The champions league is already tedious so expanding the groups while also guaranteeing 'big clubs' qualification every year whatever, just devalues it further for me. Liverpool and Manc U both owned by yanks who see no point in the danger of relegation.
There's a few league clubs already either rowing back from supporting this or claiming the near unanimous acceptance previously announced isn't true.
You've got a lot of clubs in the deep stuff, many that already were pre-covid , and the offer or carrot of a large wedge of cash now and possibly every year, will be huge for owners. It's the difference between death and survival for some and the alternate answer to putting in significant amounts of their own cash for others.
It may be just a wish too far unfortunately that this is anything to do with serious reform.
Honestly for clubs similar to ours more money will be promised and we will lose influence we might feel we didn't have anyway. We could regret that further down the line if it doesn't suit those higher up to continue to pay out, or much worse as things develope and we aren't seen as core.
There are serious things that need considering for the future for the strength of the pyramid, player welfare, development and sustainability, and in the area of governance to stop bored or disinterested owners pillaging and trashing clubs or simply overstretching and gambling on future success, I doubt this will go anywhere near it.
Registering near total approval so early for me just signals wanting whatever cash is possible desperately and everything else can wait. You can only sell yourself once.
I think the rather strange voting system is put in to these proposals but could be negotiated out...surely in any negotiation you would start with an extreme position and be ‘persuaded’ to a more reasonable one (that you would find acceptable). Brexit negotiations should have followed this familiar path. But it assumes both sides want a deal.
One issue I never see addressed really is how to make the general football public more interested in other teams rather than the “big six”. It’s a result of the capitalist nature of our world and commercial sport but can’t the league or FA as a whole do more to promote all its clubs not just the big ones. I like 5 live as a station but they dedicate so much of their air time to the big six. I suppose it’s supply and demand, but the depth of the football league isn’t appreciated and in some ways ridiculed by some.
@WildWestFC said:
One issue I never see addressed really is how to make the general football public more interested in other teams rather than the “big six”. It’s a result of the capitalist nature of our world and commercial sport but can’t the league or FA as a whole do more to promote all its clubs not just the big ones. I like 5 live as a station but they dedicate so much of their air time to the big six. I suppose it’s supply and demand, but the depth of the football league isn’t appreciated and in some ways ridiculed by some.
The Premier League was designed to do exactly the opposite and has been extremely successful.
@WildWestFC said:
One issue I never see addressed really is how to make the general football public more interested in other teams rather than the “big six”. It’s a result of the capitalist nature of our world and commercial sport but can’t the league or FA as a whole do more to promote all its clubs not just the big ones. I like 5 live as a station but they dedicate so much of their air time to the big six. I suppose it’s supply and demand, but the depth of the football league isn’t appreciated and in some ways ridiculed by some.
The Premier League was designed to do exactly the opposite and has been extremely successful.
18 teams across the country, no relegation, no promotion. One national trophy and some form of European trophy. Monies made from TV and merchandising world-wide. Clubs below feeder teams for the 18, watched live by virtually no-one and hardly mentioned in the media. If I was an owner of one of the 18 and wanted such a thing I’d be hoping for a moment in history when the lower leagues faced financial ruin and most people’s attention was elsewhere....
Who here genuinely believes that club owners suddenly gifted a substantial amount of money wont simply splurge it on higher wages and transfer fees in pursuit of possible promotion etc. and in a couple of years time come back begging for more. Chucking money at football at any level is pointless without hard and fast rules about how football and football clubs are run. Currently it seems Wycombe are being sensibly and sustainably run but I think we're an exception rather than the norm.
I think chucking an extra sum of money at each club puts us at a disadvantage in the short term as we would invest rather than spend.
Under these proposals is this headline cash injection real or just bringing forward money we would get in due course anyway? I am really not sure more money in the pool is the answer.
@Right_in_the_Middle said:
I think chucking an extra sum of money at each club puts us at a disadvantage in the short term as we would invest rather than spend.
Under these proposals is this headline cash injection real or just bringing forward money we would get in due course anyway? I am really not sure more money in the pool is the answer.
