@glasshalffull said:
So can anyone explain why we have lost between 1,000-1,500 fans over the last two decades despite an improvement in playing standards, facilities etc? I am genuinely intrigued to know why we can’t attract bigger crowds.
Sky and the Premier League
Do you think many Wycombe fans have ‘defected’ to PL clubs? Don’t forget that Sky can’t show live games at 3pm on Saturdays.
No but i think over the timesacle you are talking about this has affected every lower league club. I cant see there ever being the excitement experienced during the o'neill years when i was teen. I talk to some younger than me and they just dont entertain the idea of following us (just some). There are plenty to attract, just think football society has shifted since those days
@glasshalffull said:
So can anyone explain why we have lost between 1,000-1,500 fans over the last two decades despite an improvement in playing standards, facilities etc? I am genuinely intrigued to know why we can’t attract bigger crowds.
Sky and the Premier League
Do you think many Wycombe fans have ‘defected’ to PL clubs? Don’t forget that Sky can’t show live games at 3pm on Saturdays.
I think they have over the past 25/30 years definitely. Arsenal, Chelsea and Spurs all have much larger average crowds than the early nineties and those fans come from places like Wycombe.
@peterparrotface aye but I dont think those have 'defected' myself, it's mostly kids growing up over last 25 yrs being indoctrinated by the Prem culture isnt it. Surely hardly anyone used to be a wyc supportr then thought 'nah im supporting Chelsea now'
I started coming with my daughter and we had a ST for three seasons then circumstances dictated that I needed the money elsewhere...I was then as now in a good job...but it still took me a few years to be able to justify the cost. It's hard to see how someone on a lower level of income is going to be able to go themselves...never mind being along the next generation. I think that is possibly why there is an aging demographic for many league clubs...as younger people perhaps want to see 'stars' if they are going to outlay their cash and local allegiance is less important.
I agree with the comments about trying to attract more youngsters to our games. I played football (walking variety) at Maidenhead United’s ground today and there was a kids session just before us. As they trooped out I counted 5 wearing Liverpool shirts, 3 Chelsea, 2 Manchester United and one England. Therein lies the problem.
The success of the PL has captured the imagination of young fans rather than the lure of supporting their local team. However, there’s no reason why we can’t persuade them to make Wycombe their second team.
@Alexo said:
Well if the WiFi is so good now, why can't the club invest in a load of handheld pdq machines and continue such raffles?? Or am I missing the point?
They want to go paperless - but surely a paperless raffle is completely doable.
I thought cashless was the driving force. I've been hearing about going paperless in work for 25 years
Aghh, I really didn’t want to post about catering but I literally came across an example today that links to this thread so here goes, although my post is not all about food!!
Took my child to a summer club thing this afternoon, met up with my friend and his son. We last saw them in the village at the Leicester game, when we arrived 25 mins before KO and saw 2x people serving 2x long queues, we immediately binned off the idea of a pint each and a coke for the kids and went into the ground and we were sitting in different areas so not seen till today. “Did you go at the weekend” I asked - he laughed and went “sod that, can’t get a pint before the game and got bent over for a tenner for a burger and a bottle of fizz, felt mugged off to be honest”. I know they would have walked to the ground from roughly west wycombe road so it’s not like they were effected by parking or anything.
So as stated by some above, it’s people like this you want to attract and they need the best experience to be converted into regulars.
The high food prices are a blessing to me, because we all have a personal threshold, and it’s above what I’m prepared to pay and I’ve made it clear to my child. He’s in the 10-11 age bracket and understands, so he’s happy with bringing something from home or some sweets to the game to keep him going (which I know from experience is just not so easy at all when the kids are younger and more demanding). This has resulted in my matchday costing me literally no more than my ticket and his in the family stand, so about £25 I think, which I think is great value to see the quality of player in our side this season.
I’d buy the beer at £4.50 but I’m a quick drinker so would knock back a couple of quick pints before the game if I could, but I expect quick service based on the ‘great fan experience’ line. I won’t stand in a queue for a long time when there are not enough servers because that is cr@p overall service, but I would consider if the queue was long but I felt it was fast moving because there was more people serving (hope that makes sense?? I know what I mean!!).
Regarding the attendance in other aspects, I know a lot of people still on furlough or have been made redundant / half expecting it, or doing extra jobs at the minute because things are so tight.
