@glasshalfempty said:
You can’t compare a supporter with a player. It’s an absurd comparison.
As is @eric_plant comparing me not being bothered about learning exactly when G Mac will be fit with fixing cars, but here we are…
On that point, if I couldn’t get an idea about when my car was going to be fixed I wouldn’t know what action I should take to get back on the road. With an injured player, I have no control over their recovery or the ability to do anything about replacing them. The only people who need to consider that are Rob & Pete Couhig plus Gareth and Richard Dobson. So as long as they’ve got an idea, that’s fine with me.
@our_frank no I wasn’t, but that’s mainly because I hadn’t seen that snippet of news. I’d definitely have been disappointed though!
One thing I am sure we can all agree on is that the second G Mac is fit, he’ll be in the starting XI. And we’ll all be cheering.
As a thought exercise, @eric_plant, imagine you've been told GMac will be out for the rest of the season.
That way you'll turn up one day to find he's been been named in the team and be absolutely over the moon. Or would that, in fact, also piss you off as you'd not been told he would actually be returning that day?
@Wendoverman said: @railwaysteve is a gasroom regular who has been seriously ill. I am happy to find out his operation has been successful...I am less bothered about when he can get back up to speed sorting out the rediction spreadsheets. Ridiculous comparison.
We're all happy to hear he's doing well, of course we are
But knowing this does not change the way we behave, nor does it make any difference to the recovery itself
Which seem to be the arguments against wanting to have an update in McCleary's fitness
@glasshalfempty said:
You can’t compare a supporter with a player. It’s an absurd comparison.
As is @eric_plant comparing me not being bothered about learning exactly when G Mac will be fit with fixing cars, but here we are…
On that point, if I couldn’t get an idea about when my car was going to be fixed I wouldn’t know what action I should take to get back on the road. With an injured player, I have no control over their recovery or the ability to do anything about replacing them. The only people who need to consider that are Rob & Pete Couhig plus Gareth and Richard Dobson. So as long as they’ve got an idea, that’s fine with me.
@our_frank no I wasn’t, but that’s mainly because I hadn’t seen that snippet of news. I’d definitely have been disappointed though!
One thing I am sure we can all agree on is that the second G Mac is fit, he’ll be in the starting XI. And we’ll all be cheering.
And you're not in the slightest bit curious as to whether that is likely to be in the next few weeks, or months, or next season?
@glasshalfempty said:
You can’t compare a supporter with a player. It’s an absurd comparison.
As is @eric_plant comparing me not being bothered about learning exactly when G Mac will be fit with fixing cars, but here we are…
On that point, if I couldn’t get an idea about when my car was going to be fixed I wouldn’t know what action I should take to get back on the road. With an injured player, I have no control over their recovery or the ability to do anything about replacing them. The only people who need to consider that are Rob & Pete Couhig plus Gareth and Richard Dobson. So as long as they’ve got an idea, that’s fine with me.
@our_frank no I wasn’t, but that’s mainly because I hadn’t seen that snippet of news. I’d definitely have been disappointed though!
One thing I am sure we can all agree on is that the second G Mac is fit, he’ll be in the starting XI. And we’ll all be cheering.
And you're not in the slightest bit curious as to whether that is likely to be in the next few weeks, or months, or next season?
@eric_plant said:
You've got the accents the wrong way round there
Well spotted and getting in before an ear bashing from @micra.
No chance @mooneyman. I know how to say it because I heard Doris Day singing it many years ago. I don’t even know if it’s Spanish or Italian, never mind what accents are appropriate.
When was the last time I gave an ear bashing ? I lack the energy now even for gentle quips. I did bridle recently however, on behalf of our Forest fans, when you referred to Notts Forest !?
I'm with Eric on this one. For me it just makes a difference to how I'm feeling and see the game. My positivity when I sit down or when I see the team sheet. A huge grin or a sigh?
Given our obvious struggles currently, and no option to bring loans in, then this patch could quite easily extend until 1st January until we can get another loanee in.
That's a long time.
So if there is any chance we might see him for the Xmas period, it would provide some hope to me and probably change my attitude towards the matches between now and then.
If his return is then delayed due to a set back, as long as they were honest and let us know why, I wouldn't be frothing at the mouth.
I have no stats to back this up but I feel we are in the minority of sports teams who do not inform fans how long players are out for and when the expected return is. Cricket, rugby, football and others all seem to do it more often than they don't. So this for me is why it's even more frustrating.
@ReturnToSenda Do you know what, after 20 minutes against Ipswich when we were absolutely blitzing them and playing them off the park a thought popped into my head from nowhere ‘we’re actually going to win the league aren’t we!’ I’m not the type for that kind of optimism so no idea where it came from. Since almost that exact point we’ve been absolutely all over the place and resorted back to aimless long ball most of the time and really struggled, very strange!
I think with our style of play when things are not going well it can be pretty dire, but regardless of whether this run comes to an end on Saturday, as long as McCleary isn’t out for the season, I’m still pretty confident we’ll be challenging for the play offs.
