@DevC , I guess you'd have to be In their position for your question Number 4. Everyone has a threshold. And a season ticket holder would be getting in for about £12.50 or so a game, the main benefit of buying early bird. Maybe that extra £5 x25 home games a season simply pushes them over the threshold.
I doubt it's something you'd need to worry about, a mere £125 but some would!
@Malone@FallenFlyer don't get me wrong, I can see how it can and would be an emotive issue. Someone briefed to 'find out who the fraudsters are at all costs' with no other training or guidance would probably create a national newsstory without meaning to. But anyone working for a company I was running would be trained to do this in the most friendly, non evasive and non patronising way possible. Get to know people. You see them the first game of the season, and within 10 seconds of friendly conversation as you direct them to the new disabled spaces you can be 95%+ sure that you are dealing with the genuine blue badge owner. That's it, you remember them and their car for the rest of the season. That, in addition to creating an additional 10-15 spaces by taking some off sale, means that even if one or two fraudsters slip through the net, it really doesn't matter. We can pride ourselves at being welcoming to home and away fans without charging them for the convenience of parking in the hardest to get out of cul de sac in Bucks.
@AttitudeEra , I do agree, and there's ways to not make it an atmosphere.
Thinking back, I used to get a lift with an old guy who was registered disabled. he used to park under the away end stand. As I was only a youngster, I didn't even think about how many spaces there were, and what happened if they were full. I guess back then, there were either plenty of spaces to go around, or there weren't that many using them!
What I do remember, is on about 80mins, he'd begin the slow walk back to his car, and I'd see him from another stand, and have to sprint round to meet him... or he'd just be off.
Probably missed 5-10 goals a season back then!
I'd be interested to know how many disabled fans are season ticket holders (something I genuinely do not know).
From my general experience, most people with a disability don't commit to long term planning. The combination of illness, inability to get to places and general complications find that they cannot attend all the time and it becomes a case of making it to something when everything falls in line. If this were the case, and it may be that it isn't, a registering system opposed to a recognition system would probably work better. Of course this adds another level or bureaucracy to the club with the additional financial cost involved. This would have to be addressed, most likely in a registration fee. This is unlikely to be popular but should be understandable with the right explanation.
A truly fascinating debate that reflects the difficulty of managing thought what is a minefield. As this issue has been in the offing for over 3 months and has generated so much comment (both on Facebook originally and on here now), I presume that it that has been discussed with the recently established Fans Consultation Group and appropriate representatives of any of the numerous disability associations that are around.
Malone. This of course is an assumption and I mustn't do that but I am assuming that the majority of people unable to walk further than the bottom car park are relatively unlikely to then buy standing tickets. I understand there is a thresh-hold, £2.50 doesn't seem to likely to apply to the majority or even a significant minority.
You are right in your suggestion that I have never looked at the facebook WWFC page.
If its been known about for months, odd that the BFP splash it now
@Malone said:
AttitudeEra , I do agree, and there's ways to not make it an atmosphere.
Thinking back, I used to get a lift with an old guy who was registered disabled. he used to park under the away end stand. As I was only a youngster, I didn't even think about how many spaces there were, and what happened if they were full. I guess back then, there were either plenty of spaces to go around, or there weren't that many using them!
What I do remember, is on about 80mins, he'd begin the slow walk back to his car, and I'd see him from another stand, and have to sprint round to meet him... or he'd just be off.
Probably missed 5-10 goals a season back then!
@DevC, I think the individual in question mentioned that because they had to get to the ground so early to guarantee a space, that they had to buy a Vere suite membership? And that price had gone up from 70-120? So although to you, £2.50, or £5 (as you're assuming again, that they come with a pal) is mere throwaway money, eventually someone's level cuts off.
I know you find it hard to understand, and I'm similar myself when I hear of fans saying they can't produce £300 in one go for a season ticket, when it's their year's main activity. I can't relate to that, but it's priorities and circumstance, so I'm not surprised you can't relate from your south cost mansion ;-)
@AttitudeEra , a family emergency meant I turned up at half time the other game. I didn't for a second worry that I might miss some key action! Sure enough turned up at 0-0, to huge mutterings of discontent.
A far cry from the time I turned up about 5mins late to already find 2 or3 goals had been scored, in a game v Preston (I think!), and before I'd sat down saw us get a pen.