For a hell of a lot of people out there, times really are tough and worrying and it’s also worth remembering we live in a bloody expensive area compared to a lot of other places in terms of cost of living, and not everyone down here is on great money to be able to afford this. Disposable income is arguably lower for many households down here than in other so called ‘cheaper’ areas of the country.
I’m sure the attendances will also rise if the football is good and the team continue to be exciting in the final third and winning of course, but I never expected it to be overnight and I’m sure it won’t, and unfortunately bagging Accrington Stanley at home for the first match after being relegated is not everyone’s attention grabber to be fair.
Yeah there are in fact many fans who have 'defected' to Wyc from prem clubs as they have moved to the area and found a greater 'involved' experience. This is excellent but obviously they are older supporters, and hopefully many of them have kids who will be brought up Wycombe. There is obvs a growing culture of people rejecting pl due to cost and lack of involvement. I think we are ideally placed to capture this but need to make it easy.
At the Leicester game a significant number of those around me in the FA (Q) were saying that they were on holiday the following week and would miss the Accy game. A couple were also complaining of the traffic/parking issues and said they may not bother. On Saturday I certainly felt as if I was Johnny no Mates in a clear zone of empty seats. TBF I think it's down to holidays/other (kids) sport commitments/Covid hangover etc. I'm sure we'll see an increase soon and certainly when we're in the top 3! The Couhig's will sort the present difficulties I'm sure and all will come together.
I can't agree more with the need to get the young ones into a match to experience it for themselves. I have a 17 year old nephew Who is an avid arsenal fan. For years he mocked me for being a Wycombe fan. I kept telling him, don't knock it until you have tried it! I think he has only ever seen arsenal live once or twice.... A couple of seasons ago he started going to the odd Wycombe match at Adams park with a couple of mated that went down sometimes. Now he 8s obsessed and hooked for life! He has his 18th birthday in a few weeks and a few of us family members chipped in to get him his 1st season ticket and replica shirt which he obviously received early. He was absolutely made up. He said it's the best birthday gift he has ever had. arsenal who???
What does intrigue me is why this particularly seems to affect Wycombe (low August crowds)? I know there's loads of local cricketers who can't attend games due to club commitments. Perhaps this isn't such an issue for some clubs (City teams?) where club/village cricket isn't so prevalent? Hard to put a finger on it really. Holidays are an excuse of course, but that would be the same anywhere.
I've often thought about this too. My theory is this, that I think we have a very passionate hard core, probably 3000 or so, for whom WWFC is the centre of their world, and will always take precedence over anything else on a matchday. Over and above that, I think we have a relatively large section of the fanbase (say another 2000) who are just as likely to play/watch cricket during August/September, who won't be too bothered if they take their family summer holiday in August rather than late July (if they have the choice), or who are just as likely to have a non-football family day out on a Saturday in August, as they are to go and watch WWFC. From October to April, however, they will more often than not be at Adams Park. These people are WWFC supporters, but WWFC isn't the centre of their world. I often hear people around me, up in the Frank Adams, talking about the Test Match, the Olympics, whatever golf tournament is on, or Arsenal/Spurs/Chelsea, in fact anything but the match they are there to watch.
It's probably also something to do with us being more of a 'family' club - we certainly seem to have a slightly different demographic to some other clubs that we play, who probably have a larger proportion of working-class male supporters than we do. They'll be less likely to play/watch cricket in August, and more likely to be at the football from day one of the season.
That's my theory anyway, can't say whether it's right or not, but there you go.
I think many fans support a premiership club but you don't feel that connection that you do with the smaller teams like Wycombe. I have gone to watch premiership in the past but Wycombe always comes 1st.
In answer to @glasshalffull , my own view is that it's not about people defecting to particular Premier League teams. It's much more about a divergence in what people understand football to be about.
For us supporters of lower league teams - even Championship teams - it's about goalmouth action, lots of incident and local or inherited loyalties.
For the PL viewer (I stopped myself typing "fan"), it's much more of an aesthetic experience. They are simply not tolerant of the sort of mistakes and misplaced passes that for us actually add to the excitement.
I suspect that the actual PL fans, the ones who go to their teams' matches, are not that different in this respect from us. The reaction to the Superleague suggested this - perhaps the most characteristic response was "We want our cold Tuesday nights away at Stoke". But the folks we're competing for, the ones you see around town in their Arsenal or Manchester United shirts, are looking for an altogether different footballing experience. And it's not on offer at Adams Park.
