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transfer speculation....

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  • @marlowchair , not sure how "in the know" you actually are, but I struggle to believe that managers are limited to a one year payoff, unless it's specifically in their contract, as per someone like Moyes at United.

    I thought it was fairly well known we were absolutely smashed by the payment we had to give Sanchez, having got excited and extended his contract. One year would have been fairly manageable!

  • Malone, I laid out the full position on another thread yesterday (which was described as boring). Marlow is partly right partly wrong. managers contract is just an employment contract. If compensation for breach is not spelled out in contract, he is entitled in law to recover his losses as a result of the breach. This is unlikely to be as much as the full salary for remaining term of contract. That is the legal position. In practise club (and sometimes manager) don't usually want dirty washing aired in public, so they will tend to negotiate rather than go to court.

  • A good point Malone but things have been refined since the Sanchez era thanks ( or not!) to a very strong league managers association. The LMA negotiated some incredibly huge pay outs and full contract length severance deals previously in response to the fickle approach clubs took to the sack race. The result was a realistic negotiation and agreed common policy between clubs and the LMA to provide security for managers whilst placing the financial risk into “poaching” clubs through compensation payments rather than on the contracted club and manager who may wish to end tenure prior to contract end date either by the manager seeking a better opportunity or it not working out results wise.

    It works in the LMAs favour because without the limitations no club would risk signing a manager to longer than they can afford to pay him out so there would be a number of 1 and 2 year manager contracts around. This way their members are still attractive 4 or 5 year propositions with mutually suitable break provisions if circumstances require.

    It was a nice piece of industry workplace agreement work that reeks of common sense.

    It’s why tribunal and litigation action is so rare between sacked managers and clubs considering the number of sackings proportionately in our game.

    Dev is right in saying that like any contract they are open to common contract laws, but that is only relevant if tested in court or tribunal. The LMA contracts and general relationship they have with the industry and clubs means conflict is relatively rare.

  • I'm almost missing richie's far terser, pithier explanations of contracts, pay and who's legs have gone.

  • It's lunchtime. It's hot. I'm avoiding getting back to work. So...

    Not sure how well this fits into any of the arguments above, but (according to the Independent) it appears that sacked managers in the Premier (who presumably are covered by the LMA) seem to do very very well out of getting sacked:

    "Football, it seems, is one of the few jobs that offer full payment for those considered to be failing in their jobs, and they don’t even have to undergo a probation period to qualify for the lottery-style cash gift they are presented with as they leave.

    An estimated €35m has been handed out to sacked Premier League managers over the course of this season alone, with some of the deals in place devoid of business sense."

    https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/premier-league/revealed-the-crazy-cash-sums-being-paid-out-to-premier-league-managers-when-they-are-sacked-36930761.html

    And meanwhile if anyone is equally as sad as me and with time on their hand this (from 2013) seems quite a good summary of the legal position, which if I read it right proves both @DevC and @marlowchair correct. (Remind me, what are you arguing about again?*)

    https://www.lyonsdavidson.co.uk/ask-football-managers-employment-rights/

    *No please don't!!

  • It's always hard to compare it to "normal" jobs like some of ours.

    If you were sacked for being pretty rubbish, but not having necessarily shown any misconduct, you'd have to been somewhere over 2 years to even get any redundancy.

    Even then you'd be limited to about £490 a week (i think?) per year (over 21 but under 40 or 45?)

    So if you'd done a 5 year stint in a 50k job, you'd be lucky to get your £2.5k off statutory redundancy.

    Probably works differently in the "real" world, in a way @marlowchair mentions in a different sense, about the sensible approach and wanting to avoid litigation.

  • If you were sacked for being rubbish then that would be because of ‘capability’ and you wouldn’t be entitled to any pay out, although your employer would have to follow their proper process before deciding on dismissal. They would likely consider options such as retraining or moving you to a different role rather than dismissal.

  • That's not really true, Malone

    Employment and contract law applying to your contract of employment is exactly the same as the employment and contract law applying to a football managers employment.

    Football managers contracts tend to be fixed term, yours not fixed term.

    Redundancy and being sacked for any reason are completely different things. You or a football manager can't be made redundant because you are "pretty rubbish".

    Statutory redundancy pay is 1/2 week per year of service up to age 22, 1 week 22-41, 1.5 weeks thereafter but weeks pay is lower of actual or £508 but has no relevance to a conversation about compensation on dismissal of football managers.

  • My agent did me a very bad deal.

  • edited June 2018

    I think you'd have to be pretty naive to not understand that "redundancy" is a pretty frequently used tool to get rid of "Rubbish" employees.

  • I would like to know if Gareth is getting statutory sick pay, paternity leave under the present EU directives and M&S vouchers as a signing on incentive.

  • I think we can all agree that this promotion has brought us nothing but problems. Had we but known, the fans at Chesterfield would have wept for sorrow instead of joy.

  • Ainsworth out.

  • We're stuck with him now @Jonny_King unless DevonC can work out his severance money.

  • Dev is probably at this moment preparing a spreadsheet calculating compensation due to Gareth on any given day during his five year contract. That is of course assuming he's not on a train enjoying the view in front of him!

  • The spreadsheet could just be a cover. A5 should do it.
    Does DevonC rhyme with Beyoncé @Wendoverman ?

  • I think it depends on your accent @micra

  • barnet have accepted a bid for Akinde...i wonder who the club are.....wont be us i would imagine

  • Probably money bags Luton.

  • It's Lincoln

  • Good bet for the title now. Will form a good partnership with Andrade.

  • As if Lincoln need any more of a physical presence.

  • do you think we are likely announce any signings today with kit launch ?

  • Only one way to find out. Wait.

  • Last time it was Bayo.

  • Gareth said today that there are more signings coming, but they will be loans.

  • loans?? i thought we would be making a couple.of.signings...so many decent players that are available...either GA does not rate or we dont have have budget

  • Check the date my friend and chill. No panic.

  • I think we must be waiting for the WC to be over before getting Maguire and Hazard in.

  • We already have a really decent core squad and the addition of a couple of diamonds in the rough like Eze would be just super.
    Some of the signings out there at our level are already attracting silly money and we wisely keep out of those.
    In GA we trust

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