Agree with the first three competitions you quote @DevC - not sure about the last two. Wasn't the Bob Lord a one off game per season? As for the PMFC - that was for the stiffs wasn't it?
@LX1 said:
This is the poster who was near gloating when we got knocked out of the FA Cup
Was I? Or was I just making the point that it wasn't the end of the world? I don't see the value in a regional cup competition in which we'll have to risk members of the first team squad - our only squad. Maybe that's because I've grown up in a different era of football, I don't know.
I can see where you're coming from and while not quoting money like you did, totally agree.
It seems odd to enter a minor cup if there's any risk involved to players.
I just think if you have to risk players who will be important to your league campaign, you want some kind of reward to balance that out. I don't imagine attendances will be particularly high, hence raising the topic of prize money. Is there even any prize money? If we could field a reserve or youth side, money wouldn't come into the equation.
Any older members will remember the dreadful injury Keith Ryan had in one of these games.
And Martin O Neill absolutely losing his sh!t at the rule that cards received in it could count in league games, but you couldn't use these games to serve suspensions.
Going slightly off subject but I remember the PMFL (or PMFC don't remember) as being seen as quite glamorous at the time - certainly first team.
Then there was some problem that meant that it wasn't finished one year (related to first miners strike and three day week possibly?) and we threw a hissy fit and withdrew when they tried to finish it at start of the following season.
I suspect I haven't got many if any of the details right here. Anyone remember?
@DevC said:
Going slightly off subject but I remember the PMFL (or PMFC don't remember) as being seen as quite glamorous at the time - certainly first team.
Then there was some problem that meant that it wasn't finished one year (related to first miners strike and three day week possibly?) and we threw a hissy fit and withdrew when they tried to finish it at start of the following season.
I suspect I haven't got many if any of the details right here. Anyone remember?
I can’t ever remember the PMFL ever being that big a competition but then I wouldn’t have been to a game in it until the early 70’s.
Certainly remember some of the B&B cup games though. The infamous final against Thatcham at Chesham (was that when we scored the fastest ever own goal?) and the final against Aylesbury(?) at the wonderful Wolverton ground as part of our end of season celebration tour as we waved goodbye to the world of the Isthmian League was a very special occasion.
By the way the Bob Lord Trophy was the ‘league cup’ for Isthmian teams so it was a proper competition. I can remember losing at home to Yeovil - one of 4 (maybe 3) defeats that season to them and feeling quite down about it
Yates, Sido, Mascoll, Pattison, JGS, Parker are barely even getting a look in to make the bench currently, our squad is plenty big enough to play these games. Add Fred in and anyone else coming back from injury and it wouldn't be a 'risk' to anyone we might need for our league campaign.
If these games weren't played then I'm sure a behind closed doors friendly would be arranged instead to enable out of favour players to maintain match fitness.
I was present at the 85/86 final when we lost to Aylesbury soon after Gola League relegation. That was a low point but I love the fact that we are back in this fine competition.
@Jonny_King said:
Evening @ChasHarps. Happy to be corrected, but haven’t we ‘only’ won it 28 times?
You are right, Wiki have it as 29, as they are counting when we defeated Thatcham in 1975 but refused to collect the Trophy. But officially its only 28.
Ah ok, thanks. So did the B&BFA subsequently award it to Thatcham? How come we didn’t collect it?
I think I read in the Peart/Finch bible that we refused to collect it once in the early years after the B&BFA refused us permission to enter the London Senior Cup.
Yes Thatcham have it on their honours list as winners, despite losing 4-0 against a Wanderers team who were down to 10 men after eleven minutes when Keith Mead was sent off. Wanderers players shook the Thatcham players hands, but did not return to pick up the trophy.