@OakwoodExile said:
In answer to @glasshalffull , my own view is that it's not about people defecting to particular Premier League teams. It's much more about a divergence in what people understand football to be about.
For us supporters of lower league teams - even Championship teams - it's about goalmouth action, lots of incident and local or inherited loyalties.
For the PL viewer (I stopped myself typing "fan"), it's much more of an aesthetic experience. They are simply not tolerant of the sort of mistakes and misplaced passes that for us actually add to the excitement.
I suspect that the actual PL fans, the ones who go to their teams' matches, are not that different in this respect from us. The reaction to the Superleague suggested this - perhaps the most characteristic response was "We want our cold Tuesday nights away at Stoke". But the folks we're competing for, the ones you see around town in their Arsenal or Manchester United shirts, are looking for an altogether different footballing experience. And it's not on offer at Adams Park.
I reckon that Newbury Wanderer has nailed it. Growing up in Liverpool where football was the number one obsession, it has long frustrated me that a club as appealing as Wycombe doesn’t get bigger crowds. It’s clearly not such a major priority in leafy Bucks, but we can still improve attendances with more effort and emphasis on younger fans.
Surely Southport, Runcorn or Witton would be fairer examples?
Don't forget that crowds have risen massively while we've been watching us (you longer than me). But when I was at primary school in the 1980s I was the only Wycombe supporter in the whole school. Loads of Watford, QPR, Spurs fans who actually went to games, plus loads who supported Liverpool because they were the best team
I reckon primary schools have loads of Wycombe fans in their ranks these days. We have made progress, and I think if we establish ourselves as a Championship side we could get bigger crowds still.
But one thing remains as true today as it always has done, and that's that you don't get more people to come to games by having a go at them for not coming to games
You are right, but there is a fundamental difference between expressing disappointment at the attendance on Saturday and ‘having a go’ at people for not attending. I am genuinely interested to know why our crowds aren’t bigger so I’m not going to criticise the very people we are trying to attract.
The crowds will come. We never get good crowds in August. If we have a good season then I suspect we will be pushing a few sell outs when the likes of Sunderland and Sheff Wed come to town.
I'm interested to know, @glasshalffull, how other clubs similar to ourselves have found their average attendances have changed over the last 20 years?
It maybe that we're 1000 or 100 down compared to the early 2000s - I really don't know - but surely what we need to know is how the attendance at football matches in general has changed during this period - again I don't know the answer.
If average attendances are down ~20% over the 20 years, then we are still on par with others even though our average is down from ~6000 to ~5000.
@fame_46 talks of the possibility of frustration and violence if many hundreds of fans from one of the bigger clubs (eg Sunderland and Portsmouth) have difficulty in getting drinks in an unsegregated area of the car park. I didn’t notice it on Saturday but, two seasons ago, there was a separate tent and area to congregate for away fans just inside the main gates. Perhaps it was there and the numbers were minuscule for a club with barely 200 away fans.
One of my concerns is that it must be very difficult to attract and train enough youngsters to staff so many food and drink outlets. No doubt a significant factor when it comes to slow service and long queues.
And because of the eighteen month gap, I imagine few of these youngsters had any previous experience. Provided they’ve not been put off already, they will no doubt quickly adapt and become more efficient.
@micra said: @fame_46 talks of the possibility of frustration and violence if many hundreds of fans from one of the bigger clubs (eg Sunderland and Portsmouth) have difficulty in getting drinks in an unsegregated area of the car park. I didn’t notice it on Saturday but, two seasons ago, there was a separate tent and area to congregate for away fans just inside the main gates. Perhaps it was there and the numbers were minuscule for a club with barely 200 away fans.
One of my concerns is that it must be very difficult to attract and train enough youngsters to staff so many food and drink outlets. No doubt a significant factor when it comes to slow service and long queues.
And because of the eighteen month gap, I imagine few of these youngsters had any previous experience. Provided they’ve not been put off already, they will no doubt quickly adapt and become more efficient.
The ones serving and pouring in the marquee were veryquick..there just wasn't enough of them.Will be chaos if there isn't more servers for lincoln match.
My take on the relatively low attendance (I thought the terrace was packed too but a fair few regulars missing from around me in the FA):
To get significant and sustainable growth in fans it needs to come from a ‘buzz’ around the town, which comes when the team are playing well, winning and challenging at the top of the league (occasionally the odd cup run) as people are talking about us at work, in school and in the pubs.
