Definitely a point that needs a bit more digging, his main gig seems to be a tech payment platform but isn't entirely clear if he invests directly too, one possibility is that it's someone completely different with the same name.
I thought the point was that Kazakh money is unlikely to be clean money, and nor are billionaires Georgian or otherwise above suspicion. I commend Tom Burgis 'Kleptopia' for details on the former.
A condition of giving away for peanuts a significant percentage of the Trusts ownership of the club was that the Trust wouldn't be required to match future investment to retain it's (new lower) 10% ownership.
Nope, a condition was that the trust wouldn't need to match couhig cash calls or investment in ongoing running costs, there was a good old section on how the Couhigs and the trust would need to work together in future to secure funds for major projects for anyone still listening at that point.
Given news has been in the public domain for over 24 hours, company house, Price of football , COTN twitter etc, can you please give us an update on a deed signed on the 28th September regarding Mr Lomtadze?
The email sent at 3 p.m yesterday indicates that nobody knew about the first fixed charge.
If an update on toilets is deemed newsworthy then surely this is too?
If the Trust want to remain relevant now is a good time.
Weird cloudy arrangements with exotic unknowns possibly still preferable to Reading where William Storey , the lunatic with several failed F1 and football attempts and seemingly no money (suggestion he couldn't pay for a 5 a side game let alone a club) is being entertained along with the guy who wouldn't put money into Wigan when his uncle owned them.
Given the Trust retain ownership of Adams Park through FALL it could be argued they are not only relevant but integral to the future existence of WWFC.
As minority shareholders, with a presence on the board and as owners of the ground needed by any new owner you'd hope they had some relevance, insight and even leverage,why else are they on the board? will be NDA central and RC won't want too much out there but for the trust to continue to attract any funding, volunteers and goodwill they might need to demonstrate going forward how they are fighting for fans interests and the good of the club.
The problem is that Wycombe fans have demonstrated, at every opportunity, that they don't care about 'fans interests.' The relevance or otherwise of the Trust is really not up to them, it's up to whether more Wycombe fans want to take long term responsibility for their club.
The Trust have done very well overall, in my book. I am going to guess there are reasons they can't simply blurt out everything that is going on behind the scenes right now, or keep us updated in a news ticker style format.
I don't entirely disagree, if there's transfer money it'll get a nod regardless, but It will be what people want it to be, people need to ask questions and demand answers to apply any pressure. Plenty gets said on here or social media but doesn't always get through to meetings.
@Shev there will definitely be commercial sensitivity, nda's etc , in my opinion the 75-90 decision was one where our guardians of the quarter could have consulted more.
There is no change in the ownership of the football club, Feliciana owns 90% and the Trust owns 10%. The funding of the football club is the responsibility of Feliciana and not that of the Trust, as per the investment agreement that was signed in April.
All of the above can be confirmed by reading the document filed at Companies House, nothing new there.
But the unanswered questions are, how much has been borrowed, and for what purpose? Are we going on a spending spree in January to try and secure promotion? And how will the loan be repaid if that fails?
Could be if it's a bridging loan until something else happens in the future. If it isn't then what they intend to spend it on is pretty big, how they ever intend to repay it, or at least service the debt is bigger.
on the face of it, Feliciana have borrowed money from Lomtadze personally. We don’t know how much (but given the legal costs of setting up the charge unlikely to be insignificant) or what Feliciana have or intend to do with the money. No obligation to lend it on to the football club.
the charge means that if Feliciana doesn’t pay back the loan when it falls due (we don’t know when that is), Lomtadze is entitled to take possession of its assets. It’s only asset is it’s shares in the football club meaning Lomtadze becomes our owner.
conspiracy theory I know but could this be an ingenious way to get round the EFL suitable owner tests as strictly speaking he will have become owner not by acquisition but by loan default.
So Feliciana have taken out this loan but who has been given the responsibility of this debt? Is this with Rob or is this now going to be seen on the club's finance sheet? If Rob was to default on the loan, does it not make the ownership model become confusing?
Will the details come out in the AGM when they could/should show some of the finances?
Let's just hope it's with Rob but he is looking at permanent deals for Taylor, Potts & Boyes in January!
I don't think so Dev, he'd be subject to the owners and directors test on taking a significant interest, by default or standard purchase, and if he was deemed unsuitable (nothing I've read so far suggests he is btw) could be banned from any involvement, this has happened a few times and becomes very messy as the new owner then has to rush round finding an acceptable front or selling it on again. Although is him having lots of money and being in situ something the EFL take into consideration? Maybe.
