It’s very encouraging that all three new candidates are making themselves available on Gasroom.most directors read Gasroom often but not many have the courage like Dale to admit it and join in the transparent debate.dooly can you be clearer about what you are saying is going on I feel more confused after reading your comments
Ever thought of joining the police, peter. they need people like you....
Thanks to Dj (Dale) for his efforts. Shame to see a younger person go but understand very hard to balance job, relationship, kids at that age. Perhaps you could suggest that someone should take on communicating through this (and I suppose) the facebook page
@callsignCharlie I think you do a disservice Lisa by calling yourself the wildcard candidate. We've never met, but just from being around the club I'm well aware of the amount of passion you have the club, and the amount of time and service you dedicate to your roles. Good luck with the election!
@Wendoverman said:
I am not sure I follow Dooley 's post at all. Am I being a bit dim? (Answers on a postcard...)
Nope. I think I know what he is getting at but 99% of people reading this thread wouldn't, making it one of the most pointless posts (amongst much competition) on this board. Given he is posting anonymously and has nothing to lose, I wonder if @Dooley will specifically name those he is referring to, and explain fully what actions they are supposed to have taken? Otherwise he may as well not have bothered joining this board today.
Well there aren't too many "key elected officials" on the Trust or Club boards. But if "people need to speak up" perhaps @Dooley could be more specific - it seems many of us are still in the dark...
@ForeverBlue I remember a husband and wife who were very involved with Hithercroft, but I can't remember their names. Guess that was them though. Just remembered Sam Lacey's another one from that team who still follows Wycombe home and away.
@Jonny_King good to know, will keep an eye out for him although guess he's probably changed a bit in all these years. Thanks for the good wishes, appreciated.
I do understand what @Dooley is getting at but a public internet forum is probably not a good place to discuss sensitive Trust matters. I sometimes think we need secure discussion groups, like the ones MPs use on WhatsApp, where Trust members can share thoughts privately and without the fear of reproach, such as I have witnessed at supporter meetings, when perfectly reasonable points were raised.
When it comes to WWFC there is no more important topic to me than the club’s ownership. Last season, in a matchday programme, Trevor Stroud questioned how the football club should be financed in the future, whether our Trust-owned model is sustainable. At the time I took it as a hint that there may be an attempt to change our model, only encouraged by learning that a fellow supporter submitted an article in response for a following programme, warning about the dangers of attracting outside investment through private ownership, because there are too many unsavoury characters looking to buy into clubs (I think the next owners could very well be very beneficial for the club, it’s the future owners you have to worry about).
That article, reasonably argued and not controversial in any way, was rejected on the grounds that it was not appropriate for the matchday programme. If so then neither was Trevor’s. The supporter suggested that the idea, for example, of the Trust keeping a minority stake in the club, in return for that outside investment, would lead to the Trust being sidelined with no meaningful say on the future running of the club. It was further argued that financial stability has been achieved, through a great deal of hard work by the Trust, finances are still very tight but it is possible to operate within strict financial limits, and any upward movement has to be within those limits.
I may be an idealist, naive even, but I will fight tooth and nail to keep this club wholly Trust owned. I will, for example, not entertain a debt-for-equity-swap in any way, enabling some of our debtors to swap their large financial investment for a hard stake in the club, whether a minority or majority stake. If keeping Trust owned means that we cannot progress upward for some time, then so be it. With very careful financial management, as we have shown in recent years, creative marketing and professional administration, I believe we can sustain our current model for the near future.
Anyone standing for election to the Trust Board, who firmly believes that we should stay wholly Trust owned, gets my vote. So I was a little disappointed to read their statements and find that no one mentioned our future ownership model directly, given that Trevor has opened it up for general discussion.
@Steve Peart Whether you are an idealist or naive you are not alone, there are more than enough Trust members who believe that Supporter owned football clubs is the way forward for lower league teams. What we cannot see from the 2017 accounts published recently is the full picture. There is no relationship in the trust accounts to the two subsidaries, other than a bland statement regarding current Capital and reserves, as at June 2017, and that the Trust now owes WWFC a rather large sum.
Intrigued and puzzled, Steve by the bracketed comment at the end of your second paragraph.
Similar reaction, @wformation to your comment about the Trust owing the football club a rather large
.......sum of money. (The latest IOS update on Apple has mercifully made it possible to see what I am typing but altered alignments make it easier to tap “post” instead of “Done”.)