That leads to some people feel like they are missing out who then come along, enjoy the (winning) experience and then become regulars during the ‘good’ times.
As those times fade you will gradually get natural wastage as those regulars move away, have kids (and less time and money!!) or sadly pass away and it’s difficult to replace those without re-creating that buzz around town.
I’m not local any more so not really qualified to judge but it seems that during the Ainsworth years we’ve not yet managed to do that in the town.
Two seasons ago when we were at the top of the league was probably when we should have done and I do seem to remember that crowds were slowly increasing but not in the numbers our position deserved.
I wonder whether that was related to the ‘little’ Wycombe narrative at the time. It always felt that we were seen as over-achieving and everyone was expecting our bubble to burst.
If that season had played out however and we had been challenging up the top I do think there would have been a quite large increase in our support. A lot who would still be coming now if we had achieved promotion.
This season however has the potential to be different if the squad performs as many people expect it to. If we are in the top 6 at Christmas, then I think attendances will rise significantly for the second half of the season as people will think we do have a chance of promotion.
(But most importantly if they get the real ale bar back that guarantees at least two extra people most games….)
@HolmerBlue said:
I'd agree with @Aylesburyblue the bar staff on Saturday were fine, quick and pleasant, there just wasn't enough of them
Literally took 2 mins to be served as pints were continually being poured..one swipe of card and we was done..certainly being cashless makes the transaction so much quicker.
A lot of it comes down to price, simply it is now a very expensive day out. I appreciate we are only one game into the new season but I do wonder how easy it is going to be this season to persuade casual fans.
Before the pandemic I used to regularly get a lot of friends to come to matches plus their sons/daughters in the Frank Adams. Over the season I would "target" around 10 friends to come to matches and over the season they'd buy around 50-60 tickets, half adults and half kids.
I'm just not certain they will come anymore, due to the price increases across the board. There are of course ways around it but the "casual" fans who come 5 games a season normally want to park, eat and drink at the ground.
I don't remember the exact figures but it was probably £21 adult (£2 discount in advance) and U12 was free in 2018/19.
Food was £5 in the Vere for pie & chips, choccy bar & tea around £2.50. All in all Dad & Son (or Mum & Daughter etc) could come to the game for approximately £50.
Now adults is £28 and £17 (12-18) or if U12 it's £12. So £40-£45 just for tickets.
That's pretty much what they paid 3 years ago for the whole day. Add £8 each for food with no chips. Beer is not huge increase but you're effectively looking at a £75-80 day.
I agree prices were low in the past and needed adjusting but can we really expect the casual fan and his/her child to pay out £80 for a visit to Adams Park to sit with current season ticket holders in the Frank Adams?
Does that feel like value for money?
They also used to love the player interviews in the Vere after the game, the kids met the MOM, had their photo with him and then ran back to ask to come again to the next match. I really hope we don't stop this, as I think it really put bums on seats for essentially little outlay, if anything at all.
You can reduce prices from £28 to £21 but unless that causes gates to increase by a third, that causes a loss of income to already challenging finances.
Do that and you either have to drop player wages (likely causing a reduction in status and further income drop) or find a sugar daddy prepared to each year fund the gap.
If you find a solution, patent it. There are loads of clubs in Lg1,2 and conference who will be eager to find out how.
Comments
No but i think over the timesacle you are talking about this has affected every lower league club. I cant see there ever being the excitement experienced during the o'neill years when i was teen. I talk to some younger than me and they just dont entertain the idea of following us (just some). There are plenty to attract, just think football society has shifted since those days
I think they have over the past 25/30 years definitely. Arsenal, Chelsea and Spurs all have much larger average crowds than the early nineties and those fans come from places like Wycombe.
@peterparrotface aye but I dont think those have 'defected' myself, it's mostly kids growing up over last 25 yrs being indoctrinated by the Prem culture isnt it. Surely hardly anyone used to be a wyc supportr then thought 'nah im supporting Chelsea now'
I know you support around 23 clubs
I started coming with my daughter and we had a ST for three seasons then circumstances dictated that I needed the money elsewhere...I was then as now in a good job...but it still took me a few years to be able to justify the cost. It's hard to see how someone on a lower level of income is going to be able to go themselves...never mind being along the next generation. I think that is possibly why there is an aging demographic for many league clubs...as younger people perhaps want to see 'stars' if they are going to outlay their cash and local allegiance is less important.
