The thing is that these young men are rewarded with riches that you and I can only dream of. In return for that massive reward there has to be an understanding that they, at the very least, behave in a way as to not themselves or their clubs into disrepute. Football is not unique in requiring that. What is unique about footballers (no not all footballers of course) is they are told from an early age they are special, they are then surrounded by people that will never say no, they do not have to obey the same rules as society. There was probably a junction in Greenwood's life where someone should have said 'you are a pr1ck mate, wind it in' but that never happened, everyone kept laughing at his jokes, getting his drinks, cleaning his shoes, etc etc. And here we are today.
So do I have any sympathy with the height he could fall from? No, nope, not at all. The wage he took came with a price, and it wasn't all about on the pitch. He made a choice.
Sorry @drcongo i am confused now. I am trying to have a serious conversation and I genuinely thought that is what you were saying. I am a little confused now.Â
You're clearly not trying to have a serious conversation because nothing I have posted in this thread even vaguely resembles what you made up to claim I said. If it did, point it out and prove it.
could I ask you to clarify please
No. I may be an idiot, but I'm not stupid enough to fall for the classic DevC "here's some questions that I don't have answers for but I will demand everyone else to have answers".
As much as I recognise Dev as an absolute textbook troll for the way he stretches arguments, I'm not sure we've quite hit a place in life where a man stating he found a person of the other sex attractive is some kind of scandal is it?!
Many posters pounced on that to continue a pathetic grudge against him.
(Yes I know the irony of me posting that with the first sentence is...erm ironic 😀)
I know the gasroom is seemingly the most (what you would refer to as) "woke" place in the world, where seemingly hordes of middle aged white blokes who've never thought, said or written anything at all beyond reproach gather, but the reaction to that was utterly pathetic. It wouldn't have been anywhere near the same from another poster.
I was thinking about @micra' s appreciation of the young Wanderers ladies player who did some co-commentary at times (sorry, name escapes me), then remembered the bath "incident".
I have seen mention of 'the Dev incident' but I think the original was before my time on the Gasroom or during a hiatus or something, it struck me as a dodgy comment anyone of a certain age could make, but grew out of all proportion because there was a bit of defensive doubling down and 'not really seeing what the problem is' sort of thing that some posters insist on and gets others goats...usually on threads like this.
No he wasn't found not guilty in a criminal court. The matter didn't get to court because the Crown Office concluded that there was insufficient evidence to secure a conviction to the criminal standard of proof.
Frankly irrespective of the CPS decision he is not the sort of individual any of us should want associated with football, especially in this day & age when we are trying to encourage greater female involvement in the game (both men's & women's) whether as players or spectators or both.
Greenwood is sadly not untypical of well remunerated young men who have been denied little in their lives & through circumstance have been made to feel special/better than others; over my career I saw many like him in the City.
We all need to start calling out the so called lad culture & banter that is an excuse for misogyny, sexism, domestic abuse, homophobia, racism etc. it has no part in the modern game or for that matter modern society.
Their statement claims they see the whole picture and can see his side.
So the girl was lying? She made up the audio? The pictures were faked? He is a victim of false accusations and his good name has been wrongly dragged through the mud?
We should all get behind him as this is a terrible case of injustice. As he is so innocent as he and United claim he should be playing Saturday and we should cheer his bravery.
"While I am satisfied that Mason did not commit the acts he was charged with, Mason’s accepted that he has made mistakes which he takes responsibility for. I am also mindful of the challenge that Mason would face rebuilding his career and raising a baby together with his partner in the harsh spotlight of Manchester United. Further, this case has provoked strong opinions, and it is my responsibility to minimise any distraction to the unity we are seeking within the club.
Although we have decided that Mason will seek to rebuild his career away from Manchester United, that does not signal the end of this matter. The club will continue to offer its support both to the alleged victim and Mason to help them rebuild and move forward positively with their lives."
It is a all a terrible indictment of how domestic abuse is normalised even in these enlightened times. Parties busting a gut to come up with mitigation as to why the abuser is really an ok kinda person. There are no grey areas in domestic abuse. There is an abuser and a victim. There is no mitigation.
Comments
You only lasted 25 minutes as "woke"! 😉
That’s the one.
The thing is that these young men are rewarded with riches that you and I can only dream of. In return for that massive reward there has to be an understanding that they, at the very least, behave in a way as to not themselves or their clubs into disrepute. Football is not unique in requiring that. What is unique about footballers (no not all footballers of course) is they are told from an early age they are special, they are then surrounded by people that will never say no, they do not have to obey the same rules as society. There was probably a junction in Greenwood's life where someone should have said 'you are a pr1ck mate, wind it in' but that never happened, everyone kept laughing at his jokes, getting his drinks, cleaning his shoes, etc etc. And here we are today.
