Unless I'm missing something major, yep. Newcastle are owned by Saudi Arabia's sovereign wealth fund; ML made his money in fintech and Kaspi, as far as I can see, is a private company.
For me, I think if someone can look at the record of the Saudi state and believe it's no worse than ours any discussion is over and there is no point ruining a drink by walking up to them in a pub and demanding answers to questions.
Ok, head above the parapet time. Why should the UK "set an example" and aim to reduce our CO2 emissions faster than the rest of the developed world and thus wreck our economy? We're all going to hell in a handcart anyway (due to China, USA etc.), so why not enjoy the ride?
Even if you want to leave environmental concerns aside (which you shouldn't) there are significant economic reasons to switch to renewable, primarily that increased use of wind and solar power leaves the UK less vulnerable to the vagaries of imported oil and gas. The boycott of Russian imports shows how in hock to them so many counties are.
Britain led the industrial revolution, we should lead the post-industrial revolution. And our technological innovations (we're actually still really good at that kind of stuff) can then help other nations to make the switch.
I looked at this for my home and if I purely used the solar panels for our cars and one of them was plugged in 24hrs a day it would generate around 75000 miles per year at a conservative estimate, I was told 150000 miles but that’s with optimum conditions.
I have an average size four bed that faces south east.
The only issue would be on days the cars are going longer distances you wouldn’t have enough power to charge up all three for another longer distance day the following day.
The other issue was cost to install, you would never get your money back for 10-15 years.
I’m in a hobbyist forum with a load of middle aged IT fellas, most of whom have had panels installed. There’s a whole gamut from self installation to full solar and heat pump installations.
Most will get their money back in between 3 and 5 years. Those with batteries seem to get their return much more quickly by selling back to the grid when most economical.
Most of the electric cars we already have are charging for pennies overnight when there’s plenty of cleaner electricity to go round (currently at 10.30pm just 13.9% of demand is being met by fossil fuels). And of course, there’s currently zero solar.
No, I don't read that rag. But what percentage of people drive electric cars at the moment? Can the grid handle the volume of electricity that will be required? Charging points for people in flats? It costs £30 plus to fully charge a car at some third party points in Wycombe. No infrastructure plans at the minute. I think we need some considered thought on this, not Ed running amok! Oh, and that's not considering the electric required for heat pumps!
Yes, it may be falling at the minute, but with what's being proposed it's only going to rise. I'll wager right now that there will be blackouts within the next 5 years. Starmer has no control over his cabinet and Miliband is a zealot.
I'm with @Bluetoo if a government cannot answer every question, solve every problem and overhaul our national energy infrastructure in the first year we should start a petition to get them out and get Clarkson in...
I read an extremely good article recently about the exponential rise of solar and how that rate of growth is leading to the cost of solar reaching zero. Most of that exponential growth is happening in China, who in 2023 installed more solar panels than the United States has in their entire history. They’re miles ahead of the rest of the world in the switch to electric on the roads too, with huge subsidies on electric cars from CCP owned brands, massive investment in charging networks, brands adopting a swappable battery system that takes 30 seconds to switch your empty out for a full and the swap station network to support it.
I can’t comment on your friends estimates but it’s a few years since I did my calculations so I double checked them on Octopus Energy. They have a very good calculator for cost and time taken to get back your money.
Buying 12 panels, the average is 10 and adding in a 10kWh battery would cost £13305 to install. I estimate my usage at 9000 kWh per year. I have a PHEV and do high mileage hence the high energy useage.
Taking the estimated highest energy savings per month it would take 162 months to get my money back. That’s 11.5 years or 16.75 years at the lower end of savings.
i have been recently quoted £7830 for a 14 panel + 2 x 5kWh battery setup with a 6-7 year payback time which I thought was pretty reasonable. (That’s living up north for you).
What they did say is that currently solar isn’t that good for charging electric cars (for technical reasons I can’t remember) and it is far far cheaper to use the offers for overnight charging from the various electricity companies.
However I also don’t think you can now get deals where you sell your solar-generated power back to the grid. This was definitely a ‘thing’ and I know a couple of people who got in when they could and it did pay for itself very quickly.
That seems like a very decent quote, did it include installation which is generally around £1500-£2000 down south.
You can definitely see the benefits long term if you plan to stay in the house more than 10 years and have a spare £10000 sloshing around.
I was also told that the batteries would only last 15-20 years before having to be replaced and depending on the material and quality of the solar panels they would have to be replaced at 15-30 years. They should still work after these periods but would be so obsolete that it would be cheaper to replace if you planned to remain in the house for 10 years plus.
So many variables that you really have to know your own energy consumption for 10 years to know if it’s worth doing.
I won’t be here longer than six years which will take me to the age I can draw my private pension and both my kids have finished Uni, so it didn’t make any sense for me 3 years ago.
Comments
Where does the money come from that is funding our current success?
Not the government of an oppressive regime
Are you sure @flymofrank ?
Unless I'm missing something major, yep. Newcastle are owned by Saudi Arabia's sovereign wealth fund; ML made his money in fintech and Kaspi, as far as I can see, is a private company.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_Georgian_post-election_protests
For me, I think if someone can look at the record of the Saudi state and believe it's no worse than ours any discussion is over and there is no point ruining a drink by walking up to them in a pub and demanding answers to questions.
I’d give you at least a couple more thumbs up if I could 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼😊
Apologies for drifting off topic but I recommend this.