Incidentally the next season, Wanderers again reached the final after beating Chesham 4-2 in the semi. Despite Chesham not lodging a complaint, Wanderers withdrew as Jock Mckenzie had not only played but scored in a previous round for Hungerford Town. Hungerfords General manager and future Rothmans news editor Tony Williams hinted that Wanderers deliberately done this as they did not want to enter the B&B in the first place as they were denied entry to the London Senior cup. Chesham defeated Hungerford 4-0 in the final. Without these two incidents, Wanderers would have already reached the magical 30 wins.
Re above yes we refused the cup because we were not allowed to play in the London Senior cup by the B and B FA who had to give permission. So Brian Lee made the team walk straight off at the end of the final leaving the officials looking embarressed with a cup no one would pick up. The fans started chanting "we want to play in the London Senior cup". The cup was awarded many weeks later to Thatcham after they had lost 4-0 in the final to the mighty Chairboys. The following year we withdrew after the semi final when we found we had fielded an ineligible player. So we went two years unbeaten without lifting the cup. The premier midweek league there's another set of strange stories. Seems the smaller the competion the stranger the tales.
@LX1 said:
This is the poster who was near gloating when we got knocked out of the FA Cup
...Maybe that's because I've grown up in a different era of football, I don't know.
I think it probably is. I've no real criticism of your views (which I appreciate are now commonplace) but there is an element of it all being about the 'now', with seemingly little connection with the past and history. I get that it's now a low priority, but for those of us with memories of games in the competition where it genuinely mattered (in as much as football can genuinely matter) it restores a little sense of value in those memories, so yes, I'm pleased we are playing in it this season.
Both viewpoints (cup romance v league pragmatism) are pretty valid. I suspect I am between @chairboyscentral and many on this board when it comes to age (I'm 41), and I am more on the fence with the FA Cup - it felt magical as a kid, but right as I was hitting my twenties, United did not play in it for a season, and it felt different afterwards, as we entered the '2nd XI' era. If I had another 10-20 years of the cup being magical, it would be harder to let go of that.
I feel closer to the viewpoint of @chairboyscentral when it comes to the league this year, simply because it feels potentially like a once in a lifetime, Leicester-type season, and I would be willing to forego/lose in the first round of any and every cup if it would improve our chances by even a point or two. I think that if we were mired in mid-table mediocrity, I would be a lot more upset about the FA Cup loss, as it would be cutting off the potential for something romantic and wonderful. As it is, all of that may be happening in the league. And after all, as many have said, promotion would see us enter the FA Cup at the third round next year!
I do think we can put out a BB team, though, without jeopardizing too much. Phillips, Sido, Mascoll, JGS, Pattison and Parker are not really sniffing the first team, so that is more than half a team there. As long as we don't risk the generals or Charles, hopefully it can work.
@ChasHarps@Mr67 Many thanks. Nice to know we could still throw up the odd moment of anti-establishment disobedience now and then (or indeed, the occasional act of Corinthian honour).
FWIW, even as someone who doesn’t remember the non league days, I’m glad we’re entering this competition - a link to our glorious past and something that retains our links with the local football community. As others have said, whilst the league is the priority this season, we can pretty much field a second string these days without troubling our first eleven.
The Premier Midweek Floodlight League (PMFL) was started around the mid 1960s The idea behind it was to provide extra matches to those non league sides who had just installed floodlights which was a gradual process at that level during the 1960s and 1970s Wycombe installed theirs in 1963. We entered around 1969/70 at the time we scrapped our reserve team to give the squad players game time and look at the odd trialist. The competion typically consisted of leagues of between 6 and 8 playing each other home and away. As the competion grew the 3/4/5 leagues in the competion were regionalised with playoffs in theory at the end of the season to decide the overall winner. As previously mentioned the playoffs often didn't happen or were incomplete partially due to the almost annual floodlight bans mid season due to miners strikes (the 70s were not good times to be living through in the UK ). Eventually we dropped out and just played mid week friendlies when convenient. By the way the decision to scrap the reserve team was not really financially based. Incoming manager Brian Lee felt the reserve team was almost a club within a club and impeded competion for the the first team. His record 1969 -1976 would seem to show it was a correct decision at the time.
