Ainsworth is probably busy adding as many add-ons as he can, to get around FFP! It would be a massive achievement if he keeps them up next season. Big Chris will obviously be confident in his own ability but if Gaz gets sacked early into the campaign, he may find that he regrets the move rather quickly. I’m genuinely not convinced QPR would be a good move for him.
Except I can find no mention of GKs not counting towards the squad size limit.
Here's what I found -specifically refers to 2020/21 season but I couldn't find anything else.
Clubs in League One shall be permitted to name up to a maximum 22 Players, of which a minimum of 8 must be a Home Grown Player.
Under 21 players do not need to be named on the Squad List to be eligible to participate in a League Match. For Season 2020/21 Under 21 players will have been born on or after 1 January 1999.
* Home Grown
A "Home-Grown Player" means a player who, irrespective of nationality or age, has been registered with any club affiliated to The Football Association or the Football Association of Wales for a period, continuous or not, of three entire seasons, or 36 months, before his 21st birthday (or the end of the season during which he turns 21).
Forino is developing into a good player at League 1 level but is likely to make mistakes in games. Is he ready for Championship level? Ainsworth needs results immediately , so this seems a gamble.
44.9.2 The following Players do not need to be included in the Squad List to be eligible to play in League Matches:
(a) in respect of Championship Clubs, any Under 21 Player (save for any Under 21 Player who is registered with the Club on a Temporary Loan Transfer); and
(b) in respect of League One Clubs and League Two Clubs:
So do loanees count towards the squad limit or not? I'd read that as in lg1 no need to include GKs or under 21s, but they don't say no need to include loanees.
I can definitely see both sides on this. Either way, GA is clearly backing himself to keep the job and develop Chris into a 10-20 million pound defender, getting him on the cheap now.
If Forino does leave (which looks likely), it’s another success story for the development squad. Let’s not forget we need regular sales like this to operate sustainably.
However - whilst I think he has that potential, I really don’t think Chris is Championship level yet, and as others have commented, if Ainsworth is gone fairly swiftly, that could leave Chris in a really awkward position.
That said, both Chris and Gareth have defied the odds in their careers so far, so I hope it works out for both of them.
As others have said, I’ve enjoyed watching Chris develop and feels it’s a shame we’ve not watched him take the next step up in his game. Bear no ill feeling towards him trying to move and goes with my best wishes, but I hope we get a sizeable fee and can use some of it to really add to the development squad in terms of personnel and in terms of their fixture programme. Sell on clause feels like a must too if he does leave.
I think Forino has all the attributes to be a top, and even Premier League, defender. Two factors. Fitness, he’s struggled. Time, if he gets thrown into a team that has expectations and they struggle I suspect the learning will be stunted. When he played alongside Alfie it was like a Rolls Royce and younger Rolls Royce.
Not much to go on with Ward, but at Ipswich, where he came on with a few minutes to go, he immediately made a canny McGavin/Beavon type run into the Tractor Boys' penalty area. Not much, you might think, but given that we had made literally no impression on their defence since the first quarter of the game, it was a really notable moment of subtlety and maturity at the time.
So, I'm not in an @perfidious_albion type "England player for sure" place, but I am really keen to see him get some proper game time.
I'm slightly concerned that Low's squad number hasn't been announced yet. He was wearing 4 against Arsenal U21s but the shirt numbers in that game appeared to be a mix of players' actual numbers and numbers being allocated just for the game. Scowen, who didn't play, has already been given 4 for this season. Are we waiting for Forino's departure to give him Number 5?
Yeah I'm also really hoping we get to see a bit more of Ward this season. I'd rather him be around the team here getting a few games if injuries happen, or getting a regular spot on the bench and coming on for some game time than him getting sent out on loan.
If Forino does go, then I sincerely hope we do not give him away just because GA is their manager. I feel he is easily worth £350K but as is the norm, we will never know what the final sale price will be.
To be honest I feel that £350K would be a good deal, especially if we can spend that money strengthening the squad.
I really like Forino but with all the injuries, I feel such a move will only allow us to replace him with Low and add even more to the squad.
Comments
Ainsworth is probably busy adding as many add-ons as he can, to get around FFP! It would be a massive achievement if he keeps them up next season. Big Chris will obviously be confident in his own ability but if Gaz gets sacked early into the campaign, he may find that he regrets the move rather quickly. I’m genuinely not convinced QPR would be a good move for him.
If Forino does leave, we could have quite an interesting 'guess the opening day 11' competition.
Current state of the squad, to the best of my knowledge. Room for five more outfield players over 21. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1yNdy4nwkLKHSp2rOFOVAovRDlmfJo8Cw/edit?usp=sharing&ouid=118045773420542020310&rtpof=true&sd=true
If the squad size is 22 +GK, as I infer from your spreadsheet @ReturnToSenda, then surely there's only 4 spaces?
Or are you assuming Forino is going to QPR?
Nah, you're right - I had Breckin as exempt before being reminded loanees count towards the cap regardless of age.
Ah, okay.
