I agree Plymouth's relegation season would be seriously informative. I understand that obviously they were too good to beat teams like Wycombe who don't play proper football, but it would have been interesting to understand why they also didn't beat any of the other teams.
Just sat down to Sunderland til I die. The marketing man is the worst example of tall, posh, self-obsessed, impressive for 10 minutes but completely missing the point. Every company has one.
Am I right in thinking Richard Hill who is head of player recruitment (or something) and turns up in episode 2 was John Gregory's assistant at Wycombe?
I found Charlie Methven a much more likable leader than Stewart Donald*. Personally, I like the disruptor style of management, trying to shake people out of their complacency; coming up with tonnes of ideas and then looking for your staff to make at least some of them work. There's nothing worse than managing a demotivated team who refuse to leave their comfort zone and just shoot down ideas - or worse, nod along and then ignore them. And judging by the series, he actually moved up to Sunderland and took a hands-on management role - unlike Donald, who was filmed mostly in his home (bad decision allowing that to happen) or in his soulless, Wernham-Hogg-esque insurance company office. Donald only once showed real authoritative leadership in going against his team's advice in signing Will Grigg - what a waste of £3m (rising to £4m) he's been. Perhaps he should have listened to his manager and advisers.
Other things of interest - is the average League One player salary really £2k a week? That's about twice what I would have instinctively expected it to be.
And while I can understand not showing the ruck at Wycombe, if you're going to make Luke O'Nien one of your lead characters (understandable given he oozes charisma and charm), why not show the fight with the Portsmouth fan in the play-off semis (unless there are legal proceedings ongoing?)
Shame there wasn't more from the football side - I'm amazed Duncan Watmore hasn't featured in either series as one of the club's more cerebral players. They could have done with more candid scenes from the clubhouse and physio room, like last season. Also, nowhere near enough of the Mackem characters, like those two chefs. But then, when you've got real life The Office characters like Stewart and Charlie giving you full access to themselves, I guess you seize the opportunity with both hands.
(*) Until the scene where Charlie was wearing red trousers, bright blue poloshirt and light grey sweater. Seriously, WTF?
Yes @aloysius I thought it could do with a bit more football. (Spoiler alert) Though the Maja/Grigg episode was quite entertaining...they cut it so much like the Grabban ('let's hope we don't lose him') saga in the last season, you sort of knew where it was going. I'm amazed they they could not have managed a decent loan (perhaps lost in the edit?) rather than over paying for Grigg. Just shows again what a gem we have in Gareth.
@eric_plant said:
Watching that Oxford simpleton getting played like a fiddle over the Will Grigg transfer was enormously entertaining
When both the manager and head of recruitment both said that's as high as he should go it was a bizarre decision. To be saying we haven't got the money and then finding the money ditto.
Just finished watching, have a level of sympathy for the two at the top probably solely based on the comparison with Wycombe. When you are spending and losing money at almost record rates and you've got a marketing department that's probably got more staff than our entire club and you've got departments that aren't paying their way or particularly enthusiastic you'd think there'd be a bit more realism about what that means for their jobs long term. Although the car park shot is in bad taste and I doubt it's all down to one person.
Luke comes across as a credit to himself and the game as he always has and it's difficult to not feel some sympathy for the fans they featured if not some that visited AP and make noise on twitter.
In the last season they left themselves in the brown stuff by not getting a replacement striker in the window and it seemed obvious there was a good chance that Maja would go but there seemed to be almost no mention of trying earlier to get players or looking at anyone othher than Grigg late on, and Hill doesn't come over well at all.
Had to smile at the radio host introducing deadline day as one of the favourite days in the football calendar except for the people who hate it, or words to that effect.
If they actually got to break even btw as they claimed at the end then that is some achievement, or sales lie. Quite how badly they've done so far this season though is difficult to fathom.
For what it's worth as we stand we are level on points having played two games less on a fraction of their budget. Well done Gaz and Dobbo, again.
I seem to have a memory of being sat near an incredibly angry Richard Hill at Readings old ground on the day Gregory went to Villa. We were playing them in the B&B Cup (??). He walked out the ground long before the game ended.
@our_frank said: @eric_plant Yes, we did. Gregory was in the dugout, but the rumours on the terrace were that he was going to Villa in the morning.
My memory is from the day Gregory went. We played at Elm Park in Reading. Might have been a reserve or B&B game. Richard Hill was a very angry man.
The Bristol Rovers game was the night before.
Funny how your memory plays tricks. I remember being in the car chatting to my mate about who we would get to replace Gregory. Even remember something on the radio about it.
It must have been the speculation we were discussing rather than the actual event
Just thinking how Gregory went from Wycombe averageness to the top division only 12 years ago and made a decent fist of it and now people seem content to explain to all how big a leap it would be for Ainsworth to manage at even a second tier level.
