An old head in the dressing room might usually be considered a good thing, but when that old head goes out on the piss with younger teammates and then lets them drive, and gets in the car with them, that's really not the sort of old head I want in the Wycombe dressing room. That's a piece of shit.
@ReturnToSenda he's signed for three other teams since then...I'm not sure any of us were up in arms about it. Perhaps I missed it.
@drcongo I get where you are coming from and the three idiots were very lucky no-one was killed but I assume MB will have taken all of that into account and must believe him to be a reformed character. Tricky tightrope I know.
I strongly recommend that people referring to the drunk driving incident four years ago should read the Guardian article (to which @PBo provided a link on page 30 of the Rumour Mill thread) before making judgements. The circumstances immediately before and for a substantial period afterwords are clearly set out In Richard Keogh’s own words.
It brings it back now that Derby were an absolute disgrace. Trying to sack the expensive old guy who wasn't actually driving, but protecting the value in the actual pair who were criminal.
I think he's a great signing - unless he's intended as a 46 game starter which I'm sure he isn't. After all Matt himself was kept on as an influence in training and off-the-field so surely he sees the value in this. In fact, I think Keogh will help get other signings through the door.
Indeed. He says he thought the driver was sober. If that’s true then he was unlucky. You might say he should have noticed the driver wasn’t but if he’d been drinking himself, somewhat easier to miss.
I’m fairly big on redemption and second chances and learning from our mistakes. Lord knows I’ve made some fucking huge ones myself. If he spends time helping young players see the risks of access to big money, fast cars and booze then he deserves that second chance. Let’s see what he brings us.
I’ve read both articles and I feel no different about this. I’m sure it’s much easier to be big on redemption for those who’ve never lost someone they care about to a drunk driver.
Yeah. And Richard Keogh also nearly lost his life or at the very least his career to a drink driver.
have you ever thought he might have been more the victim than the wrong do-er in this situation. He didn’t egg his team mate on. He didn’t pull rank and demand the guy drove him home.
He jumped in a car with 3 team mates looking for a lift home and you’re acting like he was pouring the beer down his throat. Your attitude is flirting with victim blaming.
But he wasn’t a drunk driver. If there’s evidence he knew the driver was drunk and failed to stop him driving or asked him to drive it of course becomes a different matter.
As for redemption post appropriate punishment, I do believe it is possible and can be shown through action and behavioural change.
Drink driving is the absolute pits. If we'd signed one of the drink drivers, I'd feel pretty disgusted and no doubt would be arguing with the "he's served his time, is entitled to resume his career" type threads.
Keogh wasn't a drink driver.
I'm sure at the time it all broke there was the implication that Keogh as captain had been the chief ring leader in the debauchery, and knew exactly what was going on.
The article suggests that wasn't the case at all, and he was just a fuzzy headed drinker taking what looked like an obvious lift home amongst trusted team mates.
We'll never know for 100% which of the above 2 scenarios are true, but I'm hopeful the second one is. Which changes the story quite a bit I think.
I think he probably knew the driver was over the limit. He's not stupid.
We have ALL made silly mistakes and ALL made decisions we now cringe about and regret.
I'm not going to judge a fellow man on one massively highlighted poor judgement in the moment.
I think if we were all so closely monitored and judged on poor choices made throughout our life times.... we would all be extremely ashamed and embarrassed.
Any responsible person would know/ask the driver if he was over the limit. Guess we have to take his word for it. The fact that his team "mate" fled the scene and left him for dead is sad but says it all about the type of people he was socialising with that night. Putting their careers before the life of friend. Scumbags.
Its very easy to sit back and judge. I think at least 30% of those on here have knowingly driven over the limit at one time in there life at least. Especially knowing the age demographic on here. The law wasn't as tough in the 70s and 80s.. things were let slip.
None of us would probably (hopefully) do it now.... but I think alot of people who get on their high horse about him getting in a car with someone over the limit... may well be being hypocritical 🤔
Comments
You can't stand in a players way apparently so I'd settle for £1.9m, two youth teamers on loan and Dobbo back.
Has anyone checked Wikipedia yet to see if Forino is referenced as a QPR player?
Yep, good deal.
An old head in the dressing room might usually be considered a good thing, but when that old head goes out on the piss with younger teammates and then lets them drive, and gets in the car with them, that's really not the sort of old head I want in the Wycombe dressing room. That's a piece of shit.
I can't help but think our fans wouldn't keep quite so quiet about that incident had he signed for, say, Bristol Rovers.
He’s already modelling the new away strip.
@ReturnToSenda he's signed for three other teams since then...I'm not sure any of us were up in arms about it. Perhaps I missed it.