Not in Lg1 @ReturnToSenda
Ugh, right, I've triple checked it this time. As you were! 5 spaces left
Erm ....
Except I can find no mention of GKs not counting towards the squad size limit.
Here's what I found -specifically refers to 2020/21 season but I couldn't find anything else.
Clubs in League One shall be permitted to name up to a maximum 22 Players, of which a minimum of 8 must be a Home Grown Player.
Under 21 players do not need to be named on the Squad List to be eligible to participate in a League Match. For Season 2020/21 Under 21 players will have been born on or after 1 January 1999.
* Home Grown
A "Home-Grown Player" means a player who, irrespective of nationality or age, has been registered with any club affiliated to The Football Association or the Football Association of Wales for a period, continuous or not, of three entire seasons, or 36 months, before his 21st birthday (or the end of the season during which he turns 21).
@ReturnToSenda
Forino is developing into a good player at League 1 level but is likely to make mistakes in games. Is he ready for Championship level? Ainsworth needs results immediately , so this seems a gamble.
@Twizz
44.9.2 The following Players do not need to be included in the Squad List to be eligible to play in League Matches:
(a) in respect of Championship Clubs, any Under 21 Player (save for any Under 21 Player who is registered with the Club on a Temporary Loan Transfer); and
(b) in respect of League One Clubs and League Two Clubs:
(i) any Under 21 Players; and
(ii) goalkeepers.
So do loanees count towards the squad limit or not? I'd read that as in lg1 no need to include GKs or under 21s, but they don't say no need to include loanees.
If they’re under 21 (or a goalkeeper) they fall under the exception of 44.9.2 b) i, and therefore don’t need to be included in the squad list.
If they’re over 21 they have to be included.
I think we agree then @Chris, it's @DevC and @ReturnToSenda who think loanees don't count towards the squad limit.
.
I've confused myself now, so don't worry. I believe your spreadsheet is currently correct. Good work @ReturnToSenda
In the Championship, all loan players count towards the limit; in Leagues One and Two, they only count if over 21.
They better fill those vacant squad places now we've sorted it out for MB and the recruitment team. 😁
I can definitely see both sides on this. Either way, GA is clearly backing himself to keep the job and develop Chris into a 10-20 million pound defender, getting him on the cheap now.
If Forino does leave (which looks likely), it’s another success story for the development squad. Let’s not forget we need regular sales like this to operate sustainably.
However - whilst I think he has that potential, I really don’t think Chris is Championship level yet, and as others have commented, if Ainsworth is gone fairly swiftly, that could leave Chris in a really awkward position.
That said, both Chris and Gareth have defied the odds in their careers so far, so I hope it works out for both of them.
As others have said, I’ve enjoyed watching Chris develop and feels it’s a shame we’ve not watched him take the next step up in his game. Bear no ill feeling towards him trying to move and goes with my best wishes, but I hope we get a sizeable fee and can use some of it to really add to the development squad in terms of personnel and in terms of their fixture programme. Sell on clause feels like a must too if he does leave.
I think Forino has all the attributes to be a top, and even Premier League, defender. Two factors. Fitness, he’s struggled. Time, if he gets thrown into a team that has expectations and they struggle I suspect the learning will be stunted. When he played alongside Alfie it was like a Rolls Royce and younger Rolls Royce.
I think GA would be looking towards developing Chris into a championship player, who knows how long that takes.
The transfer fee not likely to be much above 300K in my opinion, hopefully with plenty of add ons and obviously a big potential sell on clause.
Good luck to him
Not much to go on with Ward, but at Ipswich, where he came on with a few minutes to go, he immediately made a canny McGavin/Beavon type run into the Tractor Boys' penalty area. Not much, you might think, but given that we had made literally no impression on their defence since the first quarter of the game, it was a really notable moment of subtlety and maturity at the time.
So, I'm not in an @perfidious_albion type "England player for sure" place, but I am really keen to see him get some proper game time.
I'm slightly concerned that Low's squad number hasn't been announced yet. He was wearing 4 against Arsenal U21s but the shirt numbers in that game appeared to be a mix of players' actual numbers and numbers being allocated just for the game. Scowen, who didn't play, has already been given 4 for this season. Are we waiting for Forino's departure to give him Number 5?
Yeah I'm also really hoping we get to see a bit more of Ward this season. I'd rather him be around the team here getting a few games if injuries happen, or getting a regular spot on the bench and coming on for some game time than him getting sent out on loan.
Would probably say the same for Pattenden.
I'm hoping the management have done the sums so I don't have to.
If Forino does go, then I sincerely hope we do not give him away just because GA is their manager. I feel he is easily worth £350K but as is the norm, we will never know what the final sale price will be.
To be honest I feel that £350K would be a good deal, especially if we can spend that money strengthening the squad.
I really like Forino but with all the injuries, I feel such a move will only allow us to replace him with Low and add even more to the squad.
Mind you I cannot see how QPR can afford to pay a fee with all the financial restrictions that dodgy club are under.
Even with the restrictions I think 350k is peanuts to them.