Yes, I would agree....but I didn’t say I’d passed my refereeing exam! For the record, I did pass despite being unable to resist a sarcastic answer to the question ‘What would you do if a player taking a penalty passed the ball backwards to a team mate outside the area?’
I wrote: ‘Sack him immediately!’ The correct answer is of course that the ball must travel forwards.
@glasshalffull said:
I always call Dermot Gallagher before every new season to check on any law changes.
Me too. Never calls me back.
On a more serious level, neither my post earlier about referees not facing any consequences, nor my calling for our players to cheat more like our opponents, were meant to insinuate the the referees are solely to blame. I wholeheartedly agree with every post about how the players should face consequences for berating the ref, for diving, for all kinds of cheating. But while none of that is happening, it appears that the game we love is now about who can cheat the best. If we all agree that referees can't be expected to get every decision correct, but neither they nor a player who has conned them will face any consequences for incorrect decisions, we're incentivising cheating - Championship football this season has proved that cheats do prosper.
A few years ago, a prominent member of the board of directors at WWFC proposed that we should set the standard for good behaviour by never diving or appealing for free kicks, never arguing with referees etc. Sadly, I had to point out that it would probably result in us being relegated since every opposing team would take advantage. You need radical punishment and/or agreement across the board to improve standards and clubs find it difficult to agree on mundane matters, never mind something as important as this.
Surely good cheats prosper @drcongo while poor ones just look a bit silly. Cloughie used to fine players for arguing with referees in the days when a tackle would often separate you from your kneecap. I can understand going down and having a yell but I do not see that getting a yellow for mouthing off about a decision that would not be changed serves any purpose myself.
A young lad at work was a referee, did really well and was clearly being fast tracked up the ladder, he had got as high as southern league standard and would regularly skip of early some days to travel to midweek games. We all told him to go for it as much as he could as it would be a better career than getting knackered on a building site. He gave up the next season, the reason, too much and constant abuse. Shame really.
Friend of mine's son had the same experience...he was a teenager officiating at games for youth teams and would be threatened and abused both by players and their football loving parents so though he qualified to ref adult games he gave it up because he could not face it. He works for one of those football stats companies now.
One of my colleagues at a former employer was a football league referee. In his day job he was overly concerned with people following rules to the letter and he struggled with seeing the bigger picture.
He mentioned that quite a lot of referees at the time came from a police background.
Refs were always on a hiding to nothing once TV replays came about and fans had an advantage over refs. I have done my share of moaning - and I do feel some decisions have so egregious it defies reality - but the fact is they get one look at something, in the moment, and the cheaty nature of the sport exacerbates the difficulty.
In the grand scheme of things, can I really be upset with an opposition player winning something through a dive, when Scottie, Bloomers, and Uche throw themselves to the ground if a grasshopper whistles in their direction from a hundred feet away? Not really. I never believe in two wrongs making a right, and the sport has become so fundamentally dishonest, that everyone is contributing to an unseemly spectacle. Does any other sport embrace constant cheating so thoroughly? (Cough, cycling, cough)
This all ties back in to the biggest issue with the sport - governance. If there was any kind of will, harsh rules could be put in place to very much discourage cheating, diving and abusing referees. Only the governing bodies can ultimately change anything.
It's getting to the point where the penalty area should be the six yard box, and you should have to punch someone in the face to concede one, just to avoid all of these endless shenanigans.
@glasshalffull said:
A few years ago, a prominent member of the board of directors at WWFC proposed that we should set the standard for good behaviour by never diving or appealing for free kicks, never arguing with referees etc. Sadly, I had to point out that it would probably result in us being relegated since every opposing team would take advantage. You need radical punishment and/or agreement across the board to improve standards and clubs find it difficult to agree on mundane matters, never mind something as important as this.
I would be over the moon if we did this and it's a genuinely sad state of affairs if you think that if we don't show dissent we will be relegated
Would mic’ing referees embarrass enough players when they heard the audio back to calm some of their behaviour. And maybe make a more honest game? Or am I deluded
Eric, you have either misinterpreted or twisted my words.
I said that if we obeyed the laws and acted in a sportsmanlike manner it would be to our detriment unless every other team did exactly the same thing.
Surely you understand that is what would happen.
Very interesting posts with reference to refereeing but for me just some officiating consistency would be appreciated.
Refs & Linos do have a very difficult job, but sometimes they bring the problems upon themselves.
In the early stages of last nights game, Barnsley were awarded a throw in - this was well within their half, but ended up being taken way over the half way line ! a few minutes later Wycombe were awarded a throw in our half and the Ref blew his whistle to make sure (I think JJ) didn’t take advantage of a few extra yards !!
