@Vincey said:
Thought it was a penalty to be honest, clumsy from Fred. I’d want that given if it was against my team.
He kicked the ball before their man though. I'm astounded it was given.
It’s clumsy at best from Fred, you just leather it out. You take your time when the box is crowded and you’re asking for trouble. Boot it out straight away and it never gets that far, seen them given time and time again.
We started well playing 4-4-2 for first 20, then for some reason we changed to 4-3-2-1 and we were so narrow.
This totally exposed our full backs who regularly had two men to defend at the back post.
If we’d gone 4-5-1 or back to 4-4-2 there is no way they would have scored 7.
The management team seem insistent on attacking at all costs and not providing enough cover for our defence. I wish we would be a little more circumspect and protect the back four more.
Time after time we pressed high with Muskwe, Fred and Uche within 10’yards of each other, one quick ball past them and we were so open. To then continue to do this for almost 70 minutes was ridiculous.
February fixtures, barring any more postponements: Birmingham (H), Nottingham Forest (H), Sheffield Wednesday (A), Huddersfield (A), Derby (H), Millwall (A), Reading (H), Norwich (H)
24 points up for grabs. To get ourselves back in the mix I'd say we need a minimum of 15, starting with (no matter how much the Gasroom hates the phrase) a must-win game on Tuesday v Birmingham.
Most worrying thing is the collapse that’s happened today and against spurs. As soon as the game seemed beyond us we’ve capitulated. Certainly not something we’ve been used to under Gareth. Maybe the Covid break has meant we are not match fit yet but it needs to improve. We must stay in games even if we are behind and hope to nick a point.
That one game won't relegate us, though we have to put it behind us and get a result on Tuesday. Hopefully we will be able get Stewart and Obita in to shore up the backline, and get a ref in who hasn't put his mortgage on the opposition winning like the shambling dullard in black today clearly did.
We need to start getting some positive results. Probably too many needed to stay up but we need to show we can compete at the top of league one when we go down to convince the likes of Uche and Horgan to stay with us.
@Brownie said:
February fixtures, barring any more postponements: Birmingham (H), Nottingham Forest (H), Sheffield Wednesday (A), Huddersfield (A), Derby (H), Millwall (A), Reading (H), Norwich (H)
24 points up for grabs. To get ourselves back in the mix I'd say we need a minimum of 15, starting with (no matter how much the Gasroom hates the phrase) a must-win game on Tuesday v Birmingham.
So my reading is we'll know quite quickly if there's any chance we'll stay up.
Sadly today exposed the lack of real depth in the squad given the injuries and Covid lay off, we were particularly woeful in defence where other than Knight we looked leaden footed and short of pace, both Curtis & Dennis looked lacking in full fitness which further exposed our defensive weaknesses.
The positives were despite letting in 7 goals Rocky actually had a decent game and going forward Uche, Fred & Admiral were a real handful.
Charles probably shouldn't start any more games in this division. He may well have a decent part to play if we go down though.
But McCarthy shouldn't and I'm sure won't get near left back again. Should be right back only. But again, we know he's a star player in that position next season too.
Feels negative to look at next season in a lower tier already, just over 1 game into the second half of the season. But 7-2 takes a bit of recovering from.
@Vincey said:
Thought it was a penalty to be honest, clumsy from Fred. I’d want that given if it was against my team.
He kicked the ball before their man though. I'm astounded it was given.
It’s clumsy at best from Fred, you just leather it out. You take your time when the box is crowded and you’re asking for trouble. Boot it out straight away and it never gets that far, seen them given time and time again.
I know we’re all disappointed but you don’t need to wind up the rest of us
@Brownie said:
February fixtures, barring any more postponements: Birmingham (H), Nottingham Forest (H), Sheffield Wednesday (A), Huddersfield (A), Derby (H), Millwall (A), Reading (H), Norwich (H)
24 points up for grabs. To get ourselves back in the mix I'd say we need a minimum of 15, starting with (no matter how much the Gasroom hates the phrase) a must-win game on Tuesday v Birmingham.
So my reading is we'll know quite quickly if there's any chance we'll stay up.
I suspect we will have a very clear view by 1st March as to whether we're still in it at all.