I’m very much in favour of fan ownership.
@micra, just a general comment for any club, which could have been worded more clearly. Nothing specific in mind, any potential new owners might look beneficial at the time but you never know what future owners might bring. We are very fortunate to be playing in the Football League as a Trust owned club. We should be proud of that and ensure that it continues.
Thanks for the clarification. I sincerely hope that we don’t go through another “will they, won’t they?” “WTF are they?” period of uncertainty like we did a few years ago.
@micra, don't be puzzled, if you are a Trust member the information is available, albeit not clearly shown on page 6 under note 6( it is confusing as the year is incorrectly shown as 2017 when it should read 2016) and note 9 gives the amount shown on page 9. I have deliberately not shown the figures as they have yet to be approved by the members at the AGM.
WWFC has loaned trust £900k which in turn has loaned stadium company £1.2m (with balance made up from trading profit, debtors and share capital). Cant immediately think of any major works on the ground last year that needed funding (??), so either stadium company has loaned it back to football club, or more likely the debt to Hayes paid off by Ibe transfer was in the stadium company name, so Liverpool pay football club for Ibe, football club loans it to trust, trust to stadium company, stadium company pays Hayes.
Inter-group company loans are not normally anything to worry about.
If that arrangement is the case (which seems fairly likely - the trust note on their website Most major debts of the Trust sit under FALL, secured by charges on Adams Park, but Wycombe Wanderers Trust also has some debts to pay. ) given the amounts involved are material it would have been helpful to have some narrative about it in the accounts, in order to give the users of those accounts a better understanding.
Comments
It’s very encouraging that all three new candidates are making themselves available on Gasroom.most directors read Gasroom often but not many have the courage like Dale to admit it and join in the transparent debate.dooly can you be clearer about what you are saying is going on I feel more confused after reading your comments
Ever thought of joining the police, peter. they need people like you....
Thanks to Dj (Dale) for his efforts. Shame to see a younger person go but understand very hard to balance job, relationship, kids at that age. Perhaps you could suggest that someone should take on communicating through this (and I suppose) the facebook page
Sorry yes I am Lisa Bowker! Should have stated that in my comment.
@callsignCharlie I think you do a disservice Lisa by calling yourself the wildcard candidate. We've never met, but just from being around the club I'm well aware of the amount of passion you have the club, and the amount of time and service you dedicate to your roles. Good luck with the election!
@Last_Quarter Thank you, I appreciate that.
I am not sure I follow @Dooley 's post at all. Am I being a bit dim? (Answers on a postcard...)
Nope. I think I know what he is getting at but 99% of people reading this thread wouldn't, making it one of the most pointless posts (amongst much competition) on this board. Given he is posting anonymously and has nothing to lose, I wonder if @Dooley will specifically name those he is referring to, and explain fully what actions they are supposed to have taken? Otherwise he may as well not have bothered joining this board today.
I would much prefer @dooley did not use this space as a place to seek to conduct his trial by media.
@HCblue That's the best thing about the gasroom, there's all kinds of shit on here.
If it all gets sorted out and there IS any extra money going...I'd like some.
Dooley noted
Any leftover £s to be used to fashion a tin-foil hat.
I don’t even understand the allegation, let alone who it is?!?
Well there aren't too many "key elected officials" on the Trust or Club boards. But if "people need to speak up" perhaps @Dooley could be more specific - it seems many of us are still in the dark...
And to think that I refrained from comment for fear of being accused of having my head in the sand. What’s it all about, Dooley?
@ForeverBlue I remember a husband and wife who were very involved with Hithercroft, but I can't remember their names. Guess that was them though. Just remembered Sam Lacey's another one from that team who still follows Wycombe home and away.
Best of luck with the elections.
@Jonny_King good to know, will keep an eye out for him although guess he's probably changed a bit in all these years. Thanks for the good wishes, appreciated.
I do understand what @Dooley is getting at but a public internet forum is probably not a good place to discuss sensitive Trust matters. I sometimes think we need secure discussion groups, like the ones MPs use on WhatsApp, where Trust members can share thoughts privately and without the fear of reproach, such as I have witnessed at supporter meetings, when perfectly reasonable points were raised.