The thing is, Dev C genuinely doesn't give two shits about this at all. He couldn't care less.
But he's seen that others do have strong feelings so typically he's taken the opportunity to slip right into his accustomed self-imposed "voice of reason, I'm far superior to each and every one of you" persona, and as usual has said absolutely nothing of note, and taken about a thousand words to say it.
This situation is really really easy. We should be pricing free car parking spaces for fans with disabled badges at the ground. Because it's the right thing to do. And if demand currently exceeds supply then we should be providing more. That's it, it really is that simple. Is
I think it best to ignore Mr Plants little rant. As far as I am aware, its not compulsory to agree with his view.
As for Malone, well I am no more assuming that there are likely to be two people in the car than you are assuming there are only one. For people who generally need a little bit of help, I suspect my assumption is more valid.
As for the individual, you hadn't the DeVere Suite before so a little difficult to take it into account. From what you say, he has to be a member and arrive very early at the ground taking up a lot of time because of the free for all nature of the disabled spaces. If he had paid for a dedicated space that he knew would be available, he presumably wouldn't need to - or his friends/family who come with him. he might be better off. He might value the time in the DeVere Suite for its conviviality. I don't know.
I do resent the lazy assumption in such matters that the Chairman of the club has not thought long and hard about this matter and is simply being money grabbing. He may have got the solution to a difficult problem wrong, that's a matter of opinion, he may even have changed his mind months ago, but it is rather sad that certain people in their desperation to criticise the club immediately jump to the conclusion that he acted in bad faith. I would rather give him the benefit of the doubt and would suggest that he is trying to improve what is always a difficult situation.
I don't think I've ever heard anyone call it the "De"Vere suite before. Unless the Vere family had some upper class roots that they hid to be men of the people!
It's very sad that a civilised discussion has descended into such a mishmash of assumptions and speculation (not to mention backbiting) about something that may never happen.
And @Malone, if it was £120 for Vere Suite membership, that would go a long way towards easing our financial problems!
Surely this topic has been done to death now and it is time to pause for breath pending an announcement from the club, assuming of course that nothing has appeared on the official website whilst we have all been chuntering on!
Comments
@DevC , I guess you'd have to be In their position for your question Number 4. Everyone has a threshold. And a season ticket holder would be getting in for about £12.50 or so a game, the main benefit of buying early bird. Maybe that extra £5 x25 home games a season simply pushes them over the threshold.
I doubt it's something you'd need to worry about, a mere £125 but some would!
@Malone @FallenFlyer don't get me wrong, I can see how it can and would be an emotive issue. Someone briefed to 'find out who the fraudsters are at all costs' with no other training or guidance would probably create a national newsstory without meaning to. But anyone working for a company I was running would be trained to do this in the most friendly, non evasive and non patronising way possible. Get to know people. You see them the first game of the season, and within 10 seconds of friendly conversation as you direct them to the new disabled spaces you can be 95%+ sure that you are dealing with the genuine blue badge owner. That's it, you remember them and their car for the rest of the season. That, in addition to creating an additional 10-15 spaces by taking some off sale, means that even if one or two fraudsters slip through the net, it really doesn't matter. We can pride ourselves at being welcoming to home and away fans without charging them for the convenience of parking in the hardest to get out of cul de sac in Bucks.
@AttitudeEra , I do agree, and there's ways to not make it an atmosphere.
Thinking back, I used to get a lift with an old guy who was registered disabled. he used to park under the away end stand. As I was only a youngster, I didn't even think about how many spaces there were, and what happened if they were full. I guess back then, there were either plenty of spaces to go around, or there weren't that many using them!
What I do remember, is on about 80mins, he'd begin the slow walk back to his car, and I'd see him from another stand, and have to sprint round to meet him... or he'd just be off.
Probably missed 5-10 goals a season back then!
I'd be interested to know how many disabled fans are season ticket holders (something I genuinely do not know).
From my general experience, most people with a disability don't commit to long term planning. The combination of illness, inability to get to places and general complications find that they cannot attend all the time and it becomes a case of making it to something when everything falls in line. If this were the case, and it may be that it isn't, a registering system opposed to a recognition system would probably work better. Of course this adds another level or bureaucracy to the club with the additional financial cost involved. This would have to be addressed, most likely in a registration fee. This is unlikely to be popular but should be understandable with the right explanation.
