There are too many rules in football these days that are open to interpretation. Offside for example - let's go back to if you're beyond the last defender when the ball is played forward, it's offside. Then everyone knows where they stand and VAR can be more affective.
@eric_plant said:
People getting too pissy about incorrect refereeing decisions need to grow up a bit and take it all a bit less seriously IMO
One of the worst things about Neil Harman's book for me was his constant banging on about referees. And my only criticism of the otherwise excellent 3CR coverage of Wycombe games is when Messrs Turnbull and Party turn their ire upon the matchday officials.
Just find it cringey
I've thought this about the commentary too. I don't hate it on the very rare obvious occasions where something is blatant, but a GK/corner given the wrong way round or a questionable challenge on one of our players being talked about like he'd been poleaxed is a bit OTT. I think commentators should avoid criticising referees in general, it doesn't help anyone or the game in general to constantly bash them. We know what a hard job they have.
VAR has been a disaster for football in my opinion. Yeah we had some awful decisions go against us earlier this season, but I'd still hate to have VAR at a Wycombe game. The flow and spontaneity of the game is more important to me than the need for perfect decision making (which doesn't happen with VAR anyway!).
One thing football could definitely learn from rugby is respect for the ref. Most do a good job in very difficult circumstances and need to be protected from players surrounding them, constantly arguing with them or trying to con or influence them.
I'd also adopt sin bins as an experiment - to stop the 'taking one for the team' type fouls.
Am I missing something? If we take out moaning at referees from the equation when watching games, that half the fun gone (or 90% of the fun in games like last Wednesday)
I don't like the effect that VAR has had on the decision making and rule tweaks to try and redefine off-site and handball haven't IMHO worked particularly well.
However, those campaigning that offside should be redefined such that if any part of the body is level the forward is onside or if you're beyond the last defender when the ball is played forward, it's offside miss the point that these judgements of fact still have to be determined.
Even if you change the law so that a player had to be 25cm beyond the second to last defender you'll still have an arguement about is he 25cm or 25.1cm.
The only way to change that is to allow referees to use discretion so that for instance "If, in the opinion of the referee, xyz is true than it's offside/handball" becomes the new normal.
Of course under such a system you'll always get decisions that in your opinion the referee has got wrong, and maybe the referee will actually make some mistakes and give "Hand of God" goals, or the linesman signal the ball has bounced down over the line when it didn't.
You can't please all the people all the time, but you can certainly piss many of them off - as VAR has done.
VAR could be effective, and the issue is clearly how it is administered. To me, there should be a time limit on VAR of 30 seconds. If the VAR people can't tell based on simple replays if it is offside or a penalty within 30 seconds (no fancy grids) then let it go.
Goodness! When I last looked at this thread, it was about retrospective punishments following later video review (which I felt was a good idea) but now we're back into the dastardly and never ending VAR mire!!
@bookertease said:
Am I missing something? If we take out moaning at referees from the equation when watching games, that half the fun gone (or 90% of the fun in games like last Wednesday)
While some fans will moan at anything - we seem to have some gasroom posters who take any opportunity to snipe at everything fans do.
@MindlessDrugHoover said:
One thing football could definitely learn from rugby is respect for the ref. Most do a good job in very difficult circumstances and need to be protected from players surrounding them, constantly arguing with them or trying to con or influence them.
I'd also adopt sin bins as an experiment - to stop the 'taking one for the team' type fouls.
Respect is earned not given.
Refereeing in football is generally appalling, so it's respected as such.
It's a chicken and egg situation though, because no one that plays football goes into refereeing, likely because of the abuse... Which is largely because of the complete lack of respect they get.
I know a lot of players around my age that didn't quite make the grade playing, none even considered refereeing, a few stayed in football coaching or as analysts.
I have 2 friends, one close one, who referee at a reasonable Saturday standard, and neither could trap a bag of cement, or have any real idea of how players think or act because they've never played the game to any standard... It's a certain type of person that goes into refereeing
@MindlessDrugHoover said:
One thing football could definitely learn from rugby is respect for the ref. Most do a good job in very difficult circumstances and need to be protected from players surrounding them, constantly arguing with them or trying to con or influence them.
Excellent post, whilst today's referee was one of the worst I've ever witnessed. His positioning was atrocious, he spent most of the game looking like he was attempting to tuck his shirt in.
He had his back turned on the play, every time their keeper had the ball.
But like you said, Refs receive far to much abuse and even high profile club officianadoes seem to revel in it.
Hence why the quality of people wishing to become referees appears to be dropping alarmingly.
He had his back turned on the play, every time their keeper had the ball.
>
Noticed this for certain!
Normally looking over wondering if the ref was going to actually take action at the timewasting - then seeing he wasn't even looking.
Twice getting directly in the way of play and hit by the ball, his positioning was terrible.
The second time giving the ball back to Cov keeper when Wheeler was blocked.
Not once marking 10 yards for our free kicks. Tyler Walker a culprit throughout the whole match of standing 6 or 7 yards back but not dealt with once.
Falling for some obvious conning with players throwing themselves to the ground.
We have a bad reputation, but Cov were a lot smarter playing the ref and he bought it hook, line and sinker. Their players and bench ran his match.
