What has Scott Kashket done wrong not to get a look in? On a difficult pitch his lower centre of gravity would surely have been an asset? I haven’t understood the team selection for weeks. I haven’t understood the tactics either - probably because nobody else does.
We needed a win but the first save their keeper had to make was in the 84th minute. Watching this appalling stuff is utterly painful.
We needed to win and we set out to restrict the opponents. Tactics are baffling. We don’t look like scoring. The last 8 games are going to be a painful watch if we continue to perform like that.
As someone who has been watching the team since non league days I hoped you might be more understanding of the step up in standard the Championship has presented. It makes no difference what players you use or what tactics you employ if the opposition are superior, and for the avoidance of doubt I am not referring to today’s game. Coventry were equally poor.
@davecz said:
We needed to win and we set out to restrict the opponents. Tactics are baffling. We don’t look like scoring. The last 8 games are going to be a painful watch if we continue to perform like that.
There’s a difference between playing poorly and playing defensively. We had four attacking players in the starting 11 (Ickpeazu, Muskwe, Wheeler and Mehmeti) and brought on Akinfenwa, Onyedinma, Horgan and McCleary. That hardly suggests defensive tactics. We just
didn’t play well enough to win.
It was certainly a game lacking in quality all round. I've watched football long enough but am still baffled how players drag each other down when mistakes start to creep in. Both teams made early errors with passes going astray and then before you know it 22 players looked like they had dropped down the football pyramid by about 3 levels.
Neither team wanted to lose. We look shot on confidence. Our shining light that sometimes lifts that confidence couldn't get on the ball and when he did start to come into the game he was subbed.
One to forget
This has been such a depressing season,particularly when we have the best set of players we have had in years. They have not been utilised properly and the tactics have been terrible to the extent I fear some may leave at end of the season. The emphasis appears to have been damage limitation from the word go and this is entirely down to management.GA has run out of ideas,has no plan B and should leave before the new campaign.i fully appreciate what he as achieved,but it is time for change
I regard @Malone as a good Gasroom mate who calls a spade a spade, talks common sense and has a (grass roots?) playing background himself. Respect.
Having said that.......and for that reason, I restrained myself yesterday from commenting on the reference to Matt Cecil, a great young “servant” to the club, as “Cecil”. His dad, Alan, is a Trust Board member, at least one brother (Adam) is a supporter and, for all I know, the Cecil dynasty may extend well beyond! I also think Matt is excellent on commentary and it’s only human for such a dedicated Wanderer to betray (ever so slightly!) the disappointment/frustration which we have all been experiencing lately. A word at this point about Matt’s co-commentator, Alicia Povey. Excellent. I could listen to her all day.
But it’s have a go at Malone day today (an extremely rare event) and, albeit slightly tongue in cheek, I’d like to say that, for me, there’s nothing wrong with that particular Madness song (Our House) - certainly not “dreadful” - and for anyone still taken with the idea of referring to Adams Park as our house, our impenetrable fortress, that’s what they need to belt out but I strongly advise them to wait until we’ve started winning there on a regular basis before clearing their throats.
@Hughie said:
This has been such a depressing season,particularly when we have the best set of players we have had in years. They have not been utilised properly and the tactics have been terrible to the extent I fear some may leave at end of the season. The emphasis appears to have been damage limitation from the word go and this is entirely down to management.GA has run out of ideas,has no plan B and should leave before the new campaign.i fully appreciate what he as achieved,but it is time for change
We have the best set of players we have probably ever had for sure. And we are playing in one of the most competitive leagues in Europe. So a sense of perspective. Much as GA might look like he has no plan B, C etc he is limited by the depth of quality available to him compared to other teams. Our bench is still largely rejects and bargain basement signings. It is what it is. I wouldn’t swap it.
I agree with you Andy. Tactics, formations, style of play..it’s all irrelevant if the opposition has better players and I’m afraid that has been the case in the majority of games this season. Ainsworth is the perfect fit for a club punching above its weight and I would like to know who his detractors think would have done a better job this season.