@Vincey said:
Thought it was a penalty to be honest, clumsy from Fred. I’d want that given if it was against my team.
He kicked the ball before their man though. I'm astounded it was given.
It’s clumsy at best from Fred, you just leather it out. You take your time when the box is crowded and you’re asking for trouble. Boot it out straight away and it never gets that far, seen them given time and time again.
I know we’re all disappointed but you don’t need to wind up the rest of us
Sorry I forgot people aren’t allowed to have an alternative opinion nowadays.
@leo030500 said:
Most worrying thing is the collapse that’s happened today and against spurs. As soon as the game seemed beyond us we’ve capitulated. Certainly not something we’ve been used to under Gareth. Maybe the Covid break has meant we are not match fit yet but it needs to improve. We must stay in games even if we are behind and hope to nick a point.
Maybe it's physical and mental fitness that is the problem after that enforced stop to training and having no matches for far too long. We absolutely cannot afford a repeat against teams we're up against in the relegation dogfight.
@HCblue said:
No guarantee we're good enough to yo-yo. Must be mindful of the possibility of being Yeovil at the other end of the range of possibilities.
I have to admit, my worry would be more a slipping out of league 1, then a guarantee we'd come straight back up.
We've seen it before, and we've only had 1 season in league 1 in about 15 years where we've been a top end team.
I'm still reasonably confident we can make a decent fist of our remaining games and get to 45 points plus which I suspect might just be enough.
I certainly don't relish Gareth & Dobbo's job of lifting the squad after that but I am equally sure that they will and we will come out on Tuesday all guns blazing
@OX66 said:
To top it all the hearts fan were wound up by a wycombe tweet and of course they are giving it large now.
Yep, we laugh at our media team's cheek sometimes, like the "Our house" Sunderland one.
But when you get smashed people remember, like when Sunderland whopped us 4-0
My lack of hope is not down to a belief in the endeavor and skill of this team. It's for the same reason I believed we were going to go up last season. Last season, we just seemed to come through in every vital moment throughout the season (and did not even need dodgy refereeing decisions). It just seemed like nothing could turn back the tide, and once we got the playoff final, I just could not see us losing it.
This season, EVERYthing has gone against us, from abysmal ref decisions, to missing sitters, to a catalogue of vital injuries. It just feels like the reverse of last season. If you replay this season 100 times, this is the worst points total we would have, I am convinced. So we just seem to have stumbled into the worst possible version of this season. So it is not a lack of belief in our players, but a lack of belief that we are suddenly going to start getting the rub of the green.
@Vincey said:
Thought it was a penalty to be honest, clumsy from Fred. I’d want that given if it was against my team.
How? What? I suppose everyone can have a few but I wasn't expecting anyone defending that utterly ludicrous decision. This is how we got Brexit and Boris Johnson
@Shev said:
My lack of hope is not down to a belief in the endeavor and skill of this team. It's for the same reason I believed we were going to go up last season. Last season, we just seemed to come through in every vital moment throughout the season (and did not even need dodgy refereeing decisions). It just seemed like nothing could turn back the tide, and once we got the playoff final, I just could not see us losing it.
This season, EVERYthing has gone against us, from abysmal ref decisions, to missing sitters, to a catalogue of vital injuries. It just feels like the reverse of last season. If you replay this season 100 times, this is the worst points total we would have, I am convinced. So we just seem to have stumbled into the worst possible version of this season. So it is not a lack of belief in our players, but a lack of belief that we are suddenly going to start getting the rub of the green.
The big problem, that someone else touched on, is that we needed EVERYthing to go for us to have a chance this year.
Like you say, it's all gone against us. So it's not that big a surprise we're not only in the relegation zone, but as far off safety as any team has ever been at this stage.
@Vincey said:
Thought it was a penalty to be honest, clumsy from Fred. I’d want that given if it was against my team.
How? What? I suppose everyone can have a few but I wasn't expecting anyone defending that utterly ludicrous decision. This is how we got Brexit and Boris Johnson
Everyone’s entitled to their opinion, I wouldn’t say it was a ‘stonewaller’ but it was clumsy and you’ve certainly seen them given before. I would be appealing if it was the other way around as I suspect many others would.
