The comments on here are interesting but the lack of a report and reaction from the opposition is a sad loss. Of course you can go looking for them elsewhere but it's not the same.
As much as i love Bayo he is not League 1 standard,Wimbledon let him go 2 seasons ago for a reason after their promotion. 13 games without a goal is not good and while he starts games Kashket,Paris and Freeman are stuck on the bench. Playing League 2 tactics will not do us any favours this season in League 1.
@robin said:
As much as i love Bayo he is not League 1 standard,Wimbledon let him go 2 seasons ago for a reason after their promotion. 13 games without a goal is not good and while he starts games Kashket,Paris and Freeman are stuck on the bench. Playing League 2 tactics will not do us any favours this season in League 1.
Haven't Kashket & Paris been injured for a while? I'm pretty sure that if you throw them in at the deep end & start playing them for 90 minutes too soon, they only spend more time in the treatment room & you'll be moaning about that as well. Much as I love Freeman when he's on song, I can't remember seeing him have a great influence on many, (in any), games that he's started?
Kashket played 90 minutes at Northampton and scored a stunning goal,Akinfenwa hasn't scored in 13 games so at least give others a chance rather than someone who isn't scoring or getting close to getting a goal.
@Shev said:
I think Bayo still has a lot to offer at this level, but looked better for me as the super sub on 70 minutes, when the other side are tiring.
I agree but he shouldn't be starting games in this division as otherwise our bigger goal threats will get sore arses on the bench while he gets owned by League 1 defences,it's down to Ainsworth i know but after seeing him on Quest last night saying he won't change things i'm worried,if we're not winning games doesn't it make sense to change the starting XI?
If we were seeing the Doncaster situation, where we didn't really look like scoring, and took a bit of a smash it'd be one thing, but that's the only time that's happened so far.
We might well have to go a little more defensive at times in these big away games though. All about reading the game and seeing when the more quality opponent is on the up.
We matched and bettered them for good spells, but when they turned it on, they had it won in a short spell.
I'd either like to see a Bao-CMS front two, and work a 4 behind them, or go back to the CMS central lone striker and see how that goes again, especially away.
It's easy to forget that we controlled the opening 30mins yesterday and Bayo was a big part of that, his hold up play and quick passing were causing the Charlton defence plenty of problems. Far too early to be writing him off, personally I still think he'll have a big part to play this season. It is clear though though that he won't get the better of defences in the air like he did in League 2, my preference would be to use him as a sub against tiring defenders rather than starting for the moment at least, but that not to say there isn't value in him starting some matches, horses for courses and all that!
I don’t understand why people jump to conclusions about Bayo. Admittedly he hasn’t exactly hit the ground running but that doesn’t justify writing him off for the whole season. He has already made several goal assists and his very presence forces opposition teams to make special plans to contain him. I firmly believe that he will still be a major player for us in this campaign.
I get the "League 1 defenders are better" view, that's obvious.
I don't accept that they're all better in the air though. There's a lot of absolute meathead league 2 defenders who all they are strong at is heading.
There were games last year Bayo barely got any change out of defenders, and there will be games he'll beat defenders up in.
What we have to do is get better delivery. Straight balls launched from our half are not the way to maximise.
An ex boss of mine gave me some good advice 25 years years ago, He said that if you are angry about something then wait at least 24 hours to calm down. If
you are still of the same opinion then speak up. I have taken my late bosses advice. To this end as much as I respect & agree with Gareth on so many issues, nine times out of ten I disagee with his choice & timing of his subs. Yesterday the game turned at half time when he kept Bayo on. Sadly as one of Byos fans he had a stinker. To be honest for once he fouled more times than sinned against. Gareth then decided to take Williams off. The game then turned on his head. If Williams was injured then I hold my hands up. I had made Williams M O N at that point as had others around me.
Most managers including Martin decided to view a game on the touchline which is the best way to lift players, I am unable to read a game unless I am at a higher level. Perhaps Gareth should employ someone behind the goal or in one of the stands to obtain a second opinion. I would love to know Gareths thinking in taking Williams off. Was he injured?
