Yesterdays sending off debate
It should be really interesting to see if any referee assessors or the FA ask yesterdays referee Darren Deadman
to explain how he came to his desicion to award only a yellow against the Burton keeper.
He had two options, in my opinion.
1, To overule the linesman and declare McClaughlin hadn't handled the ball out side his area.
2, Take his time to think why did the keeper handle outside his area ? (every one could clearly see the erratic high bounce
had caught him out, and would have left Fred a tap in) and would have no option but to pull out a red card.
I do not want to hear an apology by the Ref, saying he's got this one wrong, He did not have to make an impulse decision.
the officials are all wired up and he could have had a thorough discussion with the linesman, but no, immediately after the linesman flagged he reaached into his right pocket for his yellow card, which he tried to half disguise by holding it down by his right thigh.
Although still appearing to be communicating with the linesman he then takes about 30 seconds before raising the card.
How could he come to than conclusion ????
My theory is that he did not have the bottle to send the keeper off, in what is a very tight and compact Pirelli Stadium.
The authorities really need to ask, If you do not have the courage to upset the home crowd by making a straight forward decision, then you can not be trusted to deliver impartiality to referee at this level.
Technically Burton would have been down to nine men with "Shaking Shearer" having to go betwwen the sticks, and with the amount of corners we were getting, it would been comical to watch his nervous flapping in an oppositions shirt.
One More point the name Deadman has long sent shivers down longtime Wanderers fans spines, as was it not 'Deadeye Deadman' whose offside goal cost us our Wembley place 40 odd years ago v Hendon ?
Hopefully yesterdays referee 'Deadeyes Deadman' spineless decision doesn't cause us so much pain !!
Comments
Although the referee was 100% wrong and everyone I've spoken to agrees (as well as the Football LS taking our side), I don't buy that he was intimidated.
It's one of the smallest grounds in the FL and around the corner from national referee training centre.
Sheer incompetence.
I think it would be a big step forward if referees explained some of these key decisions. They do in international cricket and both rugby codes at the top level. Sometimes it's simply a lack of understanding from the crowd (I love watching crowds howling at corners not being taken from inside the arc when the new rule the ball just has to shadow it) and I think an explanation of the thought process on things such has the hand ball would be a learning for us all.
Just for some context my default position on ref's is that they are all rubbish. I hate lazy ref's like the one on Friday who never get close enough from the play. I don't understand why all ref's stand on the far edge of the penalty area at corners when everything will be moving away from them. I also understand that players put amazing pressure on decision making. Bloomfield howling banshee impression on Friday might have made a good picture and show passion but it was putting pressure on the ref. I think I saw him doing much the same yesterday too.
Like you I hope these decisions don't define a season but I certainly don't believe they even out. Bottom line is that the Burton keeper should have been sent off and it would do all in football a great service if we knew why he wasn't.
Is there a video of the incident available online?
Hang on... I've just found it on the Football League Show. Fred stops running and there's a covering defender a few metres ahead of him. Just a yellow for me.
@rolo So explain to me why you've reached that conclusion. Deliberate or non deliberate hand ball? Lack of goal scoring chance?
I've always assumed a deliberate hand ball by a keeper is a sending off regardless of anything else. I'm assuming now that's not the case but can't see anything to back it up and have seen loads of keepers sent off for handball in much less goal scoring chances than yesterday.
I think the rules have changed on this in the last few years - not sure exactly when though.
I believe it does now take into account deliberate vs accidental handball for goalkeepers. Now tell me whether yesterday's two handed 'catch' was deliberate or accidental, and what direction the ball was travelling in?
Then compare to the outcome if an outfield player were to catch the ball deliberately with two hands just outside the area?
Everything points to a straight red.
Also remember 'last man' rule is like offside rule and counts two players, so if the goalkeeper is involved he is almost automatically the last man.
Can you be sure Mousinho would have got back to clear ?? would Fred carried on Running if the keeper shaped up to head or stopped and try to scramble back ?
The fact that Both Burton keeper and players desperately try to convince the officials that the offence took place inside the area, says it all for me.
It was Red all day long. Just watched it back on the FL show, blatant bottling from the ref. If you deliberately catch the ball outside the box when the shot was heading goal-wards that's 100% red. I was convinced at the time when it saw it live yesterday, now seeing it back its even more obvious.
I'm not sure the ball was heading directly towards the goal but did think that the defender (Mousinho?) would have cleared. Deliberate hand ball by any player is a yellow card offence unless it is denying a clear goalscoring opportunity (nothing to do with last man or whether it is the goalkeeper). I wouldn't say it was a clear goalscoring opportunity as Fred stopped his run and Mousinho would have cleared in all likelihood. I wouldn't even say for sure that you could say the handball was definitely deliberate. If the ball was heading directly towards the goal then maybe the case for a goalscoring opportunity could be argued but the ref has to be sure of that.