That night at Reading was a surreal one in my memory. I think the main reason I went was to pick up on any gossip as I think Hill thought he was in the running to take over. His mood was based on him not getting the caretaker job on top of not being taken to Villa by Gregory.
@Right_in_the_Middle said:
Just thinking how Gregory went from Wycombe averageness to the top division only 12 years ago and made a decent fist of it and now people seem content to explain to all how big a leap it would be for Ainsworth to manage at even a second tier level.
That night at Reading was a surreal one in my memory. I think the main reason I went was to pick up on any gossip as I think Hill thought he was in the running to take over. His mood was based on him not getting the caretaker job on top of not being taken to Villa by Gregory.
Whilst I would completely agree with @aloysius comments regarding a disruptive style of management being useful to break up complacency, etc, I would say that there are better ways of going about it. Personally, I thought that Charlie M came across as a ‘Grade A’ wanker and a bully with significant anger management issues.
Watching Donald being completely played by Wigan over the Grigg transfer, whilst letting himself be filmed (!!!) was indeed hilarious and made even better with the subsequent knowledge of how it worked out. The Wigan board must have watched that scene a 100 times by now and still find it funny.
Finished Season 2 last night.
What become pretty obvious was that following the Checkatrade final Jack Ross was a deadman walking in that job
It also showed just why GA turned them down. A mess top to bottom with many differnet people all pulling things in their own direction. The exact opposite to Wycombe.
I also wouldn't be surprised if it ever came out that Luke O'Nein told him not to touch the club as it was a basket case
@Guppys_Left_Leg said:
Finished Season 2 last night.
What become pretty obvious was that following the Checkatrade final Jack Ross was a deadman walking in that job
It also showed just why GA turned them down. A mess top to bottom with many differnet people all pulling things in their own direction. The exact opposite to Wycombe.
I also wouldn't be surprised if it ever came out that Luke O'Nein told him not to touch the club as it was a basket case
Do you genuinely believe Ainsworth actually turned it down?
He said in a recent interview - think it was the BT Sport thing - that he's turned down well-documented offers this season. Can't remember the exact quote, but the meaning was clear.
@Guppys_Left_Leg said:
Finished Season 2 last night.
What become pretty obvious was that following the Checkatrade final Jack Ross was a deadman walking in that job
It also showed just why GA turned them down. A mess top to bottom with many differnet people all pulling things in their own direction. The exact opposite to Wycombe.
I also wouldn't be surprised if it ever came out that Luke O'Nein told him not to touch the club as it was a basket case
Do you genuinely believe Ainsworth actually turned it down?
Comments
Good shouts - I can't help feeling Oldham would be bizarrely fascinating too. Or Coventry, for their upward surge in the midst of a nomadic existence.
I agree Plymouth's relegation season would be seriously informative. I understand that obviously they were too good to beat teams like Wycombe who don't play proper football, but it would have been interesting to understand why they also didn't beat any of the other teams.
Just sat down to Sunderland til I die. The marketing man is the worst example of tall, posh, self-obsessed, impressive for 10 minutes but completely missing the point. Every company has one.
Am I right in thinking Richard Hill who is head of player recruitment (or something) and turns up in episode 2 was John Gregory's assistant at Wycombe?
Yes he was !!
I found Charlie Methven a much more likable leader than Stewart Donald*. Personally, I like the disruptor style of management, trying to shake people out of their complacency; coming up with tonnes of ideas and then looking for your staff to make at least some of them work. There's nothing worse than managing a demotivated team who refuse to leave their comfort zone and just shoot down ideas - or worse, nod along and then ignore them. And judging by the series, he actually moved up to Sunderland and took a hands-on management role - unlike Donald, who was filmed mostly in his home (bad decision allowing that to happen) or in his soulless, Wernham-Hogg-esque insurance company office. Donald only once showed real authoritative leadership in going against his team's advice in signing Will Grigg - what a waste of £3m (rising to £4m) he's been. Perhaps he should have listened to his manager and advisers.
Other things of interest - is the average League One player salary really £2k a week? That's about twice what I would have instinctively expected it to be.
And while I can understand not showing the ruck at Wycombe, if you're going to make Luke O'Nien one of your lead characters (understandable given he oozes charisma and charm), why not show the fight with the Portsmouth fan in the play-off semis (unless there are legal proceedings ongoing?)
Shame there wasn't more from the football side - I'm amazed Duncan Watmore hasn't featured in either series as one of the club's more cerebral players. They could have done with more candid scenes from the clubhouse and physio room, like last season. Also, nowhere near enough of the Mackem characters, like those two chefs. But then, when you've got real life The Office characters like Stewart and Charlie giving you full access to themselves, I guess you seize the opportunity with both hands.
(*) Until the scene where Charlie was wearing red trousers, bright blue poloshirt and light grey sweater. Seriously, WTF?