I also thought that Thompson was MON just ahead of Williams. The moans my family gave before the match that Thompson was selected proved that what do we know!
So looking forward to Saturday. What is more important that everyone in attendance gets behind the team, as this could be a pivitol moment in our season!
As much as I was disapointed yesterday, I truly believe that we are far better than our league position shows at the moment.
I haven't posted on here for some time but I hope that you find this post constructive.
But did Bayo really have a "stinker"? Personally I thought he had a good game, certainly when he had the ball at his feet or when it came into his chest. I was with a neutral mate who also commented on how well he was playing. He was in my opinion dominated in the air, but then again the quality of crossing was lacking yesterday which didn't help him. It was interesting to read a similar broad range of opinions on the Charlton forum, some saying their centre back had him in his pocket, whilst others commented on how well they thought he played. For me, it was all about whether he had the ball at his feet or whether it came to him in the air, but I'm surprised people thought he had a poor game overall. He just seemed to become a scapegoat (along with JJ) for some when we had that poor spell in the 2nd half.
I don't really think we had a poor spell. We had conceded two goals against the run of play. The first looked to be quite a cruel happenstance from where I was on the left of the goal facing the pitch.
I think once it went 2 - 1 Charlton thought they could work miracles and it also worked wonders for what up to that point had been an their excuse for a crowd of supporters. They then had a 15 minute spell in which they played as well as we did during the rest of the game.
Credit to all, and especially Paris, that we didn't call it a day.
In summary, I think we looked the side most likely to score the first goal, the second goal, and the third goal when it was 1 - 1, I think it was 50 / 50 who was going to score the fourth and we looked most likely to score the fifth. I think that is why it was such a frustrating game for us.
I bumped into The Chair yesterday while walking the dog. We had one of those 30 yards apart brief “conversations” about the game. What with my impaired hearing, the distance apart and the transience of the situation, the exchange wasn’t that constructive and there was no real meeting of minds but, at the back of my own mind were images, close up ones, from the excellent HD iFollow coverage. Among those images were many of Bayo receiving the ball, controlling it and, despite the usual close attention, passing accurately to a teammate. In common with several others, he was less effective for much of the second half.
The Chair refers to one or two players transmogrifying into Martin O’Neill (MON), including Randell Williams. The latter scored a superb early goal, aided by the Charlton defence affording him acres of space - no doubt as a result of their attention being distracted by Bayo’s presence in the middle.
The Chair was disappointed to see Williams replaced by Kashket as early as 63 minutes but the former has played a lot of football, considerably more than the fit-again Kashket, and at that stage it was reasonable to suppose that a fresh-legged Kashket would be more of a threat than a tiring Williams, always remembering that GA’ s approach is to go for the win, rather than shore up the defence and play for a draw. There may be a lesson there but I think he is too resolute to be likely to change.
A friend who has been a season ticket holder at the Valley for at least 40 years rang me yesterday to say how much he and his brother had enjoyed the game and that they both felt a draw would have been a fair result. He thought GA should have defended 1-1. He may have been right!
He was blown away by Wycombe’s first half display and couldn’t remember a better League performance by them against Charlton. Praise indeed.
My Charlton mate also felt that Sido was at fault for the own goal insofar as he would have seen the ball approaching from about 20 yards away. He was behind the goal so would have had a good view. From hero to zero?! Perhaps and, perversely, that’s what we tend to love about Sido.
I look forward to his return to hero on Saturday against Oxford. On the strength of Oxford’s game against Coventry yesterday, I think it will be tough and that there will be a lot of grappling, with arms fully interlocked at times.
@Wycombe85 said:
For me, it was all about whether he had the ball at his feet or whether it came to him in the air
This. I don't remember him actually getting off the ground once. However, half of Bayo's game is off the ball and he definitely did a great job at that on Saturday.