I stand by my statement but then I am going on a couple of seconds of footage and nothing else.
This does all serve to underline that an explanation by the ref in these situations would help!
Accidental Handball by the goalkeeper is a yellow card. Mr Deadman had a good game.
@blueh_w How anyone can label purposefully choosing to catch a ball as accidental is quite simply farcical. However, having seen your previous posts on here it is very clear that you're just on a wind up. Nothing to see here.
@Rolo
"I wouldn't even say for sure that you could say the handball was definitely deliberate."
Are you insane ?
The keeper caught the ball clearly outside his area, of which he clearly knew,hence him shoving his hands with the ball back towards the penalty area.
@ChasHarps That's the response of a keeper who knows he's somewhere near the edge of his area in my book. I don't buy that he can keep an eye on the line whilst jumping to catch an airborne ball. Either way it's still not a goalscoring opportunity unless Ingram's punt was goalbound.
How can a two handed catch not be deliberate?
Where with the Oxford decision there is at least the excuse that the officials had to very quickly decide 'foul or no foul', here there can be no excuse.
The fact that the opposition manager all but admitted it, and it got extra scrutiny on the FLS says it all.
Having now seen the footage, it's a tough one. I think the keeper is very, very lucky not to have been sent off. He quite clearly comes outside of his area and catches the the ball which is bouncing over his head. However from the referee's viewpoint, he has to be sure it's stopping a goalscoring opportunity and with Fred stopping his run, the Burton defender may well have been able to clear the danger. Not a clear cut red, but I think a red card would result more often than not for a keeper deliberately handling a ball outside the area with the ball travelling towards the goal.
I don't actually think Mr Deadman saw the incident so was probably the linesman who told him what course of action to take.
Even if the decision was wrong what good does howling at the fourth official do? As for pressurising the referee directly, in some sports you would get sent off straight away for that (usually for a limited time). That is something which football should think of adopting. Even a yellow card under the present rules should be used.
It always surprises me how few people seem to know that rule. It's been in place years too.
Yellow for me. Stupid decision by the keeper to catch it, but that doesn't make it a red card. It's only red if Fred would get on the end of it and score, which I don't think he would, or if the ball was going in, which I'm not convinced it was. And even if it was, one of the defenders could probably have got there and cleared.
The yellow card for the keeper wasn't shown on either ours or Burton's YouTube channels
however it was shown on the football league show last night go to about 1h:03 mins
Link: http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b05qpdwv/the-football-league-show-20142015-06042015
I think everyone has missed the fact that the ball was going in. The keeper misjudged the bounce could not have possible headed it and deliberately handled it outside the area. Straight red for me for stopping a certain goal from Ingram.
@ChasHarps, Excellently put. The referee, simply bottled it and I am sorry if he can't officiate a League 2 top of the table encounter correctly, in my opinion should referee down in the Conference league.
Chairboys have had two bad decisions in the last two games, but refs not doing their jobs.
If a ref is poor then he shouldn't referee at all. Why would dropping him down the leagues make a difference. What have we done to get poor top flight refs and why would the conference want our poor refs.
Who will be refereeing the hundreds of games around the country every weekend? There aren't an unlimited number of top quality, willing referees. In the same way that there aren't an unlimited number of Premier League quality players - Stewart Lewis might not be League 2 standard, so he drops a division or two, he doesn't stop playing altogether.
I don't think it's even been mentioned that Mansfield should have had a penalty against Shrews either!
Players aren't actually coached at passing the ball to the opposition but are very successful at it. Similarly referees are equally adept at making mistakes, but probably a lot fewer. They are all human with similar failings.
The referee at Burton has been in my memory for a long time.......WW v MK Dons at the Hockey Stadium.Various decisions during that game led me to the conclusion that it was the worst refereeing performance I had ever seen.Just watched the handball on the FLS-definitely knew he was outside the area and made it try to look he wasn't.That's deliberate and a red card.Have a look at their goal.Who was trying to cover the cut inside?Surprising.Have a look at the four WW players standing within 5 yards of each other in the penalty area and who they were.Anybody(s) there who might/should have been elsewhere?
Darren Deadman isn't afraid to make big calls, if you look at the red cards he has shown this season, this is also the 3rd time he has referee our games this season and I think he gave us a dubious penalty against Mansfield at home when were so under the cosh its untrue.
He also corrected sent Bloomers off last season for a studs up tackle in a big game against Bury.