A truly fascinating debate that reflects the difficulty of managing thought what is a minefield. As this issue has been in the offing for over 3 months and has generated so much comment (both on Facebook originally and on here now), I presume that it that has been discussed with the recently established Fans Consultation Group and appropriate representatives of any of the numerous disability associations that are around.
Malone is correct. I used to regularly use the FB page and I clearly recall discussions about this months ago.
Malone. This of course is an assumption and I mustn't do that but I am assuming that the majority of people unable to walk further than the bottom car park are relatively unlikely to then buy standing tickets. I understand there is a thresh-hold, £2.50 doesn't seem to likely to apply to the majority or even a significant minority.
You are right in your suggestion that I have never looked at the facebook WWFC page.
If its been known about for months, odd that the BFP splash it now
Don't think you'd miss too much these days!
@DevC, I think the individual in question mentioned that because they had to get to the ground so early to guarantee a space, that they had to buy a Vere suite membership? And that price had gone up from 70-120? So although to you, £2.50, or £5 (as you're assuming again, that they come with a pal) is mere throwaway money, eventually someone's level cuts off.
I know you find it hard to understand, and I'm similar myself when I hear of fans saying they can't produce £300 in one go for a season ticket, when it's their year's main activity. I can't relate to that, but it's priorities and circumstance, so I'm not surprised you can't relate from your south cost mansion ;-)
@AttitudeEra , a family emergency meant I turned up at half time the other game. I didn't for a second worry that I might miss some key action! Sure enough turned up at 0-0, to huge mutterings of discontent.
A far cry from the time I turned up about 5mins late to already find 2 or3 goals had been scored, in a game v Preston (I think!), and before I'd sat down saw us get a pen.
The thing is, Dev C genuinely doesn't give two shits about this at all. He couldn't care less.
But he's seen that others do have strong feelings so typically he's taken the opportunity to slip right into his accustomed self-imposed "voice of reason, I'm far superior to each and every one of you" persona, and as usual has said absolutely nothing of note, and taken about a thousand words to say it.
This situation is really really easy. We should be pricing free car parking spaces for fans with disabled badges at the ground. Because it's the right thing to do. And if demand currently exceeds supply then we should be providing more. That's it, it really is that simple. Is
Eric, you call DevC predictable and repititous, yet you're back on here whinging about his decorum yet again like you do every time he posts.
I have the odd little debate with Dev, but clearly something a lot deeper goes into this with a few posters...
And even more predictable is @bill_stickers backing the nauseating DevC everytime he gets some flak.
I think it best to ignore Mr Plants little rant. As far as I am aware, its not compulsory to agree with his view.
As for Malone, well I am no more assuming that there are likely to be two people in the car than you are assuming there are only one. For people who generally need a little bit of help, I suspect my assumption is more valid.
As for the individual, you hadn't the DeVere Suite before so a little difficult to take it into account. From what you say, he has to be a member and arrive very early at the ground taking up a lot of time because of the free for all nature of the disabled spaces. If he had paid for a dedicated space that he knew would be available, he presumably wouldn't need to - or his friends/family who come with him. he might be better off. He might value the time in the DeVere Suite for its conviviality. I don't know.
I do resent the lazy assumption in such matters that the Chairman of the club has not thought long and hard about this matter and is simply being money grabbing. He may have got the solution to a difficult problem wrong, that's a matter of opinion, he may even have changed his mind months ago, but it is rather sad that certain people in their desperation to criticise the club immediately jump to the conclusion that he acted in bad faith. I would rather give him the benefit of the doubt and would suggest that he is trying to improve what is always a difficult situation.
I don't think I've ever heard anyone call it the "De"Vere suite before. Unless the Vere family had some upper class roots that they hid to be men of the people!
Perhaps we are now owned by the DeVere Group!
Oops
It's very sad that a civilised discussion has descended into such a mishmash of assumptions and speculation (not to mention backbiting) about something that may never happen.
And @Malone, if it was £120 for Vere Suite membership, that would go a long way towards easing our financial problems!
Surely this topic has been done to death now and it is time to pause for breath pending an announcement from the club, assuming of course that nothing has appeared on the official website whilst we have all been chuntering on!