The penalty decision may have been a correct call - no matter how soft, but if that was deemed to be a penalty, then so was the Thompson incident.
Gareth has raised the inconsistency issue previously in his post match comments and he is spot on.
I also do not think the Kashkett incident was worthy of a red card.
The obvious and disgraceful play acting by the corner flag by the Barnsley player should have been, or at least should be retrospectively punished.
Where did I say that? You are putting words in my mouth. That is not what I meant but if you want to twist things to suit your own agenda then go ahead. I’m sure more reasonable people will understand exactly what I meant.
In the last week I was watching either Quest or another match on Sky, cannot remember which, the topic of mic'ing the referees came up after a controversial incident.
The three pundits said that they couldn't possibly play that coverage due to the amount of foul language and abuse that could be heard during the passage of play.
I have been known to get frustrated on the terraces occasionally and utter something that on reflection probably I shouldn't have! However, that's maybe three or four times a season, still not acceptable.
The ref is getting it though in his ear for 90 minutes. Why didn't you give us a free kick or why did you give that free kick. It feels infinitely worse at the minute but perhaps that's because I'm watching every game on the TV rather than being there live?
@ChasHarps said:
When Phil's Co commentator went " Ol shut up will you, I couldnt put up with that every game"
I presume he was referring to Pete Couhig ??
@glasshalffull said:
Where did I say that? You are putting words in my mouth. That is not what I meant but if you want to twist things to suit your own agenda then go ahead. I’m sure more reasonable people will understand exactly what I meant.
"I said that if we obeyed the laws and acted in a sportsmanlike manner it would be to our detriment"
I don't have to twist anything. Those are your own words and you've already said that you argued this at a board meeting.
I'm not having a go, believe it or not, I just think it's sad if that's the case (is if you're right in what you're saying).
Personally, I would like to see us set the best example of behaviour even if it does cost us.
We're all different though and I'll bet loads of fans agree with what you said.
@ChasHarps said:
When Phil's Co commentator went " Ol shut up will you, I couldnt put up with that every game"
I presume he was referring to Pete Couhig ??
He wasn’t referring to Pete.
I thought that he was referring to Pete as a few minutes earlier he mentioned the noise Pete was making.
Comments
I'd imagine that the actual commentators are in fact a lot more diligent in this respect whereas the studio pundits are not.
Fair comment?
Yes, I would agree....but I didn’t say I’d passed my refereeing exam! For the record, I did pass despite being unable to resist a sarcastic answer to the question ‘What would you do if a player taking a penalty passed the ball backwards to a team mate outside the area?’
I wrote: ‘Sack him immediately!’ The correct answer is of course that the ball must travel forwards.
Me too. Never calls me back.
On a more serious level, neither my post earlier about referees not facing any consequences, nor my calling for our players to cheat more like our opponents, were meant to insinuate the the referees are solely to blame. I wholeheartedly agree with every post about how the players should face consequences for berating the ref, for diving, for all kinds of cheating. But while none of that is happening, it appears that the game we love is now about who can cheat the best. If we all agree that referees can't be expected to get every decision correct, but neither they nor a player who has conned them will face any consequences for incorrect decisions, we're incentivising cheating - Championship football this season has proved that cheats do prosper.
PHMOL = Professional Games Match Officials Limited.
PGMOL !!
A few years ago, a prominent member of the board of directors at WWFC proposed that we should set the standard for good behaviour by never diving or appealing for free kicks, never arguing with referees etc. Sadly, I had to point out that it would probably result in us being relegated since every opposing team would take advantage. You need radical punishment and/or agreement across the board to improve standards and clubs find it difficult to agree on mundane matters, never mind something as important as this.
PGMOL !!
Apologies for the repeat. I had a spam block for allegedly posting three times in 60 seconds. All very odd.
Going for my run now.
Surely good cheats prosper @drcongo while poor ones just look a bit silly. Cloughie used to fine players for arguing with referees in the days when a tackle would often separate you from your kneecap. I can understand going down and having a yell but I do not see that getting a yellow for mouthing off about a decision that would not be changed serves any purpose myself.
Hawaiians eat five million pounds of Spam each year!
Each?!
A young lad at work was a referee, did really well and was clearly being fast tracked up the ladder, he had got as high as southern league standard and would regularly skip of early some days to travel to midweek games. We all told him to go for it as much as he could as it would be a better career than getting knackered on a building site. He gave up the next season, the reason, too much and constant abuse. Shame really.