@Chris said:
We got the third most points from games played, the same metric used to decide league placings every season. We were in the play-odds on merit, and we were promoted on merit.
Well, technically we didn't get the third most points, we were awarded third on a calculation of points per game, which I wonder if this has ever been used before.
However, you're spot on with your next lines
Every season is decided by points per game isn't it?
@Hughie said:
This has been such a depressing season,particularly when we have the best set of players we have had in years. They have not been utilised properly and the tactics have been terrible to the extent I fear some may leave at end of the season. The emphasis appears to have been damage limitation from the word go and this is entirely down to management.GA has run out of ideas,has no plan B and should leave before the new campaign.i fully appreciate what he as achieved,but it is time for change
There is not one reason this has been ‘such a depressing season’ and that is that we’ve not been able to go and cheer on the team in person and create a positive atmosphere to help overcome a lack of confidence they may have.
I think the rest of your post is self absorbed nonsense. We should celebrate where we are. It’s been tough but most of our problems are due to a huge step up in opposition and rest are due to the pandemic and the short close season.
Can I just confirm one thing @Hughie please. Are you calling for Ainsworth to go in your last sentence?
@glasshalffull I genuinely think (like Rob Couhig) we have the players to stay up. Otherwise, we might as well do a Dover Athletic, say we’re not playing any more games & furlogh all our players.
Against Preston we were excellent because we had to play the ball on the floor due to the gale-force wind but attacking-wise (apart from set pieces) we only have David Wheeler who’s a decent header of the ball. Uche is more of a player to make bursting runs and shots (reminds me a bit of Cyrille Regis).
You said we are coming up against much better players in the Championship & that’s true to an extent but I think the key is we’re coming up against much smarter managers & coaches. You have to have a Plan B & Plan C or else you get shut down pretty quickly & the opposition can dictate the game.
I reiterate a point I’ve made repeatedly on here. Are Luton Town vastly more resourced than WW? Do they have a much better pool of players than WW? I would argue not. But what they have done (& learned very quickly) is to adapt their style of play to suit this league. And they are above in the table the likes of Derby, Forest, Wednesday, QPR, Preston, Huddersfield & Bristol City. By your argument this shouldn’t be at all possible. The fact they are means it should be possible for WW to remain in the Championship with a smaller budget & “inferior” players. That’s why I find it hard to accept where we are is purely down to coming up against better players & bigger budgets every week.
I'm all for team spirit @A_Worboys and perhaps our tactics have been naive or lacking but I fear whatever tactics employed by managers having better players IS quite a major issue
Your remark about Dover is plainly ridiculous so I won’t bother to answer that. I will, however, address the Luton points.
You are completely wide of the mark. Nick Owen, till recently chairman of the club, is a former colleague and personal friend of mine and without giving away any confidential information, I can assure you that they are in a different world financially. For instance, they spent £1.3m to sign a goalkeeper only 18 months ago. They have spent vastly more than Wycombe on assembling their squad and paying their wages.
You say they have ‘learned very quickly’ yet they were bottom of the table at this stage last season and were still bottom going into the final day. The lessons they learned from their first season back at Championship level have been used to good effect in the second season. Who’s to say that Wycombe couldn’t adapt in a similar way?
You are clearly not a fan of our manager or his style of play, yet Barnsley, who like Luton only just survived being relegated last season, use a very similar style and that has got them into the top six.
You are entitled to your opinion, but you shouldn’t confuse that with the facts.
@A_Worboys said: @glasshalffull I genuinely think (like Rob Couhig) we have the players to stay up. Otherwise, we might as well do a Dover Athletic, say we’re not playing any more games & furlogh all our players.
Against Preston we were excellent because we had to play the ball on the floor due to the gale-force wind but attacking-wise (apart from set pieces) we only have David Wheeler who’s a decent header of the ball. Uche is more of a player to make bursting runs and shots (reminds me a bit of Cyrille Regis).