@LX1 said:
This is the poster who was near gloating when we got knocked out of the FA Cup
Was I? Or was I just making the point that it wasn't the end of the world? I don't see the value in a regional cup competition in which we'll have to risk members of the first team squad - our only squad. Maybe that's because I've grown up in a different era of football, I don't know.
Comments
For me being Bucks's only football league club gives us certain obligations. One of those is to enter a team in the county cup.
It's not always about looking at ourselves. At least one club will get to play us and maybe even get a game at Adams Park.
Not all clubs are desperate to get out of a season with as few a cup games as possible
Martin O'Neill used to openly mock fans who took the competition seriously
I think you have to be Step 5 or above to enter the Senior Cup.
Wasn't it his first trophy at Wycombe?
Agree with the first three competitions you quote @DevC - not sure about the last two. Wasn't the Bob Lord a one off game per season? As for the PMFC - that was for the stiffs wasn't it?
Any older members will remember the dreadful injury Keith Ryan had in one of these games.
And Martin O Neill absolutely losing his sh!t at the rule that cards received in it could count in league games, but you couldn't use these games to serve suspensions.
Does it have VAR?
Going slightly off subject but I remember the PMFL (or PMFC don't remember) as being seen as quite glamorous at the time - certainly first team.
Then there was some problem that meant that it wasn't finished one year (related to first miners strike and three day week possibly?) and we threw a hissy fit and withdrew when they tried to finish it at start of the following season.
I suspect I haven't got many if any of the details right here. Anyone remember?
Yeah, but only in the form of someone filming with a really low res camera phone from the noughties.
Fans are regularly heard singing the "29 times" song even today
Going slightly off topic? Who'd have thought it.
I can’t ever remember the PMFL ever being that big a competition but then I wouldn’t have been to a game in it until the early 70’s.
Certainly remember some of the B&B cup games though. The infamous final against Thatcham at Chesham (was that when we scored the fastest ever own goal?) and the final against Aylesbury(?) at the wonderful Wolverton ground as part of our end of season celebration tour as we waved goodbye to the world of the Isthmian League was a very special occasion.
By the way the Bob Lord Trophy was the ‘league cup’ for Isthmian teams so it was a proper competition. I can remember losing at home to Yeovil - one of 4 (maybe 3) defeats that season to them and feeling quite down about it
.The infamous final against Thatcham at Chesham
Was the Thatcham final the one where we refused to collect the trophy?
The highs and lows of recent B&B adventures:
Yates, Sido, Mascoll, Pattison, JGS, Parker are barely even getting a look in to make the bench currently, our squad is plenty big enough to play these games. Add Fred in and anyone else coming back from injury and it wouldn't be a 'risk' to anyone we might need for our league campaign.
If these games weren't played then I'm sure a behind closed doors friendly would be arranged instead to enable out of favour players to maintain match fitness.
Yes @floyd. that’s the one. A bizarre game all round from what I remember. And if my memory is half right the all-time worst referee ever.
Just googled a bit. My memory has mashed up the Thatcham final with a B&B tie at Chesham the following year.
Evening @ChasHarps. Happy to be corrected, but haven’t we ‘only’ won it 28 times?
I was present at the 85/86 final when we lost to Aylesbury soon after Gola League relegation. That was a low point but I love the fact that we are back in this fine competition.
You are right, Wiki have it as 29, as they are counting when we defeated Thatcham in 1975 but refused to collect the Trophy. But officially its only 28.
Ah ok, thanks. So did the B&BFA subsequently award it to Thatcham? How come we didn’t collect it?
I think I read in the Peart/Finch bible that we refused to collect it once in the early years after the B&BFA refused us permission to enter the London Senior Cup.
Yes Thatcham have it on their honours list as winners, despite losing 4-0 against a Wanderers team who were down to 10 men after eleven minutes when Keith Mead was sent off. Wanderers players shook the Thatcham players hands, but did not return to pick up the trophy.