The trust have just sent an email @Otter87 , they see it as positive investment, it does in my mind probably further dilute the trust's influence (if not their ownership share) we have no idea how much this guy is paying and what his intentions are but it seems unlikely he'll be happy to merely be at the table with Rob and nod along.
Investment to me means a stake and hence ownership of a certain percentage. This is the start of Couhig withdrawing. Rob will obviously give this a positive spin but he wants out and as said as much previously, so no surprise really. Hopefully the new investor is serious about ultimately owning the club. We can simply hope for the best.
It does feel that we may be heading towards this guy being our owner. On one hand his probity will have been checked out by the Stock Exchange before allowing his company to list , on the other hand it’s pretty hard to become mega rich in Georgia or Kazakhstan without some pretty dodgy deals. If his reported wealth is true, seems he would be able if he wished to spend much more on the club than Couhigs could.
Hypothetical question.
would you prefer WW to be operating in the Championship funded by a ultra rich guy from countries bordering Russia with question marks over source of his wealth
or
Operating in Lg2 funded by a guy born in HW who has made his money owning a local business
There has been a certain amount of comment on the recent investment into Feliciana EFL Ltd, so I wanted to let you know the Trust position on this. Rob Couhig is aware that the Trust is making this statement
“ As you may be aware a debenture was registered at Companies House by Mikheil Lomtadze in respect of Feliciana EFL Ltd. This is an investment by Mikheil Lomtadze in Feliciana EFL Ltd and the Trust is not involved in this agreement. There is no change in the ownership of the football club, Feliciana EFL Ltd owns 90% and the Trust owns 10%. The funding of the football club is the responsibility of Feliciana EFL Ltd and not that of the Trust, as per the investment agreement that we signed in April this year. The Trust believes that this investment will be good news for the Club in the future.”
I think that new investors getting involved is a sign of the strength of the Club and its potential for the future.
Comments
Definitely a point that needs a bit more digging, his main gig seems to be a tech payment platform but isn't entirely clear if he invests directly too, one possibility is that it's someone completely different with the same name.
It's not quite that extreme. They're trying to strengthen ties, but most countries aren't particularly keen on one that invaded them!
I thought the point was that Kazakh money is unlikely to be clean money, and nor are billionaires Georgian or otherwise above suspicion. I commend Tom Burgis 'Kleptopia' for details on the former.
A condition of giving away for peanuts a significant percentage of the Trusts ownership of the club was that the Trust wouldn't be required to match future investment to retain it's (new lower) 10% ownership.
Nope, a condition was that the trust wouldn't need to match couhig cash calls or investment in ongoing running costs, there was a good old section on how the Couhigs and the trust would need to work together in future to secure funds for major projects for anyone still listening at that point.
After a few weeks of pleasant balmy days and evenings this feels like the sudden coldest of frosts.
I stand corrected, thx for explaining.
Ditto
At least the Captain Tom Foundation hasn’t invested (yet).
Swan burgers 😂
F.A.O NIGEL KINGSTON AND TRUST BOARD
Given news has been in the public domain for over 24 hours, company house, Price of football , COTN twitter etc, can you please give us an update on a deed signed on the 28th September regarding Mr Lomtadze?
The email sent at 3 p.m yesterday indicates that nobody knew about the first fixed charge.
If an update on toilets is deemed newsworthy then surely this is too?
If the Trust want to remain relevant now is a good time.
Why do you think the Trust can be relevant now?
Weird cloudy arrangements with exotic unknowns possibly still preferable to Reading where William Storey , the lunatic with several failed F1 and football attempts and seemingly no money (suggestion he couldn't pay for a 5 a side game let alone a club) is being entertained along with the guy who wouldn't put money into Wigan when his uncle owned them.
Given the Trust retain ownership of Adams Park through FALL it could be argued they are not only relevant but integral to the future existence of WWFC.
As minority shareholders, with a presence on the board and as owners of the ground needed by any new owner you'd hope they had some relevance, insight and even leverage,why else are they on the board? will be NDA central and RC won't want too much out there but for the trust to continue to attract any funding, volunteers and goodwill they might need to demonstrate going forward how they are fighting for fans interests and the good of the club.
The problem is that Wycombe fans have demonstrated, at every opportunity, that they don't care about 'fans interests.' The relevance or otherwise of the Trust is really not up to them, it's up to whether more Wycombe fans want to take long term responsibility for their club.
The Trust have done very well overall, in my book. I am going to guess there are reasons they can't simply blurt out everything that is going on behind the scenes right now, or keep us updated in a news ticker style format.
