I don't think such data would be meaningless. I too would expect the majority (perhaps by quite a distance) to be both of pension age (senior citizens indeed) and season ticket holders.
Some of us have reached an age where watching (and talking/posting incessantly about) our beloved football club occupies a ridiculously large proportion of our waking hours. We have chosen to contribute a significant proportion of our disposable income to a share scheme which we hoped would assist the aim of restoring financial stability and provide working capital to update "tired" accommodation and other facilities. We were under no illusion about the extent to which (if at all) the proceeds would be used to buy or pay the wages of players. At least I personally couldn't see that happening in the light of projected income. But of course, Rome, as they say......and I like to think that, once the infrastructure improvements have been completed and outstanding debts cleared, the playing budget will benefit.
Oh, by the way, the Blues are leading 2-0. Rowe and Hayes the scorers.
As things stand at the moment, the trust is a black box that nobody is allowed to look inside. Like good North Koreans, we're just told to trust our Great Leaders.
Great post @drcongo. Hit the nail on the head really.
You might.
Not quite at the discount stage yet but getting close.
In fact at the last game, the guy at the counter asked me if it was a adult ticket i needed. I thought he meant youth ticket and only later occurred to me that he thought I might be eligible for a senior. Another line crossed.
To answer some of the replies to my point:
1. We worked hard with Supporters Direct to come up with a community scheme that allowed each UK tax paying investor to get 30% of what they gave, back by way of tax relief/refund. So for every £10 given, you get £3 of it back later.
2. Whilst the money is a donation, you get Trust shares in return which one day, the Trust may be able to redeem back to you - not in the first 3 years and maybe not for a while after that.
3. I do accept how much some fans spend on match days, both home and away and this may not leave much left, once other living costs are covered too but £10 a month is less than a pint of beer a week. We started this scheme because fans said that owning their club was worth more to them than their £10 a year trust membership and that they would happily give this every month.
4. The £2m target could have been met by 1000 fans investing £2000 each and a good many did come up with that sum. However there was always scope for entry at much lower levels and all contributions are valued.
5. My point was trying to say that if everyone could have given a little, then those sums would soon add up to a lot, which would greatly have helped the club/team both off and on the pitch. As it is, we have an excellent start and now regular income for the next few years for which we are grateful.
6. Happy to hear other reasons why fans don't subscribe, to see if we can accommodation their needs.
However, more important than either of of those two is some semblance of a two way street in communication. Wouldn't it be nice if a) this supporter owned club listened to its supporters who supposedly own it, and b) it sometimes spoke back to them. Just see the threads on disabled parking and people's season ticket seats being reallocated to see how utterly laughable this situation is. Give a voice to the supporters who pay, and we'll pay.
@AlanCecil appreciate your points but for me I agree with the communication issue. If it was more of a two way street I.e fans actully had a say on issues regularly I would happily invest that £10 a month.
Currently I do put a tenner aside each week towards the club. And each May it pays for mine and my lad's season tickets. It's genuinely all I can afford unless I win the lottery.
Thanks for the answers @AlanCecil . Genuinely appreciated but I still don't think you are following that some people simply can't afford to invest. No amount of swapping what else they spend money on will help. Seems ironic Ainsworth plays the poverty card at every stroke but the Trust don't seem to think that applies to anyone else.
@floyd not even asking necessarily for an input but a 2 way communication between trust and members on issues (parking has been raised, shambles with tickets at the club, poor atmosphere, poor attendances, what can we do more in the community etc etc anything really)
Maybe this is already in place but as a non member I just don't know about it.
thats a good list, and I'm with you. Il not sure what's wrong with the communication from the club, but I know it needs to be better in at least some of the issues you've raised.
The communication flow from the Trust is pretty much the same whether you are a member or not. The only difference is timing. If you are member you get the email straight away. If not you check the Trust website or wait for a member to post it.
The only Trust based benefit of membership is to be able to stand for board positions and vote at AGM's.
I do accept the fact that some fans cannot afford to give any more than they pay at present. It was any other reasons that i was keen to learn.
We do our best to communicate with Trust members without replicating things that are put out by the football club. Members are free to contact the Trust Directors at any time by email - see the Trust website - or on matchdays when at least 2 of us are present in the Vere Suite before the game.
The Board just chooses not to get involved in emotional debate on social media but rather to deal with factual issues.
We have also set up the Fans Council with a cross section of supporters on it to meet with the club on a regular basis.
@floyd I agree. I'm not trying to hammer what the Trust do. However, in order to gain more members in my opinion improving the communication (people feel a bit more involved I guess) could help to do this.
@AlanCecil Funds given for Shares of the Supporters Trust are an Investment not a donation. The tax relief relates to the purchase of Shares. It is fairly excepted by most Shareholders that they may not get their funds back but The trust does have a responsibility to protect the Capital investment of its members. How they deal with Donations is a separate issue.
