im finding myself commenting more often these days ! .... i must admit as much as im happy for reports as i cant get to many away games... i do find it very strange that we have someone doing the reports that has been openingly abusive towards our players ?!?!. You hardly feel as if they are rational reports in that case .... and as someone above remarked, not commenting on AP just because youve got the hump about something is indeed very childish
@HolmerBlue said:
im finding myself commenting more often these days ! .... i must admit as much as im happy for reports as i cant get to many away games... i do find it very strange that we have someone doing the reports that has been openingly abusive towards our players ?!?!. You hardly feel as if they are rational reports in that case .... and as someone above remarked, not commenting on AP just because youve got the hump about something is indeed very childish
I'd rather no comment than a bad or spiteful one. The report is balanced and he's been given a fair score/10. Would saying "had a decent game" really affect your reading pleasure that much?
I don;t see the Gasroom as reflecting any age group or having any influence, anymore than I assume all the drunken arseholes are young. I've seen enough white van men looking for trouble at matches to know it's a false demographic. And also most fans have a pint or two before the game. I would imagine the Gasroom reflects the views of the relatively small number of fans who post on the Gasroom in the same way the Facebook site reflects the views of the (again) probably relatively small number who regularly post there. I am sure we all think we're grrrrreat and only our opinion matters. I would imagine the vast majority of fans don't do either...and therefore singing about the Gasroom probably makes no sense to them.
As for reports, facts are facts, but it's not helped me certainly thinking that the poster could have been booing or heckling one of our players at the game...or looking to confront them afterwards. Hopefully this has given everyone pause for thought about the power for good or ill of too much drink and that there social media.
What @Chris said. Also thought that AP, JJ and Harriman were all worth 7s, even though Sido for me was MoM. It's was a tough game for all the defenders against good opposition and I thought they kept their shape and stuck to their tasks really well.
@HCblue Life is too short for bitterness and distrust but time is short so not reading these reports gives me plenty of time of more fulfilling stuff. Don't worry about me.
@Vital - Your penultimate paragraph is somewhat economical with the truth. His earlier unfair comments on Blackman were clearly in my view "open abuse".
@mooneyman said:
Vital - Your penultimate paragraph is somewhat economical with the truth. His earlier unfair comments on Blackman were clearly in my view "open abuse".
None of the reports included open abuse at all. Blackman was pretty terrible for a few weeks and it was reported. Would you rather it was glossed over? "A goal was conceded following a mistake by an unnamed player"
While Mr clift is entitled to write what he wants, would you agree with me that in the circumstances he showed considerable immaturity in the last part of this report?
Would you also agree with me that that and other posts here and behaviour at Barnet suggests that Clifty and the Knobheads do not appear to have learnt from this sad episode and that further action from the club is therefore likely to be required?
I have no idea about his social media profile, but though I have sometimes disagreed with the reports of games I've seen, I don't recall any overt abuse of players above and beyond pointing out a poor game or two. As I have said, it would disappointing to me, at least, if after all the weekend's dissection of events @clifty04 and chums were still heckling AP at Barnet...but that's life.
While Mr clift is entitled to write what he wants, would you agree with me that in the circumstances he showed considerable immaturity in the last part of this report?
Would you also agree with me that that and other posts here and behaviour at Barnet suggests that Clifty and the Knobheads do not appear to have learnt from this sad episode and that further action from the club is therefore likely to be required?
You really are a top ****, you can insert whatever you prefer there.
Further action for what exactly? What are a whole group of people supposed to have done that warrants further action?
Further action I suspect will be some sort of "this is the minimum behaviour expected statement" with a clean slate but a warning that if then breached, action up to bans will be enforced. Not a moment too soon IMHO.
@Username out of interest, does chanting "gasroom where are you" add or perhaps detract from the stmosphere of the Wycombe support? Would you not consider it slightly toxic/threatening? Equally so, jeering one of our own players when he touches the ball? Genuinely interested not trying to pick an argument either way.
@EwanHoosaami said:
Username out of interest, does chanting "gasroom where are you" add or perhaps detract from the stmosphere of the Wycombe support? Would you not consider it slightly toxic/threatening? Equally so, jeering one of our own players when he touches the ball? Genuinely interested not trying to pick an argument either way.
Detract of course, and slightly toxic yes, but not threatening. Much like the stuff posted on here towards them. It's not "action worthy" though.