So do I have any sympathy with the height he could fall from? No, nope, not at all. The wage he took came with a price, and it wasn't all about on the pitch. He made a choice.
Sorry @drcongo i am confused now. I am trying to have a serious conversation and I genuinely thought that is what you were saying. I am a little confused now.Â
You're clearly not trying to have a serious conversation because nothing I have posted in this thread even vaguely resembles what you made up to claim I said. If it did, point it out and prove it.
could I ask you to clarify please
No. I may be an idiot, but I'm not stupid enough to fall for the classic DevC "here's some questions that I don't have answers for but I will demand everyone else to have answers".
Not as famous as "the tin bath affair" though!
Calumny! I was alone in that bath.
As much as I recognise Dev as an absolute textbook troll for the way he stretches arguments, I'm not sure we've quite hit a place in life where a man stating he found a person of the other sex attractive is some kind of scandal is it?!
Many posters pounced on that to continue a pathetic grudge against him.
(Yes I know the irony of me posting that with the first sentence is...erm ironic 😀)
Agreed totally.
I know the gasroom is seemingly the most (what you would refer to as) "woke" place in the world, where seemingly hordes of middle aged white blokes who've never thought, said or written anything at all beyond reproach gather, but the reaction to that was utterly pathetic. It wouldn't have been anywhere near the same from another poster.
It's what happened after you got out of the bath that is the mystery!
And mystery it will remain. It was 67 years ago and, as far as I can recall, I was an innocent abroad. Back home, not so sure.
I was thinking about @micra' s appreciation of the young Wanderers ladies player who did some co-commentary at times (sorry, name escapes me), then remembered the bath "incident".
I don't think the two were connected though.
We should get some TINBATHGATE t-shirts done up
Alicia Povey?
I have seen mention of 'the Dev incident' but I think the original was before my time on the Gasroom or during a hiatus or something, it struck me as a dodgy comment anyone of a certain age could make, but grew out of all proportion because there was a bit of defensive doubling down and 'not really seeing what the problem is' sort of thing that some posters insist on and gets others goats...usually on threads like this.
Even reading that name now it doesn't seem familiar. But maybe!
She was very good on co-comms I seem to recall.
I think she went to work for Southampton women's team
Given they didn’t have one until fairly recently, I’d say not a huge amount.
That’s the girl. Honey toned and insightful. A winning combination.
No he wasn't found not guilty in a criminal court. The matter didn't get to court because the Crown Office concluded that there was insufficient evidence to secure a conviction to the criminal standard of proof.
Frankly irrespective of the CPS decision he is not the sort of individual any of us should want associated with football, especially in this day & age when we are trying to encourage greater female involvement in the game (both men's & women's) whether as players or spectators or both.
Greenwood is sadly not untypical of well remunerated young men who have been denied little in their lives & through circumstance have been made to feel special/better than others; over my career I saw many like him in the City.
We all need to start calling out the so called lad culture & banter that is an excuse for misogyny, sexism, domestic abuse, homophobia, racism etc. it has no part in the modern game or for that matter modern society.
He's leaving
Left the building
Mason Greenwood: Manchester United striker will leave club after internal investigation - BBC Sport
Not sure he has left at all, United obviously trying to secure a deal with another club. Fee/sell on fee etc. Maybe even a loan.
They could have just released him.
Its a word soup of a statement from all parties.
His statement claims his innocence
Their statement claims they see the whole picture and can see his side.
So the girl was lying? She made up the audio? The pictures were faked? He is a victim of false accusations and his good name has been wrongly dragged through the mud?
We should all get behind him as this is a terrible case of injustice. As he is so innocent as he and United claim he should be playing Saturday and we should cheer his bravery.
His statement doesn't mention the victim once.
Why does this read like 'We really wanted to keep him, but the woke mob forced our hand'? https://www.manutd.com/en/news/detail/richard-arnold-open-letter-to-man-utd-supporters-after-club-decision-on-mason-greenwood
"While I am satisfied that Mason did not commit the acts he was charged with, Mason’s accepted that he has made mistakes which he takes responsibility for. I am also mindful of the challenge that Mason would face rebuilding his career and raising a baby together with his partner in the harsh spotlight of Manchester United. Further, this case has provoked strong opinions, and it is my responsibility to minimise any distraction to the unity we are seeking within the club.
Although we have decided that Mason will seek to rebuild his career away from Manchester United, that does not signal the end of this matter. The club will continue to offer its support both to the alleged victim and Mason to help them rebuild and move forward positively with their lives."
So Dev was right all along!
It is a all a terrible indictment of how domestic abuse is normalised even in these enlightened times. Parties busting a gut to come up with mitigation as to why the abuser is really an ok kinda person. There are no grey areas in domestic abuse. There is an abuser and a victim. There is no mitigation.
Very odd statement saying they're "satisfied" he didn't do the crimes he's charged with.
Would love to know how that opinion has been formed.