You said we are coming up against much better players in the Championship & that’s true to an extent but I think the key is we’re coming up against much smarter managers & coaches. You have to have a Plan B & Plan C or else you get shut down pretty quickly & the opposition can dictate the game.
I reiterate a point I’ve made repeatedly on here. Are Luton Town vastly more resourced than WW? Do they have a much better pool of players than WW? I would argue not. But what they have done (& learned very quickly) is to adapt their style of play to suit this league. And they are above in the table the likes of Derby, Forest, Wednesday, QPR, Preston, Huddersfield & Bristol City. By your argument this shouldn’t be at all possible. The fact they are means it should be possible for WW to remain in the Championship with a smaller budget & “inferior” players. That’s why I find it hard to accept where we are is purely down to coming up against better players & bigger budgets every week.
I'd say Luton are vastly more resourced than Wycombe I'm afraid.
I would say that Wycombe have players, new and retained, whose distribution and technique has been below what's required at Championship or the top of League One at times, which has been disappointing.
I absolutely buy that we don't have the resources of other Championship teams. However have we made a mistake in having 34 players signed up , including 6 B team players. Should we have focused on a pool of 25( including 1 or 2 youngsters) and attracted better players within the same overall budget, giving us a better chance of staying in the Championship and the rewards it gives.
@davecz said:
I absolutely buy that we don't have the resources of other Championship teams. However have we made a mistake in having 34 players signed up , including 6 B team players. Should we have focused on a pool of 25( including 1 or 2 youngsters) and attracted better players within the same overall budget, giving us a better chance of staying in the Championship and the rewards it gives.
I suppose that depends entirely on whether you see this season in complete isolation or you are working to a longer term plan. I suppose it also depends on what players we missed out on by not going to the next pay bracket but that also links back to your short versus long term. Would taking a punt on Charlie Austin, Glenn Murray or Jordan Rhodes have made the difference or would it have broken the team dynamic and been a bust. We’ll never know for certain which is why I still think this season will be judged by each person based on whether they think short or long term.
@peterparrotface I completely agree. I've no idea whether Luton can afford the squad they've got or whether they are just in another of those "between administrations" phases, but I dare say that staying up last year gave them the capability to enhance the squad a bit more. Certainly, I think their squad is a good bit better than ours.
Luton and Barnsley are great examples of what one successful season in the Championship can do for you. Hopefully we can service at this level in 22/23 and start seeing the benefits in 23/24.
I guess some of all this comes down to expectations. Did I expect to be in this league? No. Did I (honestly) expect to stay here when we got here? No, of course I had dreams. So what are my expectations now? Go down with cash in the bank and a manager who has learned a massive amount about football at this level. So next season my expectations are different. Freshen the squad, consolidate the financial position of the club and make a good fist of promotion.
What I didn’t want to do is to sign a load of ageing players on big money, lose the identity of the squad, probably still go down, have a footballing and financial Armageddon.
So I’m happier than most as my expectations for this season were to enjoy the ride and let’s see what next season brings.
Comments
Yes, I could have worded it more clearly. Per games played.
What has Scott Kashket done wrong not to get a look in? On a difficult pitch his lower centre of gravity would surely have been an asset? I haven’t understood the team selection for weeks. I haven’t understood the tactics either - probably because nobody else does.
We needed a win but the first save their keeper had to make was in the 84th minute. Watching this appalling stuff is utterly painful.
We needed to win and we set out to restrict the opponents. Tactics are baffling. We don’t look like scoring. The last 8 games are going to be a painful watch if we continue to perform like that.
Simple sol> @A_Worboys said:
Where is Obita?
Injured ankle.
There’s a difference between playing poorly and playing defensively. We had four attacking players in the starting 11 (Ickpeazu, Muskwe, Wheeler and Mehmeti) and brought on Akinfenwa, Onyedinma, Horgan and McCleary. That hardly suggests defensive tactics. We just
didn’t play well enough to win.