Takes a lot for me to jeer a player on my own team, they have to be thoroughly inept...I can't remember the last one, maybe Gary Silk? But if I was personally friends with someone who'd had an incident with a player, that could persuade me to show dissent.
Really would it? If I thought my friend had been a complete knobhead and (on one level at least) deserved pretty much what he got, not sure I would "show dissent". Perhaps by "showing dissent", it suggests that they thought their knobhead mates actions were acceptable.
Really would it? If I thought my friend had been a complete knobhead and (on one level at least) deserved pretty much what he got, not sure I would "show dissent". Perhaps by "showing dissent", it suggests that they thought their knobhead mates actions were acceptable.
If you're referring to Pierre's rating of 6, I'd say it was a fair reflection of his performance.
But I imagine you're referring to the lack of a comment on Pierre, which can either be viewed as a snub, or a sensible act of restraint depending on your agenda.
Would you not agree that calling Adam and his friends "Clifty and the Knobheads" is unhelpful, immature, and a demonstration of the guilt by association I referred to.
I would describe that as a fair reflection of their behaviour on repeated occasions.
They could tone it down and be a credit to Wycombe Wanderers. I see no sign that they have the maturity or frankly desire to do so. Time will tell I suppose. Perhaps you are right, I will leave it here and give them the opportunity.
@Username so how is jeering one of our players going to help the club achieve the aim of winning the game, getting another 3 points and help us get to the holy grail of the play offs?
It's not going to help, but I don't think a smattering of dissent will hinder it either.
How much cheering the few hundred fans who make noise do or don't do has little to no actual effect on the players. (IMO of course).
Edit: I think that's a main difference between a paying punter and a paid employee. For the employee everything they do needs to be towards a completely 100% positive outcome/ outlook even if things are going badly. A punter has a right to openly criticize/ voice dissent when things aren't going well. (Although some do admittedly take this too far).
Think the abuse was mostly on twitter rather than in the reports but if you find the chap offensive then reading the reports isn't compulsory, it would be inappropriate for him to be doing the official reports on the club site but I don't imagine that will happen any time soon, i like the independent reports and the opinions of others at the game who can agree or disagree, the need to comment on everything regardless of wether you can add anything to the debate is unfortunately a pitfall of this site at times
@Username Well, there is no doubt that a united vocal support helps the team, as I don't doubt we have both witnessed on several occasions & has been quoted many times by both players & management. On that I will presume we agree. Conversely the effect of jeering & abusing must have at the very least a distracting effect surely, therefore an adverse consequence is more likely.
As to your last paragraph, I think you now have to make the distinction as to what the "jeerers" are? Paying customers, fans or supporters, as do that group as well. It appears to morph to suit whatever argument/debate is involved.
As a paying customer/punter, (if that is their status), they have a simple choice, vote with their wallets/feet and not attend. I suppose they could write a letter, but when you consider the complaints about the fare offered on the pitch, every club would receive many thousands of letters every season & be collectively ignored, as performance levels rise and fall with the tide. I'm afraid that's the nature of the sport.
Can they really be labelled a "supporter", when jeering & abusing? Not in my eyes. I make a point of shouting encouragement louder in support of any player, that has made a mistake or having a stinker on the day, in the hope that it will help give them a lift. I see abuse or loud open public criticism as only going to make the players day/performance levels worse. To me, that makes me a supporter.
I never see myself as a punter or customer, too modern for my liking. I am a customer of some supermarkets, if the product I purchase is not up to standard then I return it and discuss the issue with a member of staff. As a punter/customer, I don't see it as a right to stand in a public arena outside the shop shouting abuse at the staff. I do not reach for my mobile operating device and plaster it all over "sowshaawl meeeja".
I think that's the difference between the "older supporters" & the "younger customers/punters" perhaps?
The "Gasroom, where are you" chant perplexed me quite a lot throughout the course of yesterday.
What is the desired outcome of this? The Gasroom has been summoned, but how should it respond?
Perhaps it ought to nominate a champion, and the Facebook group can do the same. At the Doncaster game there can be a battle to the death.
It could be held in the neutral ground of the Main Stand Paddock enclosure (because everyone knows all Facebook users stand on the terrace and Gasroomers sit in the Frank Adams, who even sits in the Main Stand anyway?!).