Comments
League is better than Union.
There are too many rules in football these days that are open to interpretation. Offside for example - let's go back to if you're beyond the last defender when the ball is played forward, it's offside. Then everyone knows where they stand and VAR can be more affective.
I've thought this about the commentary too. I don't hate it on the very rare obvious occasions where something is blatant, but a GK/corner given the wrong way round or a questionable challenge on one of our players being talked about like he'd been poleaxed is a bit OTT. I think commentators should avoid criticising referees in general, it doesn't help anyone or the game in general to constantly bash them. We know what a hard job they have.
VAR has been a disaster for football in my opinion. Yeah we had some awful decisions go against us earlier this season, but I'd still hate to have VAR at a Wycombe game. The flow and spontaneity of the game is more important to me than the need for perfect decision making (which doesn't happen with VAR anyway!).
One thing football could definitely learn from rugby is respect for the ref. Most do a good job in very difficult circumstances and need to be protected from players surrounding them, constantly arguing with them or trying to con or influence them.
I'd also adopt sin bins as an experiment - to stop the 'taking one for the team' type fouls.
Am I missing something? If we take out moaning at referees from the equation when watching games, that half the fun gone (or 90% of the fun in games like last Wednesday)
I don't like the effect that VAR has had on the decision making and rule tweaks to try and redefine off-site and handball haven't IMHO worked particularly well.
However, those campaigning that offside should be redefined such that if any part of the body is level the forward is onside or if you're beyond the last defender when the ball is played forward, it's offside miss the point that these judgements of fact still have to be determined.
Even if you change the law so that a player had to be 25cm beyond the second to last defender you'll still have an arguement about is he 25cm or 25.1cm.
The only way to change that is to allow referees to use discretion so that for instance "If, in the opinion of the referee, xyz is true than it's offside/handball" becomes the new normal.
Of course under such a system you'll always get decisions that in your opinion the referee has got wrong, and maybe the referee will actually make some mistakes and give "Hand of God" goals, or the linesman signal the ball has bounced down over the line when it didn't.
You can't please all the people all the time, but you can certainly piss many of them off - as VAR has done.
Wrongest you've ever been about anything by miles
VAR could be effective, and the issue is clearly how it is administered. To me, there should be a time limit on VAR of 30 seconds. If the VAR people can't tell based on simple replays if it is offside or a penalty within 30 seconds (no fancy grids) then let it go.
Worse than red Doritos being the best crisps?
Oh my Lord
Not even crisps. That's how wrong you are there
Doritos crisps? This is almost worst than the Millwall booing thread...
Goodness! When I last looked at this thread, it was about retrospective punishments following later video review (which I felt was a good idea) but now we're back into the dastardly and never ending VAR mire!!
Maize based crisps are better than potato based.
it's good to be reminded of that important thread. @eric_plant got quite aerated.
While some fans will moan at anything - we seem to have some gasroom posters who take any opportunity to snipe at everything fans do.
Well then.
Respect is earned not given.
Refereeing in football is generally appalling, so it's respected as such.
It's a chicken and egg situation though, because no one that plays football goes into refereeing, likely because of the abuse... Which is largely because of the complete lack of respect they get.
I know a lot of players around my age that didn't quite make the grade playing, none even considered refereeing, a few stayed in football coaching or as analysts.
I have 2 friends, one close one, who referee at a reasonable Saturday standard, and neither could trap a bag of cement, or have any real idea of how players think or act because they've never played the game to any standard... It's a certain type of person that goes into refereeing
Difficult to define the type, I guess @Username, but I bet a few responses are already formulating in wicked Gasroom minds!
Alright, no need to brag
Is @glasshalffull away on commentating duties this evening?
Excellent post, whilst today's referee was one of the worst I've ever witnessed. His positioning was atrocious, he spent most of the game looking like he was attempting to tuck his shirt in.
He had his back turned on the play, every time their keeper had the ball.
But like you said, Refs receive far to much abuse and even high profile club officianadoes seem to revel in it.
Hence why the quality of people wishing to become referees appears to be dropping alarmingly.
The refs being professional throughout all the professional leagues might help things too
I refuse to believe some of these Championship officials are professional.
They are, by definition, the worst professional referees available.
Making all EFL refs pro would improve standards throughout if the ref assessment system works.
>
>
Noticed this for certain!
Normally looking over wondering if the ref was going to actually take action at the timewasting - then seeing he wasn't even looking.
Some analysis of today's ref.
Twice getting directly in the way of play and hit by the ball, his positioning was terrible.
The second time giving the ball back to Cov keeper when Wheeler was blocked.
Not once marking 10 yards for our free kicks. Tyler Walker a culprit throughout the whole match of standing 6 or 7 yards back but not dealt with once.
Falling for some obvious conning with players throwing themselves to the ground.
We have a bad reputation, but Cov were a lot smarter playing the ref and he bought it hook, line and sinker. Their players and bench ran his match.
Only giving yellow when their keeper booted JJ.
Woeful performance
Also how i could forget. Fred penalised on the touchline for being fouled
Who was the ref today? Had he ever done it before?