Idk if this is too simplistic, but for me, we're overcompensating for GMac's absence by committing too many men forward. And we're actually creating the best quality chances we have all season - the data shows that - but that's leaving us horribly exposed on the counter, as we've seen and as Gaz has acknowledged. The approach v Hartlepool was because they concede a lot of goals from balls pumped into the box, but evidently it didn't work on this occasion. With Horgan in the McCleary role on Saturday, I'll be quite confident.
We certainly do seem far more at risk of a counterattack these last few games.
If you're playing wingbacks you have to know how to deal with one of them losing possession high upfield and being out of the game as the opposition attacks. We haven't looked as though we can deal with that recently.
Like you say, it could be that the wingbacks (McCarthy in particular?) are getting a lot further forward when we have the ball
I think against Ipswich the problem was obvious - loss of midfield structure with Thompson not playing, exacerbated by Gape being deployed in the old Bloomfield role - but I found it harder to pinpoint v Pompey (wasn't at Hartlepool so have only seen brief highlights). Having someone like Horgan who we can 'hand off' to in order to slow things down just a touch and allow our WBs that bit of time to recover position could make a big difference.
@eric_plant said:
If you're playing wingbacks you have to know how to deal with one of them losing possession high upfield and being out of the game as the opposition attacks. We haven't looked as though we can deal with that recently.
Totally agree with this, and I mentioned somewhere else that I'm absolutely sure that last season when we started with wingbacks, we very rarely had both of them forward at the same time. Whenever one bombed forward, the other would remain back which usually effectively gave us a back four most of the time. We've definitely stopped doing this though, and at times we've got at least one of the centre backs playing in the opposition half with them leaving us horribly open.
The effect this has on the other end of the pitch is often that we've got so many men forward that they're getting in each other's way, taking the ball / shot when there's someone in a much better position just behind etc.
@Quarterman said:
I think you said we’d win the last league game during half time! Although I don’t necessarily disagree :-)
I think I actually said we'll win the league outright at one point ?
I think you got a little carried away when we went 3-1 up against whoever that northern lot are a few weeks away, then drew 3-3.
Has been poor since then.
@Quarterman said:
I think you said we’d win the last league game during half time! Although I don’t necessarily disagree :-)
I think I actually said we'll win the league outright at one point ?
I think you got a little carried away when we went 3-1 up against whoever that northern lot are a few weeks away, then drew 3-3.
Has been poor since then.
Fleetwood - one of only three games I've not been at / watched since the start of last season, so on reflection it wasn't the best-advised shout...
@ReturnToSenda said:
I think without that link-up with a McCleary/Horgan, they are losing possession more often/easily (might have to have a dig into this).
So there's actually not much of a change - Obita is actually losing possession slightly less, but McCarthy slight more. I can't break it down by area, but they might well be losing it more high up the pitch. I think @drcongo is onto the bigger issue - we overcommitted with them v Pompey, although we were chasing the game.
Presuming Scowen, Gape and GMac are injured how do you see us setting up tomorrow @ReturnToSenda?
I’m guessing Wheeler for Scowen but do you think The front 3 will be? As well as Hanlan has done recently I would like to see Vokes and Horgan with Mehmeti replacing GMAc
@Mandown If all those are out then I'd assume Wheeler comes in, yeah, but I'd like to see Horgan behind Vokes and Hanlan - Hanlan has looked very receptive to Vokes' flick-ons and we were at our best late last season with more of a front two.
Comments
As is @eric_plant comparing me not being bothered about learning exactly when G Mac will be fit with fixing cars, but here we are…
On that point, if I couldn’t get an idea about when my car was going to be fixed I wouldn’t know what action I should take to get back on the road. With an injured player, I have no control over their recovery or the ability to do anything about replacing them. The only people who need to consider that are Rob & Pete Couhig plus Gareth and Richard Dobson. So as long as they’ve got an idea, that’s fine with me.
@our_frank no I wasn’t, but that’s mainly because I hadn’t seen that snippet of news. I’d definitely have been disappointed though!
One thing I am sure we can all agree on is that the second G Mac is fit, he’ll be in the starting XI. And we’ll all be cheering.
As a thought exercise, @eric_plant, imagine you've been told GMac will be out for the rest of the season.
That way you'll turn up one day to find he's been been named in the team and be absolutely over the moon. Or would that, in fact, also piss you off as you'd not been told he would actually be returning that day?
We're all happy to hear he's doing well, of course we are
But knowing this does not change the way we behave, nor does it make any difference to the recovery itself
Which seem to be the arguments against wanting to have an update in McCleary's fitness
And you're not in the slightest bit curious as to whether that is likely to be in the next few weeks, or months, or next season?
Fair enough
I heard that was just a decoy Garath McCleary we saw leaving the pitch and that the real one's injury is far more serious
Que serà serà Eric.
You've got the accents the wrong way round there
Well spotted and getting in before an ear bashing from @micra.
In a way, pointing that out was entirely contradictory to the meaning of the phrase
As far as I undetstand it. Gareth was injured, is working his way back to fitness and will be back at some point.
I would quite like to have injury updates on players as I am naturally curious as to how the players are doing.
I would also quite like to know, for example, how much time McCarthy and Obita spend on crossing practice during the week.