There could finally be a use for those ridiculous fucking polystyrene novelty hands from the club shop as boxing gloves, although I think this has gone far enough to warrant bare knuckle scrap.
The Gasroom's hero will no doubt be a match-day-badge-collecting, bovril drinking, 1992/3 pristine replica shirt owning type. But will experience trump the fitness of youth, manifest in some skinny-jeaned, flat-peak sporting yoof?
Comments
@Right_in_the_Middle That seems like a particularly effective way of maintaining eternal bitterness and distrust.
im finding myself commenting more often these days ! .... i must admit as much as im happy for reports as i cant get to many away games... i do find it very strange that we have someone doing the reports that has been openingly abusive towards our players ?!?!. You hardly feel as if they are rational reports in that case .... and as someone above remarked, not commenting on AP just because youve got the hump about something is indeed very childish
I'd rather no comment than a bad or spiteful one. The report is balanced and he's been given a fair score/10. Would saying "had a decent game" really affect your reading pleasure that much?
Very little. Would have made Clift look less of an immature knobhead though, wouldn't you agree?
Think I could be inclined to make small point if a mate of mine had been headbutted.
But yes, it would have. I'm sure he knew it would get noticed.
I don;t see the Gasroom as reflecting any age group or having any influence, anymore than I assume all the drunken arseholes are young. I've seen enough white van men looking for trouble at matches to know it's a false demographic. And also most fans have a pint or two before the game. I would imagine the Gasroom reflects the views of the relatively small number of fans who post on the Gasroom in the same way the Facebook site reflects the views of the (again) probably relatively small number who regularly post there. I am sure we all think we're grrrrreat and only our opinion matters. I would imagine the vast majority of fans don't do either...and therefore singing about the Gasroom probably makes no sense to them.
As for reports, facts are facts, but it's not helped me certainly thinking that the poster could have been booing or heckling one of our players at the game...or looking to confront them afterwards. Hopefully this has given everyone pause for thought about the power for good or ill of too much drink and that there social media.
@bookertease and until I get get reduced prices on season tickets I resent the implication I am a 'gasroom oap' : - )
What @Chris said. Also thought that AP, JJ and Harriman were all worth 7s, even though Sido for me was MoM. It's was a tough game for all the defenders against good opposition and I thought they kept their shape and stuck to their tasks really well.
I'm grateful to @clifty04 for sparing a few hours every month to help me out with a couple of reports.
As far as I'm concerned, they offer a balanced view of the action along with his opinion on the performance of the team and the individual players.
They have never included "open abuse" towards our players.
There's an element of guilt by association going on here.
@HCblue Life is too short for bitterness and distrust but time is short so not reading these reports gives me plenty of time of more fulfilling stuff. Don't worry about me.
@Vital - Your penultimate paragraph is somewhat economical with the truth. His earlier unfair comments on Blackman were clearly in my view "open abuse".
@mooneyman Point me to a Vital article that includes abuse of Jamal Blackman.
None of the reports included open abuse at all. Blackman was pretty terrible for a few weeks and it was reported. Would you rather it was glossed over? "A goal was conceded following a mistake by an unnamed player"
Out of interest, Vital.
While Mr clift is entitled to write what he wants, would you agree with me that in the circumstances he showed considerable immaturity in the last part of this report?
Would you also agree with me that that and other posts here and behaviour at Barnet suggests that Clifty and the Knobheads do not appear to have learnt from this sad episode and that further action from the club is therefore likely to be required?
I have no idea about his social media profile, but though I have sometimes disagreed with the reports of games I've seen, I don't recall any overt abuse of players above and beyond pointing out a poor game or two. As I have said, it would disappointing to me, at least, if after all the weekend's dissection of events @clifty04 and chums were still heckling AP at Barnet...but that's life.
You really are a top ****, you can insert whatever you prefer there.
Further action for what exactly? What are a whole group of people supposed to have done that warrants further action?
Further action I suspect will be some sort of "this is the minimum behaviour expected statement" with a clean slate but a warning that if then breached, action up to bans will be enforced. Not a moment too soon IMHO.
@Username out of interest, does chanting "gasroom where are you" add or perhaps detract from the stmosphere of the Wycombe support? Would you not consider it slightly toxic/threatening? Equally so, jeering one of our own players when he touches the ball? Genuinely interested not trying to pick an argument either way.
Detract of course, and slightly toxic yes, but not threatening. Much like the stuff posted on here towards them. It's not "action worthy" though.