It was certainly a game lacking in quality all round. I've watched football long enough but am still baffled how players drag each other down when mistakes start to creep in. Both teams made early errors with passes going astray and then before you know it 22 players looked like they had dropped down the football pyramid by about 3 levels.
Neither team wanted to lose. We look shot on confidence. Our shining light that sometimes lifts that confidence couldn't get on the ball and when he did start to come into the game he was subbed.
One to forget
This has been such a depressing season,particularly when we have the best set of players we have had in years. They have not been utilised properly and the tactics have been terrible to the extent I fear some may leave at end of the season. The emphasis appears to have been damage limitation from the word go and this is entirely down to management.GA has run out of ideas,has no plan B and should leave before the new campaign.i fully appreciate what he as achieved,but it is time for change
I regard @Malone as a good Gasroom mate who calls a spade a spade, talks common sense and has a (grass roots?) playing background himself. Respect.
Having said that.......and for that reason, I restrained myself yesterday from commenting on the reference to Matt Cecil, a great young “servant” to the club, as “Cecil”. His dad, Alan, is a Trust Board member, at least one brother (Adam) is a supporter and, for all I know, the Cecil dynasty may extend well beyond! I also think Matt is excellent on commentary and it’s only human for such a dedicated Wanderer to betray (ever so slightly!) the disappointment/frustration which we have all been experiencing lately. A word at this point about Matt’s co-commentator, Alicia Povey. Excellent. I could listen to her all day.
But it’s have a go at Malone day today (an extremely rare event) and, albeit slightly tongue in cheek, I’d like to say that, for me, there’s nothing wrong with that particular Madness song (Our House) - certainly not “dreadful” - and for anyone still taken with the idea of referring to Adams Park as our house, our impenetrable fortress, that’s what they need to belt out but I strongly advise them to wait until we’ve started winning there on a regular basis before clearing their throats.
Pretty sure if Matt Cecil got paid for all the hours he puts in he could buy the club.
We have the best set of players we have probably ever had for sure. And we are playing in one of the most competitive leagues in Europe. So a sense of perspective. Much as GA might look like he has no plan B, C etc he is limited by the depth of quality available to him compared to other teams. Our bench is still largely rejects and bargain basement signings. It is what it is. I wouldn’t swap it.
I agree with you Andy. Tactics, formations, style of play..it’s all irrelevant if the opposition has better players and I’m afraid that has been the case in the majority of games this season. Ainsworth is the perfect fit for a club punching above its weight and I would like to know who his detractors think would have done a better job this season.
Every season is decided by points per game isn't it?
There is not one reason this has been ‘such a depressing season’ and that is that we’ve not been able to go and cheer on the team in person and create a positive atmosphere to help overcome a lack of confidence they may have.
I think the rest of your post is self absorbed nonsense. We should celebrate where we are. It’s been tough but most of our problems are due to a huge step up in opposition and rest are due to the pandemic and the short close season.
Can I just confirm one thing @Hughie please. Are you calling for Ainsworth to go in your last sentence?
@glasshalffull I genuinely think (like Rob Couhig) we have the players to stay up. Otherwise, we might as well do a Dover Athletic, say we’re not playing any more games & furlogh all our players.
Against Preston we were excellent because we had to play the ball on the floor due to the gale-force wind but attacking-wise (apart from set pieces) we only have David Wheeler who’s a decent header of the ball. Uche is more of a player to make bursting runs and shots (reminds me a bit of Cyrille Regis).
You said we are coming up against much better players in the Championship & that’s true to an extent but I think the key is we’re coming up against much smarter managers & coaches. You have to have a Plan B & Plan C or else you get shut down pretty quickly & the opposition can dictate the game.