I don't entirely disagree, if there's transfer money it'll get a nod regardless, but It will be what people want it to be, people need to ask questions and demand answers to apply any pressure. Plenty gets said on here or social media but doesn't always get through to meetings.
@Shev there will definitely be commercial sensitivity, nda's etc , in my opinion the 75-90 decision was one where our guardians of the quarter could have consulted more.
Alan Cecil has posted on Facebook:
It is a loan to Feliciana.
There is no change in the ownership of the football club, Feliciana owns 90% and the Trust owns 10%. The funding of the football club is the responsibility of Feliciana and not that of the Trust, as per the investment agreement that was signed in April.
All of the above can be confirmed by reading the document filed at Companies House, nothing new there.
But the unanswered questions are, how much has been borrowed, and for what purpose? Are we going on a spending spree in January to try and secure promotion? And how will the loan be repaid if that fails?
I think the bigger unanswered question is are they trying to sell the club to this bloke isn't it?
Could be if it's a bridging loan until something else happens in the future. If it isn't then what they intend to spend it on is pretty big, how they ever intend to repay it, or at least service the debt is bigger.
on the face of it, Feliciana have borrowed money from Lomtadze personally. We don’t know how much (but given the legal costs of setting up the charge unlikely to be insignificant) or what Feliciana have or intend to do with the money. No obligation to lend it on to the football club.
the charge means that if Feliciana doesn’t pay back the loan when it falls due (we don’t know when that is), Lomtadze is entitled to take possession of its assets. It’s only asset is it’s shares in the football club meaning Lomtadze becomes our owner.
conspiracy theory I know but could this be an ingenious way to get round the EFL suitable owner tests as strictly speaking he will have become owner not by acquisition but by loan default.
So Feliciana have taken out this loan but who has been given the responsibility of this debt? Is this with Rob or is this now going to be seen on the club's finance sheet? If Rob was to default on the loan, does it not make the ownership model become confusing?
Will the details come out in the AGM when they could/should show some of the finances?
Let's just hope it's with Rob but he is looking at permanent deals for Taylor, Potts & Boyes in January!
I’ve just received an email from the trust on this - wording is similar to what was shared from the Facebook post above.
I don't think so Dev, he'd be subject to the owners and directors test on taking a significant interest, by default or standard purchase, and if he was deemed unsuitable (nothing I've read so far suggests he is btw) could be banned from any involvement, this has happened a few times and becomes very messy as the new owner then has to rush round finding an acceptable front or selling it on again. Although is him having lots of money and being in situ something the EFL take into consideration? Maybe.
The trust have just sent an email @Otter87 , they see it as positive investment, it does in my mind probably further dilute the trust's influence (if not their ownership share) we have no idea how much this guy is paying and what his intentions are but it seems unlikely he'll be happy to merely be at the table with Rob and nod along.
Investment to me means a stake and hence ownership of a certain percentage. This is the start of Couhig withdrawing. Rob will obviously give this a positive spin but he wants out and as said as much previously, so no surprise really. Hopefully the new investor is serious about ultimately owning the club. We can simply hope for the best.
It does feel that we may be heading towards this guy being our owner. On one hand his probity will have been checked out by the Stock Exchange before allowing his company to list , on the other hand it’s pretty hard to become mega rich in Georgia or Kazakhstan without some pretty dodgy deals. If his reported wealth is true, seems he would be able if he wished to spend much more on the club than Couhigs could.
Hypothetical question.
would you prefer WW to be operating in the Championship funded by a ultra rich guy from countries bordering Russia with question marks over source of his wealth
or
Operating in Lg2 funded by a guy born in HW who has made his money owning a local business
Trust Update on Feliciana EFL Ltd
There has been a certain amount of comment on the recent investment into Feliciana EFL Ltd, so I wanted to let you know the Trust position on this. Rob Couhig is aware that the Trust is making this statement
“ As you may be aware a debenture was registered at Companies House by Mikheil Lomtadze in respect of Feliciana EFL Ltd. This is an investment by Mikheil Lomtadze in Feliciana EFL Ltd and the Trust is not involved in this agreement. There is no change in the ownership of the football club, Feliciana EFL Ltd owns 90% and the Trust owns 10%. The funding of the football club is the responsibility of Feliciana EFL Ltd and not that of the Trust, as per the investment agreement that we signed in April this year. The Trust believes that this investment will be good news for the Club in the future.”
I think that new investors getting involved is a sign of the strength of the Club and its potential for the future.
Regards
Nigel
Nigel Kingston
Chair WWT
Wycombe Wanderers Trust - the voice of the fans.
The potential for the future includes paying money to a Georgian billionaire! Just what football has turned into!