Takes a lot for me to jeer a player on my own team, they have to be thoroughly inept...I can't remember the last one, maybe Gary Silk? But if I was personally friends with someone who'd had an incident with a player, that could persuade me to show dissent.
Really would it? If I thought my friend had been a complete knobhead and (on one level at least) deserved pretty much what he got, not sure I would "show dissent". Perhaps by "showing dissent", it suggests that they thought their knobhead mates actions were acceptable.
No it doesn't at all.
@DevC
If you're referring to Pierre's rating of 6, I'd say it was a fair reflection of his performance.
But I imagine you're referring to the lack of a comment on Pierre, which can either be viewed as a snub, or a sensible act of restraint depending on your agenda.
Would you not agree that calling Adam and his friends "Clifty and the Knobheads" is unhelpful, immature, and a demonstration of the guilt by association I referred to.
I would describe that as a fair reflection of their behaviour on repeated occasions.
They could tone it down and be a credit to Wycombe Wanderers. I see no sign that they have the maturity or frankly desire to do so. Time will tell I suppose. Perhaps you are right, I will leave it here and give them the opportunity.
@Username so how is jeering one of our players going to help the club achieve the aim of winning the game, getting another 3 points and help us get to the holy grail of the play offs?
It's not going to help, but I don't think a smattering of dissent will hinder it either.
How much cheering the few hundred fans who make noise do or don't do has little to no actual effect on the players. (IMO of course).
Edit: I think that's a main difference between a paying punter and a paid employee. For the employee everything they do needs to be towards a completely 100% positive outcome/ outlook even if things are going badly. A punter has a right to openly criticize/ voice dissent when things aren't going well. (Although some do admittedly take this too far).
Ageism > @StrongestTeam said:
No it isn't
@Username Well, there is no doubt that a united vocal support helps the team, as I don't doubt we have both witnessed on several occasions & has been quoted many times by both players & management. On that I will presume we agree. Conversely the effect of jeering & abusing must have at the very least a distracting effect surely, therefore an adverse consequence is more likely.
As to your last paragraph, I think you now have to make the distinction as to what the "jeerers" are? Paying customers, fans or supporters, as do that group as well. It appears to morph to suit whatever argument/debate is involved.
As a paying customer/punter, (if that is their status), they have a simple choice, vote with their wallets/feet and not attend. I suppose they could write a letter, but when you consider the complaints about the fare offered on the pitch, every club would receive many thousands of letters every season & be collectively ignored, as performance levels rise and fall with the tide. I'm afraid that's the nature of the sport.
Can they really be labelled a "supporter", when jeering & abusing? Not in my eyes. I make a point of shouting encouragement louder in support of any player, that has made a mistake or having a stinker on the day, in the hope that it will help give them a lift. I see abuse or loud open public criticism as only going to make the players day/performance levels worse. To me, that makes me a supporter.
I never see myself as a punter or customer, too modern for my liking. I am a customer of some supermarkets, if the product I purchase is not up to standard then I return it and discuss the issue with a member of staff. As a punter/customer, I don't see it as a right to stand in a public arena outside the shop shouting abuse at the staff. I do not reach for my mobile operating device and plaster it all over "sowshaawl meeeja".
I think that's the difference between the "older supporters" & the "younger customers/punters" perhaps?
The "Gasroom, where are you" chant perplexed me quite a lot throughout the course of yesterday.
What is the desired outcome of this? The Gasroom has been summoned, but how should it respond?
Perhaps it ought to nominate a champion, and the Facebook group can do the same. At the Doncaster game there can be a battle to the death.
It could be held in the neutral ground of the Main Stand Paddock enclosure (because everyone knows all Facebook users stand on the terrace and Gasroomers sit in the Frank Adams, who even sits in the Main Stand anyway?!).
There could finally be a use for those ridiculous fucking polystyrene novelty hands from the club shop as boxing gloves, although I think this has gone far enough to warrant bare knuckle scrap.
The Gasroom's hero will no doubt be a match-day-badge-collecting, bovril drinking, 1992/3 pristine replica shirt owning type. But will experience trump the fitness of youth, manifest in some skinny-jeaned, flat-peak sporting yoof?
Sensational stuff @bill_stickers
Perhaps I could step forward someone compared me to a young gentleman Jim Corbett at the bowls club