I think Bayo has a big part to play this season and his holding and build-up play is still excellent. I just think if we play a front three it should initially be CMS in the middle with Bayo as impact sub...or CMS and williams/PCH in a front two. But I do agree we look better than last year and should...as is the main aim...stay up.
As in Kashket @Micra? It is tricky. 4-4-2 partnered with CMS would probably be best...not sure 4-3-3 suits him either as wing forward or centre forward. What is your secret plan...richie can pass it on to Gaz for us.
Not sure about the need for “reads like” @Malone. Seems pretty transparent to me but I wrote it so I would say that, wouldn’t I. We’ve lost all previous League encounters by the odd goal but in none of those matches did we compete like we did on Saturday. We did of course have one famous 1-0 victory at the Valley in the league cup in December 2006 on our way to the semi-final. Hence my stress on “League”. Believe me, my south London mate, a former player, rarely expresses admiration for Charlton’s opponents.
My cheeky mistake @micra.
I was incorrectly thinking we'd only played them twice in the league - the infamous Duberry "not making up the numbers" season. Completely didn't realise we'd played them one other season, so far from being a curious stat (from all of 2 other games), it's a more allowable one (with 4 others)!
I've been to Charlton 3 times myself now. It's funny how you can completely not recognise a place when you arrive on a different method of transport to the others (train v coach).
After the infamous 3hour 05mins journey of the Duberry season, where we set off at 12, and they hadn't realised there was a major 02 event on, train is the only option!
@Wycombe85 said:
For me, it was all about whether he had the ball at his feet or whether it came to him in the air
This. I don't remember him actually getting off the ground once. However, half of Bayo's game is off the ball and he definitely did a great job at that on Saturday.
Perhaps the problem good Dr is not Bayo at all but the fact he is overplayed, never subbed, played when not fit etc. Would hate to see him go the way of Hayes and still be regular 90 minutes player when it's beyond him.
Comments
The comments on here are interesting but the lack of a report and reaction from the opposition is a sad loss. Of course you can go looking for them elsewhere but it's not the same.
I'm really missing the excellent Vital previews, reports and opposition views this season - shows what a great job Len & co. did for so long.
I've resorted to cheering myself up reading the comments on the Oxford, Plymouth and Notts County Twitter feeds.
Totally agree about missing the high quality work of Vital @Len and team.
Totally agree re Vital, can’t make as many games as I would like. The match report, player marks out of 10 and opposition view was ‘vitsl’ reading.
As much as i love Bayo he is not League 1 standard,Wimbledon let him go 2 seasons ago for a reason after their promotion. 13 games without a goal is not good and while he starts games Kashket,Paris and Freeman are stuck on the bench. Playing League 2 tactics will not do us any favours this season in League 1.
Haven't Kashket & Paris been injured for a while? I'm pretty sure that if you throw them in at the deep end & start playing them for 90 minutes too soon, they only spend more time in the treatment room & you'll be moaning about that as well. Much as I love Freeman when he's on song, I can't remember seeing him have a great influence on many, (in any), games that he's started?
Kashket played 90 minutes at Northampton and scored a stunning goal,Akinfenwa hasn't scored in 13 games so at least give others a chance rather than someone who isn't scoring or getting close to getting a goal.
I think Bayo still has a lot to offer at this level, but looked better for me as the super sub on 70 minutes, when the other side are tiring.
I agree but he shouldn't be starting games in this division as otherwise our bigger goal threats will get sore arses on the bench while he gets owned by League 1 defences,it's down to Ainsworth i know but after seeing him on Quest last night saying he won't change things i'm worried,if we're not winning games doesn't it make sense to change the starting XI?
If we were seeing the Doncaster situation, where we didn't really look like scoring, and took a bit of a smash it'd be one thing, but that's the only time that's happened so far.
We might well have to go a little more defensive at times in these big away games though. All about reading the game and seeing when the more quality opponent is on the up.
We matched and bettered them for good spells, but when they turned it on, they had it won in a short spell.