Ok, head above the parapet time. Why should the UK "set an example" and aim to reduce our CO2 emissions faster than the rest of the developed world and thus wreck our economy? We're all going to hell in a handcart anyway (due to China, USA etc.), so why not enjoy the ride?
Even if you want to leave environmental concerns aside (which you shouldn't) there are significant economic reasons to switch to renewable, primarily that increased use of wind and solar power leaves the UK less vulnerable to the vagaries of imported oil and gas. The boycott of Russian imports shows how in hock to them so many counties are.
Britain led the industrial revolution, we should lead the post-industrial revolution. And our technological innovations (we're actually still really good at that kind of stuff) can then help other nations to make the switch.
Just worried it will leave us vulnerable to the vagaries of the British weather instead (the recent grey windless days being a good example)....
Grey days are good for solar. You don’t want too much sun as the heat makes the process less efficient.
It would appear to produce only one third of the power of a sunny day. Is that enough to power all the electric cars we'll have - I doubt it.
I looked at this for my home and if I purely used the solar panels for our cars and one of them was plugged in 24hrs a day it would generate around 75000 miles per year at a conservative estimate, I was told 150000 miles but that’s with optimum conditions.
I have an average size four bed that faces south east.
The only issue would be on days the cars are going longer distances you wouldn’t have enough power to charge up all three for another longer distance day the following day.
The other issue was cost to install, you would never get your money back for 10-15 years.
I’m in a hobbyist forum with a load of middle aged IT fellas, most of whom have had panels installed. There’s a whole gamut from self installation to full solar and heat pump installations.
Most will get their money back in between 3 and 5 years. Those with batteries seem to get their return much more quickly by selling back to the grid when most economical.
Has someone had one too many Daily Mails?
Most of the electric cars we already have are charging for pennies overnight when there’s plenty of cleaner electricity to go round (currently at 10.30pm just 13.9% of demand is being met by fossil fuels). And of course, there’s currently zero solar.
That's interesting - where can one find that kind of real-time data?
This one has the National Grid demand and supply presented nicely (there are others) https://grid.iamkate.com/
Thanks 👌
https://grid.iamkate.com/
Damn I did not know we generated that much electricity from wind
No, I don't read that rag. But what percentage of people drive electric cars at the moment? Can the grid handle the volume of electricity that will be required? Charging points for people in flats? It costs £30 plus to fully charge a car at some third party points in Wycombe. No infrastructure plans at the minute. I think we need some considered thought on this, not Ed running amok! Oh, and that's not considering the electric required for heat pumps!
IWhat makes you think considered thought is not happening? Any politician presiding over blackouts isn’t going to last long.
Electricity demand is falling in the UK. 2023 was the lowest this century, probably thanks to the pesky EU forcing us to use asthmatic vacuum cleaners or something. https://www.statista.com/statistics/322874/electricity-consumption-from-all-electricity-suppliers-in-the-united-kingdom/
Yes, it may be falling at the minute, but with what's being proposed it's only going to rise. I'll wager right now that there will be blackouts within the next 5 years. Starmer has no control over his cabinet and Miliband is a zealot.
My Polestar costs about £2.30 to charge at home. It charges exclusively when the demand on the grid is low.
I'm with @Bluetoo if a government cannot answer every question, solve every problem and overhaul our national energy infrastructure in the first year we should start a petition to get them out and get Clarkson in...
I read an extremely good article recently about the exponential rise of solar and how that rate of growth is leading to the cost of solar reaching zero. Most of that exponential growth is happening in China, who in 2023 installed more solar panels than the United States has in their entire history. They’re miles ahead of the rest of the world in the switch to electric on the roads too, with huge subsidies on electric cars from CCP owned brands, massive investment in charging networks, brands adopting a swappable battery system that takes 30 seconds to switch your empty out for a full and the swap station network to support it.
I can’t comment on your friends estimates but it’s a few years since I did my calculations so I double checked them on Octopus Energy. They have a very good calculator for cost and time taken to get back your money.
Buying 12 panels, the average is 10 and adding in a 10kWh battery would cost £13305 to install. I estimate my usage at 9000 kWh per year. I have a PHEV and do high mileage hence the high energy useage.
Taking the estimated highest energy savings per month it would take 162 months to get my money back. That’s 11.5 years or 16.75 years at the lower end of savings.
i have been recently quoted £7830 for a 14 panel + 2 x 5kWh battery setup with a 6-7 year payback time which I thought was pretty reasonable. (That’s living up north for you).
What they did say is that currently solar isn’t that good for charging electric cars (for technical reasons I can’t remember) and it is far far cheaper to use the offers for overnight charging from the various electricity companies.
However I also don’t think you can now get deals where you sell your solar-generated power back to the grid. This was definitely a ‘thing’ and I know a couple of people who got in when they could and it did pay for itself very quickly.
That seems like a very decent quote, did it include installation which is generally around £1500-£2000 down south.
You can definitely see the benefits long term if you plan to stay in the house more than 10 years and have a spare £10000 sloshing around.
I was also told that the batteries would only last 15-20 years before having to be replaced and depending on the material and quality of the solar panels they would have to be replaced at 15-30 years. They should still work after these periods but would be so obsolete that it would be cheaper to replace if you planned to remain in the house for 10 years plus.
So many variables that you really have to know your own energy consumption for 10 years to know if it’s worth doing.
I won’t be here longer than six years which will take me to the age I can draw my private pension and both my kids have finished Uni, so it didn’t make any sense for me 3 years ago.