I agree with the comments about trying to attract more youngsters to our games. I played football (walking variety) at Maidenhead United’s ground today and there was a kids session just before us. As they trooped out I counted 5 wearing Liverpool shirts, 3 Chelsea, 2 Manchester United and one England. Therein lies the problem.
The success of the PL has captured the imagination of young fans rather than the lure of supporting their local team. However, there’s no reason why we can’t persuade them to make Wycombe their second team.
I thought cashless was the driving force. I've been hearing about going paperless in work for 25 years
Aghh, I really didn’t want to post about catering but I literally came across an example today that links to this thread so here goes, although my post is not all about food!!
Took my child to a summer club thing this afternoon, met up with my friend and his son. We last saw them in the village at the Leicester game, when we arrived 25 mins before KO and saw 2x people serving 2x long queues, we immediately binned off the idea of a pint each and a coke for the kids and went into the ground and we were sitting in different areas so not seen till today. “Did you go at the weekend” I asked - he laughed and went “sod that, can’t get a pint before the game and got bent over for a tenner for a burger and a bottle of fizz, felt mugged off to be honest”. I know they would have walked to the ground from roughly west wycombe road so it’s not like they were effected by parking or anything.
So as stated by some above, it’s people like this you want to attract and they need the best experience to be converted into regulars.
The high food prices are a blessing to me, because we all have a personal threshold, and it’s above what I’m prepared to pay and I’ve made it clear to my child. He’s in the 10-11 age bracket and understands, so he’s happy with bringing something from home or some sweets to the game to keep him going (which I know from experience is just not so easy at all when the kids are younger and more demanding). This has resulted in my matchday costing me literally no more than my ticket and his in the family stand, so about £25 I think, which I think is great value to see the quality of player in our side this season.
I’d buy the beer at £4.50 but I’m a quick drinker so would knock back a couple of quick pints before the game if I could, but I expect quick service based on the ‘great fan experience’ line. I won’t stand in a queue for a long time when there are not enough servers because that is cr@p overall service, but I would consider if the queue was long but I felt it was fast moving because there was more people serving (hope that makes sense?? I know what I mean!!).
Regarding the attendance in other aspects, I know a lot of people still on furlough or have been made redundant / half expecting it, or doing extra jobs at the minute because things are so tight.
For a hell of a lot of people out there, times really are tough and worrying and it’s also worth remembering we live in a bloody expensive area compared to a lot of other places in terms of cost of living, and not everyone down here is on great money to be able to afford this. Disposable income is arguably lower for many households down here than in other so called ‘cheaper’ areas of the country.
I’m sure the attendances will also rise if the football is good and the team continue to be exciting in the final third and winning of course, but I never expected it to be overnight and I’m sure it won’t, and unfortunately bagging Accrington Stanley at home for the first match after being relegated is not everyone’s attention grabber to be fair.
Yeah there are in fact many fans who have 'defected' to Wyc from prem clubs as they have moved to the area and found a greater 'involved' experience. This is excellent but obviously they are older supporters, and hopefully many of them have kids who will be brought up Wycombe. There is obvs a growing culture of people rejecting pl due to cost and lack of involvement. I think we are ideally placed to capture this but need to make it easy.
At the Leicester game a significant number of those around me in the FA (Q) were saying that they were on holiday the following week and would miss the Accy game. A couple were also complaining of the traffic/parking issues and said they may not bother. On Saturday I certainly felt as if I was Johnny no Mates in a clear zone of empty seats. TBF I think it's down to holidays/other (kids) sport commitments/Covid hangover etc. I'm sure we'll see an increase soon and certainly when we're in the top 3! The Couhig's will sort the present difficulties I'm sure and all will come together.
I can't agree more with the need to get the young ones into a match to experience it for themselves. I have a 17 year old nephew Who is an avid arsenal fan. For years he mocked me for being a Wycombe fan. I kept telling him, don't knock it until you have tried it! I think he has only ever seen arsenal live once or twice.... A couple of seasons ago he started going to the odd Wycombe match at Adams park with a couple of mated that went down sometimes. Now he 8s obsessed and hooked for life! He has his 18th birthday in a few weeks and a few of us family members chipped in to get him his 1st season ticket and replica shirt which he obviously received early. He was absolutely made up. He said it's the best birthday gift he has ever had. arsenal who???