Friend of mine's son had the same experience...he was a teenager officiating at games for youth teams and would be threatened and abused both by players and their football loving parents so though he qualified to ref adult games he gave it up because he could not face it. He works for one of those football stats companies now.
One of my colleagues at a former employer was a football league referee. In his day job he was overly concerned with people following rules to the letter and he struggled with seeing the bigger picture.
He mentioned that quite a lot of referees at the time came from a police background.
Refs were always on a hiding to nothing once TV replays came about and fans had an advantage over refs. I have done my share of moaning - and I do feel some decisions have so egregious it defies reality - but the fact is they get one look at something, in the moment, and the cheaty nature of the sport exacerbates the difficulty.
In the grand scheme of things, can I really be upset with an opposition player winning something through a dive, when Scottie, Bloomers, and Uche throw themselves to the ground if a grasshopper whistles in their direction from a hundred feet away? Not really. I never believe in two wrongs making a right, and the sport has become so fundamentally dishonest, that everyone is contributing to an unseemly spectacle. Does any other sport embrace constant cheating so thoroughly? (Cough, cycling, cough)
This all ties back in to the biggest issue with the sport - governance. If there was any kind of will, harsh rules could be put in place to very much discourage cheating, diving and abusing referees. Only the governing bodies can ultimately change anything.
It's getting to the point where the penalty area should be the six yard box, and you should have to punch someone in the face to concede one, just to avoid all of these endless shenanigans.
I would be over the moon if we did this and it's a genuinely sad state of affairs if you think that if we don't show dissent we will be relegated
Would mic’ing referees embarrass enough players when they heard the audio back to calm some of their behaviour. And maybe make a more honest game? Or am I deluded
Eric, you have either misinterpreted or twisted my words.
I said that if we obeyed the laws and acted in a sportsmanlike manner it would be to our detriment unless every other team did exactly the same thing.
Surely you understand that is what would happen.
You are saying you don't want us to obey the laws and act in a sportsmanlike manner.
As I said, a sad situation
Very interesting posts with reference to refereeing but for me just some officiating consistency would be appreciated.
Refs & Linos do have a very difficult job, but sometimes they bring the problems upon themselves.
In the early stages of last nights game, Barnsley were awarded a throw in - this was well within their half, but ended up being taken way over the half way line ! a few minutes later Wycombe were awarded a throw in our half and the Ref blew his whistle to make sure (I think JJ) didn’t take advantage of a few extra yards !!
The penalty decision may have been a correct call - no matter how soft, but if that was deemed to be a penalty, then so was the Thompson incident.
Gareth has raised the inconsistency issue previously in his post match comments and he is spot on.
I also do not think the Kashkett incident was worthy of a red card.
The obvious and disgraceful play acting by the corner flag by the Barnsley player should have been, or at least should be retrospectively punished.
Where did I say that? You are putting words in my mouth. That is not what I meant but if you want to twist things to suit your own agenda then go ahead. I’m sure more reasonable people will understand exactly what I meant.
In the last week I was watching either Quest or another match on Sky, cannot remember which, the topic of mic'ing the referees came up after a controversial incident.
The three pundits said that they couldn't possibly play that coverage due to the amount of foul language and abuse that could be heard during the passage of play.
I have been known to get frustrated on the terraces occasionally and utter something that on reflection probably I shouldn't have! However, that's maybe three or four times a season, still not acceptable.
The ref is getting it though in his ear for 90 minutes. Why didn't you give us a free kick or why did you give that free kick. It feels infinitely worse at the minute but perhaps that's because I'm watching every game on the TV rather than being there live?
I'm not sure it will ever change to be honest...
He wasn’t referring to Pete.
"I said that if we obeyed the laws and acted in a sportsmanlike manner it would be to our detriment"
I don't have to twist anything. Those are your own words and you've already said that you argued this at a board meeting.
I'm not having a go, believe it or not, I just think it's sad if that's the case (is if you're right in what you're saying).
Personally, I would like to see us set the best example of behaviour even if it does cost us.
We're all different though and I'll bet loads of fans agree with what you said.
I thought that he was referring to Pete as a few minutes earlier he mentioned the noise Pete was making.
Just a polite enquiry to see how you are doing up there @eric_plant?
It can be quite pleasant on a quiet summer afternoon but this time of the year the winds do howl around a lot.
When i staked it out a few years ago I did enjoy it at first but ultimately it wasn’t for me, but I do hope you are enjoying the view.
It's a sad situation when someone wanting their team to act in a respectful and sportsmanlike manner is something to be mocked
“Not very well” would have sufficed...
You have conveniently left out the last part of my sentence ‘unless every other team did exactly the same thing.’