Bayo in the air lost more than he has since his return. When he did get it down he held it too long or got the ball caught up. Just wasn’t his game. Not a drama. Just not his game. Plan A is somewhere sick again Bayo was always plan B
Mehmeti is definitely an unlocker, but it'll be a little while yet before he's established. Him developing a telepathy with Kashket could be key to playing a different way, but again that feels like a longer-term project.
@aloysius said:
I think Gareth has learned now that being sentimental is not the way to win in the Championship. Bloomfield and Charles started the season but I can't see either now being called upon unless there's an injury crisis (interesting to hear from Phil that Bloomfield is now considered part of the coaching set up). Perhaps it's time to accept that Bayo is not the answer in this division either. Balls just don't stick to him anymore and while his game was never reliant on pace, the way we're playing is.
Haven’t we literally lost every game when Akinfenwa didn’t start, and not lost a single game where he has?
McCleary Horgan and Wheeler have goals in them but need to hit shots when they have the chance. Too many times we took one too many touches against an inexperienced ‘keeper. Just another example of the difference in league 1 v championship
@Chris said:
Haven’t we literally lost every game when Akinfenwa didn’t start, and not lost a single game where he has?
Akinfenwa is a combination of player and team mascot. Not many of those about. I suppose Rooney at Derby was supposed to fill a similar role but that's gone a bit wrong.
@chairboyscentral - I agree we need to offload players who have no chance of playing. i would add Pattison to your list. We are becoming more competitive but we do need a couple of extra players in who would challenge for the starting eleven. The 4 listed are no where need the team.
@davecz said: @chairboyscentral - I agree we need to offload players who have no chance of playing. i would add Pattison to your list. We are becoming more competitive but we do need a couple of extra players in who would challenge for the starting eleven. The 4 listed are no where need the team.
Pattison is an awkward one - needs game time and isn't really Championship standard, but we sometimes play a midfield three and that would only leave us with Blooms, who won't be going anywhere, aside from the 'big three'.
It suprises me when people say we need a creative midfielder. I don’t think it’s a question of personnel I think it’s more about tactics and the way we play. I think Horgan, McCleary, Wheeler, Mehmeti could all play in the number 10 role and be creative. But that’s not the way we play. We often bypass the midfield and get the ball into the box as quick as we can. Additionally by forcing everything into the box we condense the spaces in behind for through balls.
Yes as others point out above our record without Bayo this season is appalling so it’s no wonder Gareth keeps him on the pitch. I know I would too.
He is simply the fulcrum of the whole team and gives us a way of competing against clubs whose wage bills we cannot compete with.
Nine points from six games since his return is pretty good and we’re now a competitive Championship outfit which we weren’t without him.
However, he’s 38 and this is the season from hell so it’s asking a lot from him. The move to playing Kashket off him seemed to be working well and I though moving back to 4-3-3 was a step backwards which didn’t help either Bayo or Scotty tonight.
There was a lot of negativity about us being nailed on for relegation at the start of the season and I wonder whether that made us a less than desirable option for players looking for clubs or managers looking to loan players out.
If we continue to prove that we can compete. And compete well, we may find ourselves with more options in January
@Chris said:
Haven’t we literally lost every game when Akinfenwa didn’t start, and not lost a single game where he has?
We started playing like we belonged in this league around the Luton match, which was when Curtis Thompson returned. I credit him and the switch to a 442 formation as the most important factors to us gaining points. If Bayo was scoring or assisting, or if we were scoring from dead ball play where he was causing a menace, it would be different matter.
I completely agree that Bayo isn’t entirely responsible for our recent success, the loan signings of Adeniran and Knight have had a big impact too. And it’s easy to creative a false narrative around events which are at least partially down to chance.
But I just can’t possibly see how you could conclude from recent performances and results that it’s time to move on from Bayo - unless that was what you have already been thinking (and posting) for a long time despite his key contribution to both our promotions. On the back of one fairly ineffective game you see evidence that your long-held opinion has been re-affirmed.
If anything, the question should be ‘how on earth do we replace Bayo when he decides to retire?’
@TheatreOfChairs said:
Yes as others point out above our record without Bayo this season is appalling so it’s no wonder Gareth keeps him on the pitch. I know I would too.
However, he’s 38 and this is the season from hell so it’s asking a lot from him. The move to playing Kashket off him seemed to be working well and I though moving back to 4-3-3 was a step backwards which didn’t help either Bayo or Scotty tonight.