Comments
I must admit I do find these arguments more entertaining than the football these days
Obviously doesn't take a lot to keep you amused!
This is very true
I don't think such data would be meaningless. I too would expect the majority (perhaps by quite a distance) to be both of pension age (senior citizens indeed) and season ticket holders.
Some of us have reached an age where watching (and talking/posting incessantly about) our beloved football club occupies a ridiculously large proportion of our waking hours. We have chosen to contribute a significant proportion of our disposable income to a share scheme which we hoped would assist the aim of restoring financial stability and provide working capital to update "tired" accommodation and other facilities. We were under no illusion about the extent to which (if at all) the proceeds would be used to buy or pay the wages of players. At least I personally couldn't see that happening in the light of projected income. But of course, Rome, as they say......and I like to think that, once the infrastructure improvements have been completed and outstanding debts cleared, the playing budget will benefit.
Oh, by the way, the Blues are leading 2-0. Rowe and Hayes the scorers.
Dev might I ask how old are you!!
Great post @drcongo. Hit the nail on the head really.
You might.
Not quite at the discount stage yet but getting close.
In fact at the last game, the guy at the counter asked me if it was a adult ticket i needed. I thought he meant youth ticket and only later occurred to me that he thought I might be eligible for a senior. Another line crossed.
To answer some of the replies to my point:
1. We worked hard with Supporters Direct to come up with a community scheme that allowed each UK tax paying investor to get 30% of what they gave, back by way of tax relief/refund. So for every £10 given, you get £3 of it back later.
2. Whilst the money is a donation, you get Trust shares in return which one day, the Trust may be able to redeem back to you - not in the first 3 years and maybe not for a while after that.
3. I do accept how much some fans spend on match days, both home and away and this may not leave much left, once other living costs are covered too but £10 a month is less than a pint of beer a week. We started this scheme because fans said that owning their club was worth more to them than their £10 a year trust membership and that they would happily give this every month.
4. The £2m target could have been met by 1000 fans investing £2000 each and a good many did come up with that sum. However there was always scope for entry at much lower levels and all contributions are valued.
5. My point was trying to say that if everyone could have given a little, then those sums would soon add up to a lot, which would greatly have helped the club/team both off and on the pitch. As it is, we have an excellent start and now regular income for the next few years for which we are grateful.
6. Happy to hear other reasons why fans don't subscribe, to see if we can accommodation their needs.
@AlanCecil appreciate your points but for me I agree with the communication issue. If it was more of a two way street I.e fans actully had a say on issues regularly I would happily invest that £10 a month.
To be fair to @AlanCecil, he may well have missed my post as I forgot to @ mention him in it.
Currently I do put a tenner aside each week towards the club. And each May it pays for mine and my lad's season tickets. It's genuinely all I can afford unless I win the lottery.
Thanks for the answers @AlanCecil . Genuinely appreciated but I still don't think you are following that some people simply can't afford to invest. No amount of swapping what else they spend money on will help. Seems ironic Ainsworth plays the poverty card at every stroke but the Trust don't seem to think that applies to anyone else.
@fromtheside genuine question, what sort of input would you like in return for your 10 quid a month!
@floyd not even asking necessarily for an input but a 2 way communication between trust and members on issues (parking has been raised, shambles with tickets at the club, poor atmosphere, poor attendances, what can we do more in the community etc etc anything really)
Maybe this is already in place but as a non member I just don't know about it.
thats a good list, and I'm with you. Il not sure what's wrong with the communication from the club, but I know it needs to be better in at least some of the issues you've raised.
The communication flow from the Trust is pretty much the same whether you are a member or not. The only difference is timing. If you are member you get the email straight away. If not you check the Trust website or wait for a member to post it.
The only Trust based benefit of membership is to be able to stand for board positions and vote at AGM's.
I do accept the fact that some fans cannot afford to give any more than they pay at present. It was any other reasons that i was keen to learn.
We do our best to communicate with Trust members without replicating things that are put out by the football club. Members are free to contact the Trust Directors at any time by email - see the Trust website - or on matchdays when at least 2 of us are present in the Vere Suite before the game.
The Board just chooses not to get involved in emotional debate on social media but rather to deal with factual issues.
We have also set up the Fans Council with a cross section of supporters on it to meet with the club on a regular basis.
@floyd I agree. I'm not trying to hammer what the Trust do. However, in order to gain more members in my opinion improving the communication (people feel a bit more involved I guess) could help to do this.
@fromtheside I think the Wycombe PALS is a great example of getting people involved. It's something I'd love to be a part of if I was able to be.
@AlanCecil Funds given for Shares of the Supporters Trust are an Investment not a donation. The tax relief relates to the purchase of Shares. It is fairly excepted by most Shareholders that they may not get their funds back but The trust does have a responsibility to protect the Capital investment of its members. How they deal with Donations is a separate issue.