@drcongo I get where you are coming from and the three idiots were very lucky no-one was killed but I assume MB will have taken all of that into account and must believe him to be a reformed character. Tricky tightrope I know.
Excellent spot.
Could we piece together a full starting 11 with their Muppet look alikes?
Animal as Mad Max?
2.5m for one of our players?
How much would our club actually go for? Serious question.
About £2.5M
I think we should all give Richard a chance. Yes he made a stupid and very reckless error but he has expressed his regrets on numerous occasions.
I for one will give the guy a chance and I hope he does a good job for us this season.
Welcome Richard and I hope you enjoy your second spell at AP.
I strongly recommend that people referring to the drunk driving incident four years ago should read the Guardian article (to which @PBo provided a link on page 30 of the Rumour Mill thread) before making judgements. The circumstances immediately before and for a substantial period afterwords are clearly set out In Richard Keogh’s own words.
.
Neither has Forino
This is a good article on it.
It brings it back now that Derby were an absolute disgrace. Trying to sack the expensive old guy who wasn't actually driving, but protecting the value in the actual pair who were criminal.
https://fanbanter.co.uk/richard-keogh-opens-up-on-car-crash-torment-that-got-him-sacked-by-derby/
I think he's a great signing - unless he's intended as a 46 game starter which I'm sure he isn't. After all Matt himself was kept on as an influence in training and off-the-field so surely he sees the value in this. In fact, I think Keogh will help get other signings through the door.
What an absolute disgrace as you say. Terrible for the lad and his strength and that of his family to get through all that was absolutely amazing.
Must admit my first recollection was that as captain he should have known better etc.
But reading that, and we have to take some of it at face value, it changes the narrative quite a bit.
Agreed.
Indeed. He says he thought the driver was sober. If that’s true then he was unlucky. You might say he should have noticed the driver wasn’t but if he’d been drinking himself, somewhat easier to miss.
I’m fairly big on redemption and second chances and learning from our mistakes. Lord knows I’ve made some fucking huge ones myself. If he spends time helping young players see the risks of access to big money, fast cars and booze then he deserves that second chance. Let’s see what he brings us.
Great article, cheers @Malone - and the only thing in your initial post that was not new to me is that Derby are a disgrace!
I think a few of those behind the more negative posts on him should definitely have a little read of that article. Might change their mind a bit!
I’ve read both articles and I feel no different about this. I’m sure it’s much easier to be big on redemption for those who’ve never lost someone they care about to a drunk driver.
Yeah. And Richard Keogh also nearly lost his life or at the very least his career to a drink driver.
have you ever thought he might have been more the victim than the wrong do-er in this situation. He didn’t egg his team mate on. He didn’t pull rank and demand the guy drove him home.
He jumped in a car with 3 team mates looking for a lift home and you’re acting like he was pouring the beer down his throat. Your attitude is flirting with victim blaming.
But he wasn’t a drunk driver. If there’s evidence he knew the driver was drunk and failed to stop him driving or asked him to drive it of course becomes a different matter.
As for redemption post appropriate punishment, I do believe it is possible and can be shown through action and behavioural change.
Drink driving is the absolute pits. If we'd signed one of the drink drivers, I'd feel pretty disgusted and no doubt would be arguing with the "he's served his time, is entitled to resume his career" type threads.
Keogh wasn't a drink driver.
I'm sure at the time it all broke there was the implication that Keogh as captain had been the chief ring leader in the debauchery, and knew exactly what was going on.
The article suggests that wasn't the case at all, and he was just a fuzzy headed drinker taking what looked like an obvious lift home amongst trusted team mates.
We'll never know for 100% which of the above 2 scenarios are true, but I'm hopeful the second one is. Which changes the story quite a bit I think.
I think he probably knew the driver was over the limit. He's not stupid.
We have ALL made silly mistakes and ALL made decisions we now cringe about and regret.
I'm not going to judge a fellow man on one massively highlighted poor judgement in the moment.
I think if we were all so closely monitored and judged on poor choices made throughout our life times.... we would all be extremely ashamed and embarrassed.
Any responsible person would know/ask the driver if he was over the limit. Guess we have to take his word for it. The fact that his team "mate" fled the scene and left him for dead is sad but says it all about the type of people he was socialising with that night. Putting their careers before the life of friend. Scumbags.
Its very easy to sit back and judge. I think at least 30% of those on here have knowingly driven over the limit at one time in there life at least. Especially knowing the age demographic on here. The law wasn't as tough in the 70s and 80s.. things were let slip.
None of us would probably (hopefully) do it now.... but I think alot of people who get on their high horse about him getting in a car with someone over the limit... may well be being hypocritical 🤔