rate" as a way for these clubs to allow their rich owners to pump extra money in and avoid breaching the FFP rules.
The practices stinks and the EFL have been woefully inept at closing the loopholes but while they remain, the rich will always find a way to exploit them to their own advantage.
And in more financial dealings Sheffield Wednesday have asked their players to go on furlough, at least over the summer, to cover part of their wages. Wages which have gone unpaid again.
To me, just because isn’t playing matches, it has not ceased to operate. SW will still be preparing for next season and if they need to use the furlough scheme then they are not viable for next year. Harsh I know, but what’s the difference to Bury?
Interestingly Coventry have also furloughed all their playing staff.
Covid has not stopped these clubs operating at the moment. They are not playing matches because it’s the close season.
Whilst some smaller firms need support because they have been told they cannot by law operate this is not the case with football clubs. They simply should not be allowed to furlough during close season.
I’m sure many did when the league was suspended - at that time they along with many businesses simply could not operate due to government restrictions and so could legitimately claim support. Now clubs are not being told they can’t operate.
Any clubs furloughing their players after they have played the last season is frankly an absolute disgrace ! It is not what furlough was brought in to do, and I think it's an insult to people and small companies who are genuinely entitled to it.
Using the furlough scheme this time last year was fair enough, but doing this summer is a disgrace.
Completely agree with above comments. Using the furlough scheme in this manner is disgraceful and I would be ashamed if Wycombe did the same.
How can putting your players on furlough be right? I hope they are being monitored and if they partake in ANY football activity on behalf of the club they get nailed.
I suspect they will argue that, while elite sport has been able to continue during the pandemic giving us all something to watch/argue about, they have lost out on considerable match day revenue and using the furlough scheme is entirely justified.
However were I a supporter of either Coventry or Sheff Wed I'd be rather ashamed of my club right now.
Can we assume Derby are staying up and we are not going to suddenly be back in the Championship having sold all our best players in the Summer?
"Positive Rob" (if I dare still call him that), kept mentioning the Championship the other day as if he hasn't closed the door on it. I'd have to listen again to see if he was in some way referring to us being a championship level club (now we've spent a year there), or whether it's where he expects us to be, and then stay, after next season, or whatever. But he mentioned the championship several times, and L1 not once. Still in denial?