If the Akinfenwa/Kashket partnership is to work, surely Scotty has to at least stay within (short) passing distance of Bayo. He seemed to be roaming all over the pitch last night and was often nowhere near when Bayo got on the end of a Rocky kick.
It's helped having Bayo back, but I wouldn't put our turn in form entirely down to him. We were playing well even before his return to the starting XI. But for poor refereeing we'd have picked up something from the Milwall and Norwich games. We shouldn't forget he can be an absolute game changer coming off the bench.
We looked very disjointed going forwards last night. As the wingers were doing so much defensive work they were then too far from Bayo.
When this happens we need to play out a bit more to allow the wingers to get up to Bayo.
I don't think we can play a number 10 if Bayo is on the pitch, someone needs to play off his shoulder or as preferred a 4-3-3.
If Bayo doesn't start then we need a number 10. I'd like to see Josh Parker playing in that role, with Fred through the middle. I'd then have two of MCleary, Horgan and Wheeler out wide. Arguably Fred and the two wingers could all rotate around Parker.
I don't see how we can play Bayo and a number 10, as the 10 will be looking for slide rule passes to unlock the defence, which means you need some players with a bit of pace to unlock the door.
We can then switch to 4-4-2 for the last ten with Bayo & Kashket brought on as a double substitution.
After last nights game it felt like a defeat, perhaps because that game was there for the taking and in my head we are not going to have many games like that this season, so when we get them we need to take them.
Watford at home was the best he's ever played for us. That was a few weeks ago.
It's not a false narrative at all, we've been much better since he's returned and we've started picking up points.
There's a reasonable argument to suggest that we may need to manage his workload given how thick and fast the games are coming and the state of his knee, but if he's fully fit he starts every time
I wasn't suggesting Bayo should have been dropped, just that that was one of his worst games ever for us. I don't believe it was down to their defenders doing a good job either, probably just tiredness. Lots of comments above about how the two wide forwards were rarely close enough to him and that's definitely a big part of it too.
I've not seen anyone mention how good Wheeler was when he came on. Usually someone who goes slightly under the radar (to me), quietly getting on with having a decent game, but last night he looked fired up.
It's really hard to tell if Bayo is tired. I thought the Huddersfield defenders looked after him well and the quality of the balls in to him were poor.
I've never seen a player have so much influence despite doing so little. I wonder what the stats said about his performance last night.
He needs to be looked after but if he is ready to play, for me, he plays every game.
Comments
Bayo also did a good job on Schindler. Unwittingly obviously.
Bayo in the air lost more than he has since his return. When he did get it down he held it too long or got the ball caught up. Just wasn’t his game. Not a drama. Just not his game. Plan A is somewhere sick again Bayo was always plan B
Mehmeti is definitely an unlocker, but it'll be a little while yet before he's established. Him developing a telepathy with Kashket could be key to playing a different way, but again that feels like a longer-term project.
Haven’t we literally lost every game when Akinfenwa didn’t start, and not lost a single game where he has?
McCleary Horgan and Wheeler have goals in them but need to hit shots when they have the chance. Too many times we took one too many touches against an inexperienced ‘keeper. Just another example of the difference in league 1 v championship
Akinfenwa is a combination of player and team mascot. Not many of those about. I suppose Rooney at Derby was supposed to fill a similar role but that's gone a bit wrong.
Speaking of mascots, is Bodger is still in the job?
BRING BACK BLUEY
Got to offload someone first, but I imagine a couple, if not all three, of Phillips, Freeman and Parker will go out on loan in Jan.
Fred, McCleary, Horgan, Kashket, Mehmeti, Wheeler, Samuel. That’s without Uche but, with 5 subs, we could see most of those in most games.
It will come good in front of goal. When it does, I really hope Bayo is on the end of it.
@chairboyscentral - I agree we need to offload players who have no chance of playing. i would add Pattison to your list. We are becoming more competitive but we do need a couple of extra players in who would challenge for the starting eleven. The 4 listed are no where need the team.
Pattison is an awkward one - needs game time and isn't really Championship standard, but we sometimes play a midfield three and that would only leave us with Blooms, who won't be going anywhere, aside from the 'big three'.
It suprises me when people say we need a creative midfielder. I don’t think it’s a question of personnel I think it’s more about tactics and the way we play. I think Horgan, McCleary, Wheeler, Mehmeti could all play in the number 10 role and be creative. But that’s not the way we play. We often bypass the midfield and get the ball into the box as quick as we can. Additionally by forcing everything into the box we condense the spaces in behind for through balls.