If the club decide to provide me with answers to those questions I would happily take that information on board.
If the club choose not to provide me with those answers, whilst being less happy I am not that displeased to resort to throwing a tantrum.
But that is maybe because I am a mature, reasonable, adult.*
*Well 1 out of 3…
Crossword practice?
No chance @mooneyman. I know how to say it because I heard Doris Day singing it many years ago. I don’t even know if it’s Spanish or Italian, never mind what accents are appropriate.
When was the last time I gave an ear bashing ? I lack the energy now even for gentle quips. I did bridle recently however, on behalf of our Forest fans, when you referred to Notts Forest !?
I'm with Eric on this one. For me it just makes a difference to how I'm feeling and see the game. My positivity when I sit down or when I see the team sheet. A huge grin or a sigh?
Given our obvious struggles currently, and no option to bring loans in, then this patch could quite easily extend until 1st January until we can get another loanee in.
That's a long time.
So if there is any chance we might see him for the Xmas period, it would provide some hope to me and probably change my attitude towards the matches between now and then.
If his return is then delayed due to a set back, as long as they were honest and let us know why, I wouldn't be frothing at the mouth.
I have no stats to back this up but I feel we are in the minority of sports teams who do not inform fans how long players are out for and when the expected return is. Cricket, rugby, football and others all seem to do it more often than they don't. So this for me is why it's even more frustrating.
We'll win by more than one goal on Saturday btw
I think you said we’d win the last league game during half time! Although I don’t necessarily disagree :-)
I think I actually said we'll win the league outright at one point ?
Whatever is said about when someone will recover from illness of an injury it is unlikely to be absolutely accurate so best say nothing?
@ReturnToSenda Do you know what, after 20 minutes against Ipswich when we were absolutely blitzing them and playing them off the park a thought popped into my head from nowhere ‘we’re actually going to win the league aren’t we!’ I’m not the type for that kind of optimism so no idea where it came from. Since almost that exact point we’ve been absolutely all over the place and resorted back to aimless long ball most of the time and really struggled, very strange!
I think with our style of play when things are not going well it can be pretty dire, but regardless of whether this run comes to an end on Saturday, as long as McCleary isn’t out for the season, I’m still pretty confident we’ll be challenging for the play offs.
Idk if this is too simplistic, but for me, we're overcompensating for GMac's absence by committing too many men forward. And we're actually creating the best quality chances we have all season - the data shows that - but that's leaving us horribly exposed on the counter, as we've seen and as Gaz has acknowledged. The approach v Hartlepool was because they concede a lot of goals from balls pumped into the box, but evidently it didn't work on this occasion. With Horgan in the McCleary role on Saturday, I'll be quite confident.
We certainly do seem far more at risk of a counterattack these last few games.
If you're playing wingbacks you have to know how to deal with one of them losing possession high upfield and being out of the game as the opposition attacks. We haven't looked as though we can deal with that recently.
Like you say, it could be that the wingbacks (McCarthy in particular?) are getting a lot further forward when we have the ball
I think against Ipswich the problem was obvious - loss of midfield structure with Thompson not playing, exacerbated by Gape being deployed in the old Bloomfield role - but I found it harder to pinpoint v Pompey (wasn't at Hartlepool so have only seen brief highlights). Having someone like Horgan who we can 'hand off' to in order to slow things down just a touch and allow our WBs that bit of time to recover position could make a big difference.
I think without that link-up with a McCleary/Horgan, they are losing possession more often/easily (might have to have a dig into this).
Totally agree with this, and I mentioned somewhere else that I'm absolutely sure that last season when we started with wingbacks, we very rarely had both of them forward at the same time. Whenever one bombed forward, the other would remain back which usually effectively gave us a back four most of the time. We've definitely stopped doing this though, and at times we've got at least one of the centre backs playing in the opposition half with them leaving us horribly open.
The effect this has on the other end of the pitch is often that we've got so many men forward that they're getting in each other's way, taking the ball / shot when there's someone in a much better position just behind etc.
I think you got a little carried away when we went 3-1 up against whoever that northern lot are a few weeks away, then drew 3-3.
Has been poor since then.
Fleetwood - one of only three games I've not been at / watched since the start of last season, so on reflection it wasn't the best-advised shout...
So there's actually not much of a change - Obita is actually losing possession slightly less, but McCarthy slight more. I can't break it down by area, but they might well be losing it more high up the pitch. I think @drcongo is onto the bigger issue - we overcommitted with them v Pompey, although we were chasing the game.
Presuming Scowen, Gape and GMac are injured how do you see us setting up tomorrow @ReturnToSenda?
I’m guessing Wheeler for Scowen but do you think The front 3 will be? As well as Hanlan has done recently I would like to see Vokes and Horgan with Mehmeti replacing GMAc
@Mandown If all those are out then I'd assume Wheeler comes in, yeah, but I'd like to see Horgan behind Vokes and Hanlan - Hanlan has looked very receptive to Vokes' flick-ons and we were at our best late last season with more of a front two.
For all Mehmeti offers, he doesn't have the poise of Horgan. Directness is good, but we're really missing GMac's ability to set the tempo.