I'd either like to see a Bao-CMS front two, and work a 4 behind them, or go back to the CMS central lone striker and see how that goes again, especially away.
It's easy to forget that we controlled the opening 30mins yesterday and Bayo was a big part of that, his hold up play and quick passing were causing the Charlton defence plenty of problems. Far too early to be writing him off, personally I still think he'll have a big part to play this season. It is clear though though that he won't get the better of defences in the air like he did in League 2, my preference would be to use him as a sub against tiring defenders rather than starting for the moment at least, but that not to say there isn't value in him starting some matches, horses for courses and all that!
I don’t understand why people jump to conclusions about Bayo. Admittedly he hasn’t exactly hit the ground running but that doesn’t justify writing him off for the whole season. He has already made several goal assists and his very presence forces opposition teams to make special plans to contain him. I firmly believe that he will still be a major player for us in this campaign.
I get the "League 1 defenders are better" view, that's obvious.
I don't accept that they're all better in the air though. There's a lot of absolute meathead league 2 defenders who all they are strong at is heading.
There were games last year Bayo barely got any change out of defenders, and there will be games he'll beat defenders up in.
What we have to do is get better delivery. Straight balls launched from our half are not the way to maximise.
An ex boss of mine gave me some good advice 25 years years ago, He said that if you are angry about something then wait at least 24 hours to calm down. If
you are still of the same opinion then speak up. I have taken my late bosses advice. To this end as much as I respect & agree with Gareth on so many issues, nine times out of ten I disagee with his choice & timing of his subs. Yesterday the game turned at half time when he kept Bayo on. Sadly as one of Byos fans he had a stinker. To be honest for once he fouled more times than sinned against. Gareth then decided to take Williams off. The game then turned on his head. If Williams was injured then I hold my hands up. I had made Williams M O N at that point as had others around me.
Most managers including Martin decided to view a game on the touchline which is the best way to lift players, I am unable to read a game unless I am at a higher level. Perhaps Gareth should employ someone behind the goal or in one of the stands to obtain a second opinion. I would love to know Gareths thinking in taking Williams off. Was he injured?
I also thought that Thompson was MON just ahead of Williams. The moans my family gave before the match that Thompson was selected proved that what do we know!
So looking forward to Saturday. What is more important that everyone in attendance gets behind the team, as this could be a pivitol moment in our season!
As much as I was disapointed yesterday, I truly believe that we are far better than our league position shows at the moment.
I haven't posted on here for some time but I hope that you find this post constructive.
CHAIRBOYS -- BARMY ARMY
But did Bayo really have a "stinker"? Personally I thought he had a good game, certainly when he had the ball at his feet or when it came into his chest. I was with a neutral mate who also commented on how well he was playing. He was in my opinion dominated in the air, but then again the quality of crossing was lacking yesterday which didn't help him. It was interesting to read a similar broad range of opinions on the Charlton forum, some saying their centre back had him in his pocket, whilst others commented on how well they thought he played. For me, it was all about whether he had the ball at his feet or whether it came to him in the air, but I'm surprised people thought he had a poor game overall. He just seemed to become a scapegoat (along with JJ) for some when we had that poor spell in the 2nd half.
I don't really think we had a poor spell. We had conceded two goals against the run of play. The first looked to be quite a cruel happenstance from where I was on the left of the goal facing the pitch.
I think once it went 2 - 1 Charlton thought they could work miracles and it also worked wonders for what up to that point had been an their excuse for a crowd of supporters. They then had a 15 minute spell in which they played as well as we did during the rest of the game.
Credit to all, and especially Paris, that we didn't call it a day.
In summary, I think we looked the side most likely to score the first goal, the second goal, and the third goal when it was 1 - 1, I think it was 50 / 50 who was going to score the fourth and we looked most likely to score the fifth. I think that is why it was such a frustrating game for us.
I don't think anyone had a stinker.