I've often thought about this too. My theory is this, that I think we have a very passionate hard core, probably 3000 or so, for whom WWFC is the centre of their world, and will always take precedence over anything else on a matchday. Over and above that, I think we have a relatively large section of the fanbase (say another 2000) who are just as likely to play/watch cricket during August/September, who won't be too bothered if they take their family summer holiday in August rather than late July (if they have the choice), or who are just as likely to have a non-football family day out on a Saturday in August, as they are to go and watch WWFC. From October to April, however, they will more often than not be at Adams Park. These people are WWFC supporters, but WWFC isn't the centre of their world. I often hear people around me, up in the Frank Adams, talking about the Test Match, the Olympics, whatever golf tournament is on, or Arsenal/Spurs/Chelsea, in fact anything but the match they are there to watch.
It's probably also something to do with us being more of a 'family' club - we certainly seem to have a slightly different demographic to some other clubs that we play, who probably have a larger proportion of working-class male supporters than we do. They'll be less likely to play/watch cricket in August, and more likely to be at the football from day one of the season.
That's my theory anyway, can't say whether it's right or not, but there you go.
I think many fans support a premiership club but you don't feel that connection that you do with the smaller teams like Wycombe. I have gone to watch premiership in the past but Wycombe always comes 1st.
In answer to @glasshalffull , my own view is that it's not about people defecting to particular Premier League teams. It's much more about a divergence in what people understand football to be about.
For us supporters of lower league teams - even Championship teams - it's about goalmouth action, lots of incident and local or inherited loyalties.
For the PL viewer (I stopped myself typing "fan"), it's much more of an aesthetic experience. They are simply not tolerant of the sort of mistakes and misplaced passes that for us actually add to the excitement.
I suspect that the actual PL fans, the ones who go to their teams' matches, are not that different in this respect from us. The reaction to the Superleague suggested this - perhaps the most characteristic response was "We want our cold Tuesday nights away at Stoke". But the folks we're competing for, the ones you see around town in their Arsenal or Manchester United shirts, are looking for an altogether different footballing experience. And it's not on offer at Adams Park.
Yeah, agree with all of this.
I reckon that Newbury Wanderer has nailed it. Growing up in Liverpool where football was the number one obsession, it has long frustrated me that a club as appealing as Wycombe doesn’t get bigger crowds. It’s clearly not such a major priority in leafy Bucks, but we can still improve attendances with more effort and emphasis on younger fans.
Surely Southport, Runcorn or Witton would be fairer examples?
Don't forget that crowds have risen massively while we've been watching us (you longer than me). But when I was at primary school in the 1980s I was the only Wycombe supporter in the whole school. Loads of Watford, QPR, Spurs fans who actually went to games, plus loads who supported Liverpool because they were the best team
I reckon primary schools have loads of Wycombe fans in their ranks these days. We have made progress, and I think if we establish ourselves as a Championship side we could get bigger crowds still.
But one thing remains as true today as it always has done, and that's that you don't get more people to come to games by having a go at them for not coming to games
You are right, but there is a fundamental difference between expressing disappointment at the attendance on Saturday and ‘having a go’ at people for not attending. I am genuinely interested to know why our crowds aren’t bigger so I’m not going to criticise the very people we are trying to attract.
The crowds will come. We never get good crowds in August. If we have a good season then I suspect we will be pushing a few sell outs when the likes of Sunderland and Sheff Wed come to town.
I'm interested to know, @glasshalffull, how other clubs similar to ourselves have found their average attendances have changed over the last 20 years?
It maybe that we're 1000 or 100 down compared to the early 2000s - I really don't know - but surely what we need to know is how the attendance at football matches in general has changed during this period - again I don't know the answer.
If average attendances are down ~20% over the 20 years, then we are still on par with others even though our average is down from ~6000 to ~5000.
@fame_46 talks of the possibility of frustration and violence if many hundreds of fans from one of the bigger clubs (eg Sunderland and Portsmouth) have difficulty in getting drinks in an unsegregated area of the car park. I didn’t notice it on Saturday but, two seasons ago, there was a separate tent and area to congregate for away fans just inside the main gates. Perhaps it was there and the numbers were minuscule for a club with barely 200 away fans.