The initial amount seems to only be an advance, Prem to borrow money if needed to cover that. The increase in the yearly payment going forward effectively comes from Prem clubs outside the top 6 getting less TV money, can't see how they ever vote for this.
this made me laugh: "The United and Liverpool idea is encountering fierce opposition from the bottom fourteen Premier League clubs". Man Utd are currently 16th in the premier League, so maybe they didn't mean "bottom" in any sense that a football fan would immediately recognise.
When two extra clubs get turfed out of the football league they can at least understand> @our_frank said:
this made me laugh: "The United and Liverpool idea is encountering fierce opposition from the bottom fourteen Premier League clubs". Man Utd are currently 16th in the premier League, so maybe they didn't mean "bottom" in any sense that a football fan would immediately recognise.
It seems odder to me that Liverpool, who have had a strong last two years, but were wildly derided for dropping off a cliff for 30 years seem to be giving it loads now.
I agree that this scheme is unlikely to be voted through.
For 11 of the 14 non top six clubs, the scheme means
1) two of the 14 will no longer have a place
2) no parachute money if they go down
3) less money in PL
4) less voting rights
For Southampton, Everton and west ham , 1) 2) and 3) still apply and they only get improved voting rights if the big six don't gang up and vote as a block.
That for now though is for the PL to worry about. From the point of view of the EFL clubs I didn't see anything in there to be overly negative about.Have i missed anything or would we take that package if somehow the PL clubs en-masse approved it?
We should put in a cheeky application for the Super League, just to annoy L1 fans more.
Applicant: Wycombe Wanderers
Qualifications: Have always beaten Man City
Have never lost to Man United or Arsenal
Have never lost a competitive game to any top continental club
American owner can talk about baseball and NFL with Kroenke, Glazers
and Fenway blokes.
Strongest player in the world
@Malone I think I read somewhere else it would not replace the PL, but in that case, I am guessing the clubs would have monstrous squads, with one for the EPL and one for the regular old PL.
Comments
The crazy voting system is all the premier league clubs are interested in.
The champions league is already tedious so expanding the groups while also guaranteeing 'big clubs' qualification every year whatever, just devalues it further for me. Liverpool and Manc U both owned by yanks who see no point in the danger of relegation.
There's a few league clubs already either rowing back from supporting this or claiming the near unanimous acceptance previously announced isn't true.
You've got a lot of clubs in the deep stuff, many that already were pre-covid , and the offer or carrot of a large wedge of cash now and possibly every year, will be huge for owners. It's the difference between death and survival for some and the alternate answer to putting in significant amounts of their own cash for others.
It may be just a wish too far unfortunately that this is anything to do with serious reform.
Honestly for clubs similar to ours more money will be promised and we will lose influence we might feel we didn't have anyway. We could regret that further down the line if it doesn't suit those higher up to continue to pay out, or much worse as things develope and we aren't seen as core.
There are serious things that need considering for the future for the strength of the pyramid, player welfare, development and sustainability, and in the area of governance to stop bored or disinterested owners pillaging and trashing clubs or simply overstretching and gambling on future success, I doubt this will go anywhere near it.
Registering near total approval so early for me just signals wanting whatever cash is possible desperately and everything else can wait. You can only sell yourself once.
I think the rather strange voting system is put in to these proposals but could be negotiated out...surely in any negotiation you would start with an extreme position and be ‘persuaded’ to a more reasonable one (that you would find acceptable). Brexit negotiations should have followed this familiar path. But it assumes both sides want a deal.
Either way, the 9 club limit is dumb maths. "Hey lower 11 clubs, please vote to make your vote count for far less in the future."
Maybe Man United thought they were buying Maguire for 80,000? Numbers are clearly not their strong suit.
One issue I never see addressed really is how to make the general football public more interested in other teams rather than the “big six”. It’s a result of the capitalist nature of our world and commercial sport but can’t the league or FA as a whole do more to promote all its clubs not just the big ones. I like 5 live as a station but they dedicate so much of their air time to the big six. I suppose it’s supply and demand, but the depth of the football league isn’t appreciated and in some ways ridiculed by some.