When it comes to WWFC there is no more important topic to me than the club’s ownership. Last season, in a matchday programme, Trevor Stroud questioned how the football club should be financed in the future, whether our Trust-owned model is sustainable. At the time I took it as a hint that there may be an attempt to change our model, only encouraged by learning that a fellow supporter submitted an article in response for a following programme, warning about the dangers of attracting outside investment through private ownership, because there are too many unsavoury characters looking to buy into clubs (I think the next owners could very well be very beneficial for the club, it’s the future owners you have to worry about).
That article, reasonably argued and not controversial in any way, was rejected on the grounds that it was not appropriate for the matchday programme. If so then neither was Trevor’s. The supporter suggested that the idea, for example, of the Trust keeping a minority stake in the club, in return for that outside investment, would lead to the Trust being sidelined with no meaningful say on the future running of the club. It was further argued that financial stability has been achieved, through a great deal of hard work by the Trust, finances are still very tight but it is possible to operate within strict financial limits, and any upward movement has to be within those limits.
I may be an idealist, naive even, but I will fight tooth and nail to keep this club wholly Trust owned. I will, for example, not entertain a debt-for-equity-swap in any way, enabling some of our debtors to swap their large financial investment for a hard stake in the club, whether a minority or majority stake. If keeping Trust owned means that we cannot progress upward for some time, then so be it. With very careful financial management, as we have shown in recent years, creative marketing and professional administration, I believe we can sustain our current model for the near future.
Anyone standing for election to the Trust Board, who firmly believes that we should stay wholly Trust owned, gets my vote. So I was a little disappointed to read their statements and find that no one mentioned our future ownership model directly, given that Trevor has opened it up for general discussion.
@Steve Peart Whether you are an idealist or naive you are not alone, there are more than enough Trust members who believe that Supporter owned football clubs is the way forward for lower league teams. What we cannot see from the 2017 accounts published recently is the full picture. There is no relationship in the trust accounts to the two subsidaries, other than a bland statement regarding current Capital and reserves, as at June 2017, and that the Trust now owes WWFC a rather large sum.
Intrigued and puzzled, Steve by the bracketed comment at the end of your second paragraph.
Similar reaction, @wformation to your comment about the Trust owing the football club a rather large
.......sum of money. (The latest IOS update on Apple has mercifully made it possible to see what I am typing but altered alignments make it easier to tap “post” instead of “Done”.)
I’m very much in favour of fan ownership.
@micra, just a general comment for any club, which could have been worded more clearly. Nothing specific in mind, any potential new owners might look beneficial at the time but you never know what future owners might bring. We are very fortunate to be playing in the Football League as a Trust owned club. We should be proud of that and ensure that it continues.
Thanks for the clarification. I sincerely hope that we don’t go through another “will they, won’t they?” “WTF are they?” period of uncertainty like we did a few years ago.
@micra, don't be puzzled, if you are a Trust member the information is available, albeit not clearly shown on page 6 under note 6( it is confusing as the year is incorrectly shown as 2017 when it should read 2016) and note 9 gives the amount shown on page 9. I have deliberately not shown the figures as they have yet to be approved by the members at the AGM.
Sounds like I have no option but to be puzzled.
Premature posting yet again. That IOS update has a lot to answer for. What is the document to which you allude, @wformation ?
Sorry Micra, It is Page 8 Not 6, And the Document is the 2017 Trust accounts
Ah, the one that should read 2016 I assume.
I’ve now looked at the accounts but need help with interpretation; I’ll wait for all to be explained at the meeting.
WWFC has loaned trust £900k which in turn has loaned stadium company £1.2m (with balance made up from trading profit, debtors and share capital). Cant immediately think of any major works on the ground last year that needed funding (??), so either stadium company has loaned it back to football club, or more likely the debt to Hayes paid off by Ibe transfer was in the stadium company name, so Liverpool pay football club for Ibe, football club loans it to trust, trust to stadium company, stadium company pays Hayes.
Inter-group company loans are not normally anything to worry about.
If that arrangement is the case (which seems fairly likely - the trust note on their website Most major debts of the Trust sit under FALL, secured by charges on Adams Park, but Wycombe Wanderers Trust also has some debts to pay. ) given the amounts involved are material it would have been helpful to have some narrative about it in the accounts, in order to give the users of those accounts a better understanding.