Yes @aloysius I thought it could do with a bit more football. (Spoiler alert) Though the Maja/Grigg episode was quite entertaining...they cut it so much like the Grabban ('let's hope we don't lose him') saga in the last season, you sort of knew where it was going. I'm amazed they they could not have managed a decent loan (perhaps lost in the edit?) rather than over paying for Grigg. Just shows again what a gem we have in Gareth.
Watching that Oxford simpleton getting played like a fiddle over the Will Grigg transfer was enormously entertaining
5 goals in 38 games since!!!
Magnificent scenes
When both the manager and head of recruitment both said that's as high as he should go it was a bizarre decision. To be saying we haven't got the money and then finding the money ditto.
Just finished watching, have a level of sympathy for the two at the top probably solely based on the comparison with Wycombe. When you are spending and losing money at almost record rates and you've got a marketing department that's probably got more staff than our entire club and you've got departments that aren't paying their way or particularly enthusiastic you'd think there'd be a bit more realism about what that means for their jobs long term. Although the car park shot is in bad taste and I doubt it's all down to one person.
Luke comes across as a credit to himself and the game as he always has and it's difficult to not feel some sympathy for the fans they featured if not some that visited AP and make noise on twitter.
In the last season they left themselves in the brown stuff by not getting a replacement striker in the window and it seemed obvious there was a good chance that Maja would go but there seemed to be almost no mention of trying earlier to get players or looking at anyone othher than Grigg late on, and Hill doesn't come over well at all.
Had to smile at the radio host introducing deadline day as one of the favourite days in the football calendar except for the people who hate it, or words to that effect.
If they actually got to break even btw as they claimed at the end then that is some achievement, or sales lie. Quite how badly they've done so far this season though is difficult to fathom.
For what it's worth as we stand we are level on points having played two games less on a fraction of their budget. Well done Gaz and Dobbo, again.
I seem to have a memory of being sat near an incredibly angry Richard Hill at Readings old ground on the day Gregory went to Villa. We were playing them in the B&B Cup (??). He walked out the ground long before the game ended.
Is that something that could have happened?
I'm sure we played Bristol Rovers away the day Gregory left for Villa
@eric_plant Yes, we did. Gregory was in the dugout, but the rumours on the terrace were that he was going to Villa in the morning.
My memory is from the day Gregory went. We played at Elm Park in Reading. Might have been a reserve or B&B game. Richard Hill was a very angry man.
The Bristol Rovers game was the night before.
Funny how your memory plays tricks. I remember being in the car chatting to my mate about who we would get to replace Gregory. Even remember something on the radio about it.
It must have been the speculation we were discussing rather than the actual event
Just thinking how Gregory went from Wycombe averageness to the top division only 12 years ago and made a decent fist of it and now people seem content to explain to all how big a leap it would be for Ainsworth to manage at even a second tier level.
That night at Reading was a surreal one in my memory. I think the main reason I went was to pick up on any gossip as I think Hill thought he was in the running to take over. His mood was based on him not getting the caretaker job on top of not being taken to Villa by Gregory.
Or maybe it never happened at all.
Try 22 years ago.
A totally different era.
Whilst I would completely agree with @aloysius comments regarding a disruptive style of management being useful to break up complacency, etc, I would say that there are better ways of going about it. Personally, I thought that Charlie M came across as a ‘Grade A’ wanker and a bully with significant anger management issues.
Watching Donald being completely played by Wigan over the Grigg transfer, whilst letting himself be filmed (!!!) was indeed hilarious and made even better with the subsequent knowledge of how it worked out. The Wigan board must have watched that scene a 100 times by now and still find it funny.
Finished Season 2 last night.
What become pretty obvious was that following the Checkatrade final Jack Ross was a deadman walking in that job
It also showed just why GA turned them down. A mess top to bottom with many differnet people all pulling things in their own direction. The exact opposite to Wycombe.
I also wouldn't be surprised if it ever came out that Luke O'Nein told him not to touch the club as it was a basket case
Do you genuinely believe Ainsworth actually turned it down?
He said in a recent interview - think it was the BT Sport thing - that he's turned down well-documented offers this season. Can't remember the exact quote, but the meaning was clear.
Yes. Absolutely
Brace yourselves - Series 3 has launched on Netflix today. Featuring us as the "happy ending".
Only just seen this thread, sorry for posting at length under ‘documentaries’ thread. Luke O’Nein features heavily in episode one.
Don't think I could bring myself to revisit that one.
If there's one thing that didn't need a third season, it's Sunderland Til I Die.
I have never even watched a single "highlight" from that day.
Me too @shev although I’ve mentally replayed Stockdale swerving out the way of their first goal a fair few times.
It's hard to think about - the idea that Bayo's career could have been given the send off of getting back to the Championship at Wembley still hurts.