I bumped into The Chair yesterday while walking the dog. We had one of those 30 yards apart brief “conversations” about the game. What with my impaired hearing, the distance apart and the transience of the situation, the exchange wasn’t that constructive and there was no real meeting of minds but, at the back of my own mind were images, close up ones, from the excellent HD iFollow coverage. Among those images were many of Bayo receiving the ball, controlling it and, despite the usual close attention, passing accurately to a teammate. In common with several others, he was less effective for much of the second half.
The Chair refers to one or two players transmogrifying into Martin O’Neill (MON), including Randell Williams. The latter scored a superb early goal, aided by the Charlton defence affording him acres of space - no doubt as a result of their attention being distracted by Bayo’s presence in the middle.
The Chair was disappointed to see Williams replaced by Kashket as early as 63 minutes but the former has played a lot of football, considerably more than the fit-again Kashket, and at that stage it was reasonable to suppose that a fresh-legged Kashket would be more of a threat than a tiring Williams, always remembering that GA’ s approach is to go for the win, rather than shore up the defence and play for a draw. There may be a lesson there but I think he is too resolute to be likely to change.
A friend who has been a season ticket holder at the Valley for at least 40 years rang me yesterday to say how much he and his brother had enjoyed the game and that they both felt a draw would have been a fair result. He thought GA should have defended 1-1. He may have been right!
He was blown away by Wycombe’s first half display and couldn’t remember a better League performance by them against Charlton. Praise indeed.
My Charlton mate also felt that Sido was at fault for the own goal insofar as he would have seen the ball approaching from about 20 yards away. He was behind the goal so would have had a good view. From hero to zero?! Perhaps and, perversely, that’s what we tend to love about Sido.
I look forward to his return to hero on Saturday against Oxford. On the strength of Oxford’s game against Coventry yesterday, I think it will be tough and that there will be a lot of grappling, with arms fully interlocked at times.
This. I don't remember him actually getting off the ground once. However, half of Bayo's game is off the ball and he definitely did a great job at that on Saturday.
I think Bayo has a big part to play this season and his holding and build-up play is still excellent. I just think if we play a front three it should initially be CMS in the middle with Bayo as impact sub...or CMS and williams/PCH in a front two. But I do agree we look better than last year and should...as is the main aim...stay up.
I agree with that @Wendoverman but when are you going to play our leading scorer and in what formation?
As in Kashket @Micra? It is tricky. 4-4-2 partnered with CMS would probably be best...not sure 4-3-3 suits him either as wing forward or centre forward. What is your secret plan...richie can pass it on to Gaz for us.
@micra , this reads like your pal couldn't remember a better league performance by Wycombe against Charlton.
Now that wouldn't have a lot of choice!!
Not sure about the need for “reads like” @Malone. Seems pretty transparent to me but I wrote it so I would say that, wouldn’t I. We’ve lost all previous League encounters by the odd goal but in none of those matches did we compete like we did on Saturday. We did of course have one famous 1-0 victory at the Valley in the league cup in December 2006 on our way to the semi-final. Hence my stress on “League”. Believe me, my south London mate, a former player, rarely expresses admiration for Charlton’s opponents.
My cheeky mistake @micra.
I was incorrectly thinking we'd only played them twice in the league - the infamous Duberry "not making up the numbers" season. Completely didn't realise we'd played them one other season, so far from being a curious stat (from all of 2 other games), it's a more allowable one (with 4 others)!
Spot on, Cheeky! ?
I've been to Charlton 3 times myself now. It's funny how you can completely not recognise a place when you arrive on a different method of transport to the others (train v coach).
After the infamous 3hour 05mins journey of the Duberry season, where we set off at 12, and they hadn't realised there was a major 02 event on, train is the only option!
Perhaps the problem good Dr is not Bayo at all but the fact he is overplayed, never subbed, played when not fit etc. Would hate to see him go the way of Hayes and still be regular 90 minutes player when it's beyond him.
Well, he was subbed on Saturday, albeit late on. Maybe he sobbed.