Yes as others point out above our record without Bayo this season is appalling so it’s no wonder Gareth keeps him on the pitch. I know I would too.
He is simply the fulcrum of the whole team and gives us a way of competing against clubs whose wage bills we cannot compete with.
Nine points from six games since his return is pretty good and we’re now a competitive Championship outfit which we weren’t without him.
However, he’s 38 and this is the season from hell so it’s asking a lot from him. The move to playing Kashket off him seemed to be working well and I though moving back to 4-3-3 was a step backwards which didn’t help either Bayo or Scotty tonight.
There was a lot of negativity about us being nailed on for relegation at the start of the season and I wonder whether that made us a less than desirable option for players looking for clubs or managers looking to loan players out.
If we continue to prove that we can compete. And compete well, we may find ourselves with more options in January
Sign Danny Hylton in January
Don't even joke
Darius Charles as a striker. You know it makes sense.
We started playing like we belonged in this league around the Luton match, which was when Curtis Thompson returned. I credit him and the switch to a 442 formation as the most important factors to us gaining points. If Bayo was scoring or assisting, or if we were scoring from dead ball play where he was causing a menace, it would be different matter.
I completely agree that Bayo isn’t entirely responsible for our recent success, the loan signings of Adeniran and Knight have had a big impact too. And it’s easy to creative a false narrative around events which are at least partially down to chance.
But I just can’t possibly see how you could conclude from recent performances and results that it’s time to move on from Bayo - unless that was what you have already been thinking (and posting) for a long time despite his key contribution to both our promotions. On the back of one fairly ineffective game you see evidence that your long-held opinion has been re-affirmed.
If anything, the question should be ‘how on earth do we replace Bayo when he decides to retire?’
If the Akinfenwa/Kashket partnership is to work, surely Scotty has to at least stay within (short) passing distance of Bayo. He seemed to be roaming all over the pitch last night and was often nowhere near when Bayo got on the end of a Rocky kick.
It's helped having Bayo back, but I wouldn't put our turn in form entirely down to him. We were playing well even before his return to the starting XI. But for poor refereeing we'd have picked up something from the Milwall and Norwich games. We shouldn't forget he can be an absolute game changer coming off the bench.
We looked very disjointed going forwards last night. As the wingers were doing so much defensive work they were then too far from Bayo.
When this happens we need to play out a bit more to allow the wingers to get up to Bayo.
I don't think we can play a number 10 if Bayo is on the pitch, someone needs to play off his shoulder or as preferred a 4-3-3.
If Bayo doesn't start then we need a number 10. I'd like to see Josh Parker playing in that role, with Fred through the middle. I'd then have two of MCleary, Horgan and Wheeler out wide. Arguably Fred and the two wingers could all rotate around Parker.
I don't see how we can play Bayo and a number 10, as the 10 will be looking for slide rule passes to unlock the defence, which means you need some players with a bit of pace to unlock the door.
We can then switch to 4-4-2 for the last ten with Bayo & Kashket brought on as a double substitution.
After last nights game it felt like a defeat, perhaps because that game was there for the taking and in my head we are not going to have many games like that this season, so when we get them we need to take them.
Watford at home was the best he's ever played for us. That was a few weeks ago.
It's not a false narrative at all, we've been much better since he's returned and we've started picking up points.
There's a reasonable argument to suggest that we may need to manage his workload given how thick and fast the games are coming and the state of his knee, but if he's fully fit he starts every time
I also suspect he's being asked to shoulder this burden until we get Uche fit and we can rest him more.
While the choice is him, or Samuel or Parker, then the choice for Gaz is an easy one
I wasn't suggesting Bayo should have been dropped, just that that was one of his worst games ever for us. I don't believe it was down to their defenders doing a good job either, probably just tiredness. Lots of comments above about how the two wide forwards were rarely close enough to him and that's definitely a big part of it too.
I've not seen anyone mention how good Wheeler was when he came on. Usually someone who goes slightly under the radar (to me), quietly getting on with having a decent game, but last night he looked fired up.
It's really hard to tell if Bayo is tired. I thought the Huddersfield defenders looked after him well and the quality of the balls in to him were poor.
I've never seen a player have so much influence despite doing so little. I wonder what the stats said about his performance last night.
He needs to be looked after but if he is ready to play, for me, he plays every game.