Incidentally the next season, Wanderers again reached the final after beating Chesham 4-2 in the semi. Despite Chesham not lodging a complaint, Wanderers withdrew as Jock Mckenzie had not only played but scored in a previous round for Hungerford Town. Hungerfords General manager and future Rothmans news editor Tony Williams hinted that Wanderers deliberately done this as they did not want to enter the B&B in the first place as they were denied entry to the London Senior cup. Chesham defeated Hungerford 4-0 in the final. Without these two incidents, Wanderers would have already reached the magical 30 wins.
Re above yes we refused the cup because we were not allowed to play in the London Senior cup by the B and B FA who had to give permission. So Brian Lee made the team walk straight off at the end of the final leaving the officials looking embarressed with a cup no one would pick up. The fans started chanting "we want to play in the London Senior cup". The cup was awarded many weeks later to Thatcham after they had lost 4-0 in the final to the mighty Chairboys. The following year we withdrew after the semi final when we found we had fielded an ineligible player. So we went two years unbeaten without lifting the cup. The premier midweek league there's another set of strange stories. Seems the smaller the competion the stranger the tales.
I understand that Thatcham were classified as 'holders' of the cup, and not 'winners'.
I can only imagine the scenes when everyone has to boycott the final because we are playing MK Dons.
Both viewpoints (cup romance v league pragmatism) are pretty valid. I suspect I am between @chairboyscentral and many on this board when it comes to age (I'm 41), and I am more on the fence with the FA Cup - it felt magical as a kid, but right as I was hitting my twenties, United did not play in it for a season, and it felt different afterwards, as we entered the '2nd XI' era. If I had another 10-20 years of the cup being magical, it would be harder to let go of that.
I feel closer to the viewpoint of @chairboyscentral when it comes to the league this year, simply because it feels potentially like a once in a lifetime, Leicester-type season, and I would be willing to forego/lose in the first round of any and every cup if it would improve our chances by even a point or two. I think that if we were mired in mid-table mediocrity, I would be a lot more upset about the FA Cup loss, as it would be cutting off the potential for something romantic and wonderful. As it is, all of that may be happening in the league. And after all, as many have said, promotion would see us enter the FA Cup at the third round next year!
I do think we can put out a BB team, though, without jeopardizing too much. Phillips, Sido, Mascoll, JGS, Pattison and Parker are not really sniffing the first team, so that is more than half a team there. As long as we don't risk the generals or Charles, hopefully it can work.
@ChasHarps @Mr67 Many thanks. Nice to know we could still throw up the odd moment of anti-establishment disobedience now and then (or indeed, the occasional act of Corinthian honour).
FWIW, even as someone who doesn’t remember the non league days, I’m glad we’re entering this competition - a link to our glorious past and something that retains our links with the local football community. As others have said, whilst the league is the priority this season, we can pretty much field a second string these days without troubling our first eleven.
The Premier Midweek Floodlight League (PMFL) was started around the mid 1960s The idea behind it was to provide extra matches to those non league sides who had just installed floodlights which was a gradual process at that level during the 1960s and 1970s Wycombe installed theirs in 1963. We entered around 1969/70 at the time we scrapped our reserve team to give the squad players game time and look at the odd trialist. The competion typically consisted of leagues of between 6 and 8 playing each other home and away. As the competion grew the 3/4/5 leagues in the competion were regionalised with playoffs in theory at the end of the season to decide the overall winner. As previously mentioned the playoffs often didn't happen or were incomplete partially due to the almost annual floodlight bans mid season due to miners strikes (the 70s were not good times to be living through in the UK ). Eventually we dropped out and just played mid week friendlies when convenient. By the way the decision to scrap the reserve team was not really financially based. Incoming manager Brian Lee felt the reserve team was almost a club within a club and impeded competion for the the first team. His record 1969 -1976 would seem to show it was a correct decision at the time.
Yes you were. Brazenly