One of my concerns is that it must be very difficult to attract and train enough youngsters to staff so many food and drink outlets. No doubt a significant factor when it comes to slow service and long queues.
And because of the eighteen month gap, I imagine few of these youngsters had any previous experience. Provided they’ve not been put off already, they will no doubt quickly adapt and become more efficient.
The ones serving and pouring in the marquee were veryquick..there just wasn't enough of them.Will be chaos if there isn't more servers for lincoln match.
My take on the relatively low attendance (I thought the terrace was packed too but a fair few regulars missing from around me in the FA):
To get significant and sustainable growth in fans it needs to come from a ‘buzz’ around the town, which comes when the team are playing well, winning and challenging at the top of the league (occasionally the odd cup run) as people are talking about us at work, in school and in the pubs.
That leads to some people feel like they are missing out who then come along, enjoy the (winning) experience and then become regulars during the ‘good’ times.
As those times fade you will gradually get natural wastage as those regulars move away, have kids (and less time and money!!) or sadly pass away and it’s difficult to replace those without re-creating that buzz around town.
I’m not local any more so not really qualified to judge but it seems that during the Ainsworth years we’ve not yet managed to do that in the town.
Two seasons ago when we were at the top of the league was probably when we should have done and I do seem to remember that crowds were slowly increasing but not in the numbers our position deserved.
I wonder whether that was related to the ‘little’ Wycombe narrative at the time. It always felt that we were seen as over-achieving and everyone was expecting our bubble to burst.
If that season had played out however and we had been challenging up the top I do think there would have been a quite large increase in our support. A lot who would still be coming now if we had achieved promotion.
This season however has the potential to be different if the squad performs as many people expect it to. If we are in the top 6 at Christmas, then I think attendances will rise significantly for the second half of the season as people will think we do have a chance of promotion.
(But most importantly if they get the real ale bar back that guarantees at least two extra people most games….)
I'd agree with @Aylesburyblue the bar staff on Saturday were fine, quick and pleasant, there just wasn't enough of them
Literally took 2 mins to be served as pints were continually being poured..one swipe of card and we was done..certainly being cashless makes the transaction so much quicker.
Yup, agree on the bar staff. The bar should have been 3 times as long with 3 times as many servers, but the ones working did their best.
A lot of it comes down to price, simply it is now a very expensive day out. I appreciate we are only one game into the new season but I do wonder how easy it is going to be this season to persuade casual fans.
Before the pandemic I used to regularly get a lot of friends to come to matches plus their sons/daughters in the Frank Adams. Over the season I would "target" around 10 friends to come to matches and over the season they'd buy around 50-60 tickets, half adults and half kids.
I'm just not certain they will come anymore, due to the price increases across the board. There are of course ways around it but the "casual" fans who come 5 games a season normally want to park, eat and drink at the ground.
I don't remember the exact figures but it was probably £21 adult (£2 discount in advance) and U12 was free in 2018/19.
Food was £5 in the Vere for pie & chips, choccy bar & tea around £2.50. All in all Dad & Son (or Mum & Daughter etc) could come to the game for approximately £50.
Now adults is £28 and £17 (12-18) or if U12 it's £12. So £40-£45 just for tickets.
That's pretty much what they paid 3 years ago for the whole day. Add £8 each for food with no chips. Beer is not huge increase but you're effectively looking at a £75-80 day.
I agree prices were low in the past and needed adjusting but can we really expect the casual fan and his/her child to pay out £80 for a visit to Adams Park to sit with current season ticket holders in the Frank Adams?
Does that feel like value for money?
They also used to love the player interviews in the Vere after the game, the kids met the MOM, had their photo with him and then ran back to ask to come again to the next match. I really hope we don't stop this, as I think it really put bums on seats for essentially little outlay, if anything at all.
A floating voter type who came in with me on Saturday was shocked to pay £28.
Pretty high for tier 3 you'd imagine.
We certainly need to go up this season to nestle back in mid to lower pricing in the division again!
Its the perennial problem I'm afraid.
You can reduce prices from £28 to £21 but unless that causes gates to increase by a third, that causes a loss of income to already challenging finances.
Do that and you either have to drop player wages (likely causing a reduction in status and further income drop) or find a sugar daddy prepared to each year fund the gap.
If you find a solution, patent it. There are loads of clubs in Lg1,2 and conference who will be eager to find out how.