I reiterate a point I’ve made repeatedly on here. Are Luton Town vastly more resourced than WW? Do they have a much better pool of players than WW? I would argue not. But what they have done (& learned very quickly) is to adapt their style of play to suit this league. And they are above in the table the likes of Derby, Forest, Wednesday, QPR, Preston, Huddersfield & Bristol City. By your argument this shouldn’t be at all possible. The fact they are means it should be possible for WW to remain in the Championship with a smaller budget & “inferior” players. That’s why I find it hard to accept where we are is purely down to coming up against better players & bigger budgets every week.
I'm all for team spirit @A_Worboys and perhaps our tactics have been naive or lacking but I fear whatever tactics employed by managers having better players IS quite a major issue
Your remark about Dover is plainly ridiculous so I won’t bother to answer that. I will, however, address the Luton points.
You are completely wide of the mark. Nick Owen, till recently chairman of the club, is a former colleague and personal friend of mine and without giving away any confidential information, I can assure you that they are in a different world financially. For instance, they spent £1.3m to sign a goalkeeper only 18 months ago. They have spent vastly more than Wycombe on assembling their squad and paying their wages.
You say they have ‘learned very quickly’ yet they were bottom of the table at this stage last season and were still bottom going into the final day. The lessons they learned from their first season back at Championship level have been used to good effect in the second season. Who’s to say that Wycombe couldn’t adapt in a similar way?
You are clearly not a fan of our manager or his style of play, yet Barnsley, who like Luton only just survived being relegated last season, use a very similar style and that has got them into the top six.
You are entitled to your opinion, but you shouldn’t confuse that with the facts.
Good to see the tradition of people getting thumbed down for making perfectly reasonable observations
I'd say Luton are vastly more resourced than Wycombe I'm afraid.
I would say that Wycombe have players, new and retained, whose distribution and technique has been below what's required at Championship or the top of League One at times, which has been disappointing.
I absolutely buy that we don't have the resources of other Championship teams. However have we made a mistake in having 34 players signed up , including 6 B team players. Should we have focused on a pool of 25( including 1 or 2 youngsters) and attracted better players within the same overall budget, giving us a better chance of staying in the Championship and the rewards it gives.
I suppose that depends entirely on whether you see this season in complete isolation or you are working to a longer term plan. I suppose it also depends on what players we missed out on by not going to the next pay bracket but that also links back to your short versus long term. Would taking a punt on Charlie Austin, Glenn Murray or Jordan Rhodes have made the difference or would it have broken the team dynamic and been a bust. We’ll never know for certain which is why I still think this season will be judged by each person based on whether they think short or long term.
@davecz I doubt the wages we pay the six B teamers would cover the petrol budget for one decent Championship level addition to the squad.
I love that this got a richly deserved -6 ?
@peterparrotface I completely agree. I've no idea whether Luton can afford the squad they've got or whether they are just in another of those "between administrations" phases, but I dare say that staying up last year gave them the capability to enhance the squad a bit more. Certainly, I think their squad is a good bit better than ours.
They've made a bit of cash from player sales though haven't they?
How much did Leicester pay for James Justin? Millions, surely?
That was a bit lazy of me so I looked it up. It was our old friend "undisclosed fee" but one report suggests it could rise to £8M
Luton and Barnsley are great examples of what one successful season in the Championship can do for you. Hopefully we can service at this level in 22/23 and start seeing the benefits in 23/24.
I guess some of all this comes down to expectations. Did I expect to be in this league? No. Did I (honestly) expect to stay here when we got here? No, of course I had dreams. So what are my expectations now? Go down with cash in the bank and a manager who has learned a massive amount about football at this level. So next season my expectations are different. Freshen the squad, consolidate the financial position of the club and make a good fist of promotion.
What I didn’t want to do is to sign a load of ageing players on big money, lose the identity of the squad, probably still go down, have a footballing and financial Armageddon.
So I’m happier than most as my expectations for this season were to enjoy the ride and let’s see what next season brings.
It's still going ! Which is what I correctly expected lol