The Premier League was designed to do exactly the opposite and has been extremely successful.
18 teams across the country, no relegation, no promotion. One national trophy and some form of European trophy. Monies made from TV and merchandising world-wide. Clubs below feeder teams for the 18, watched live by virtually no-one and hardly mentioned in the media. If I was an owner of one of the 18 and wanted such a thing I’d be hoping for a moment in history when the lower leagues faced financial ruin and most people’s attention was elsewhere....
Who here genuinely believes that club owners suddenly gifted a substantial amount of money wont simply splurge it on higher wages and transfer fees in pursuit of possible promotion etc. and in a couple of years time come back begging for more. Chucking money at football at any level is pointless without hard and fast rules about how football and football clubs are run. Currently it seems Wycombe are being sensibly and sustainably run but I think we're an exception rather than the norm.
I think chucking an extra sum of money at each club puts us at a disadvantage in the short term as we would invest rather than spend.
Under these proposals is this headline cash injection real or just bringing forward money we would get in due course anyway? I am really not sure more money in the pool is the answer.
The initial amount seems to only be an advance, Prem to borrow money if needed to cover that. The increase in the yearly payment going forward effectively comes from Prem clubs outside the top 6 getting less TV money, can't see how they ever vote for this.
Pretty good coverage of this on the excellent NTT20 Podcast this week.
David Bernstein has an alternative proposal, set to be unveiled this week https://theathletic.com/news/premier-league-project-big-picture-latest/aIqc97tPyoIW
this made me laugh: "The United and Liverpool idea is encountering fierce opposition from the bottom fourteen Premier League clubs". Man Utd are currently 16th in the premier League, so maybe they didn't mean "bottom" in any sense that a football fan would immediately recognise.
When two extra clubs get turfed out of the football league they can at least understand> @our_frank said:
It seems odder to me that Liverpool, who have had a strong last two years, but were wildly derided for dropping off a cliff for 30 years seem to be giving it loads now.
I agree that this scheme is unlikely to be voted through.
For 11 of the 14 non top six clubs, the scheme means
1) two of the 14 will no longer have a place
2) no parachute money if they go down
3) less money in PL
4) less voting rights
For Southampton, Everton and west ham , 1) 2) and 3) still apply and they only get improved voting rights if the big six don't gang up and vote as a block.
That for now though is for the PL to worry about. From the point of view of the EFL clubs I didn't see anything in there to be overly negative about.Have i missed anything or would we take that package if somehow the PL clubs en-masse approved it?
It's off
Was always going to happen.
The classic, ask for something ludicrous, knowing it'll be panned situation.
Then release the actual idea that they really wanted.
Do the ‘big six’ fear relegation? No
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/54554187
Maybe this season is just about being around for the next one?
Blimey Peter Ridsdale. Didn't realise he was still involved in football - or even still alive. Bugger used to quite like Preston.
How is that man still allowed near a football club?
The money was just resting in his account...
This sounds even worse that the 'Big Picture' proposals: https://news.sky.com/story/top-english-clubs-in-bombshell-talks-to-join-european-premier-league-12109175
It would be bad news for whichever one of the "big six" missed out, presumably Spurs.
Are we the only club to have had both an Orange Day and a Celtic Day?
That should have gone on the Reading matchday thread
Gasroom clearly broken
We should put in a cheeky application for the Super League, just to annoy L1 fans more.
Applicant: Wycombe Wanderers
Qualifications: Have always beaten Man City
Have never lost to Man United or Arsenal
Have never lost a competitive game to any top continental club
American owner can talk about baseball and NFL with Kroenke, Glazers
and Fenway blokes.
Strongest player in the world
Does sound woeful.
It's unclear if it's instead of the league or instead of the current euro format.
Anything "closed shop" is something any reasonable fan should fight to the death to avoid.
@Malone I think I read somewhere else it would not replace the PL, but in that case, I am guessing the clubs would have monstrous squads, with one for the EPL and one for the regular old PL.