Let’s not let that incident detract from what was an utterly appalling defensive performance.
@TheAndyGrahamFanClub said:
I was just typing that I think McCarthy’s performance will be remembered as one of the all time worst. In years to come people will say ‘yeah I know xxxx had a bad game but it wasn’t as bad as McCarthy v Brentford in 2021’. Defensively inept. Set pieces embarrassing.
Everything has to be the worst ever these days. He didn't do very well today out of position against a top drawer wide player and getting no cover from a static left sided centre back.
His set pieces were awful.
@Shev - not sure it’s just the rub of the green that is the reason why we are bottom. Unfortunately we don’t have enough Championship quality players. Nobody’s fault just a result of our financial constraints.
Some work to do defensively, but were missing players today who will be a substantial assistance with that work.
The 'penalty' does make a difference. The gasroom was absolutely lit up with anger over the decision. The players shouldn't feel it and react to it as we do because they are professionals, but I think it very difficult not to feel some considerable anger and frustration if you are on the pitch. I think it must be very hard to put that behind you.
Then two goals to chase and to our team's credit they used the anger and frustration to go for it.
After the fifth maybe you should defend and keep it to five, but I think there was an idea of either scoring three in a match or Bayo scoring in the Championship, which I think is fair enough.
I think there was lot to commend in how the team played today, I don't think there is single one of them can be faulted for effort or application. I just wish I could have been there to clap them off the field.
@Vincey said:
Thought it was a penalty to be honest, clumsy from Fred. I’d want that given if it was against my team.
How? What? I suppose everyone can have a few but I wasn't expecting anyone defending that utterly ludicrous decision. This is how we got Brexit and Boris Johnson
Everyone’s entitled to their opinion, I wouldn’t say it was a ‘stonewaller’ but it was clumsy and you’ve certainly seen them given before. I would be appealing if it was the other way around as I suspect many others would.
Let’s not let that incident detract from what was an utterly appalling defensive performance.
You have your opinion but please don't tell me I've seen them given because I quite frankly never ever have. Never ever in all my years. Even the ref in the Kes film would have been embarrassed by that.
Wouldn't want to stop you slagging off our make shift defence though. Crack on.
Comments
Even Brentford fans are saying it was never a penalty, so that shoots down your theory.
It’s clumsy at best from Fred, you just leather it out. You take your time when the box is crowded and you’re asking for trouble. Boot it out straight away and it never gets that far, seen them given time and time again.
We started well playing 4-4-2 for first 20, then for some reason we changed to 4-3-2-1 and we were so narrow.
This totally exposed our full backs who regularly had two men to defend at the back post.
If we’d gone 4-5-1 or back to 4-4-2 there is no way they would have scored 7.
The management team seem insistent on attacking at all costs and not providing enough cover for our defence. I wish we would be a little more circumspect and protect the back four more.
Time after time we pressed high with Muskwe, Fred and Uche within 10’yards of each other, one quick ball past them and we were so open. To then continue to do this for almost 70 minutes was ridiculous.
February fixtures, barring any more postponements: Birmingham (H), Nottingham Forest (H), Sheffield Wednesday (A), Huddersfield (A), Derby (H), Millwall (A), Reading (H), Norwich (H)
24 points up for grabs. To get ourselves back in the mix I'd say we need a minimum of 15, starting with (no matter how much the Gasroom hates the phrase) a must-win game on Tuesday v Birmingham.
Most worrying thing is the collapse that’s happened today and against spurs. As soon as the game seemed beyond us we’ve capitulated. Certainly not something we’ve been used to under Gareth. Maybe the Covid break has meant we are not match fit yet but it needs to improve. We must stay in games even if we are behind and hope to nick a point.
No guarantee we're good enough to yo-yo. Must be mindful of the possibility of being Yeovil at the other end of the range of possibilities.
That one game won't relegate us, though we have to put it behind us and get a result on Tuesday. Hopefully we will be able get Stewart and Obita in to shore up the backline, and get a ref in who hasn't put his mortgage on the opposition winning like the shambling dullard in black today clearly did.
We need to start getting some positive results. Probably too many needed to stay up but we need to show we can compete at the top of league one when we go down to convince the likes of Uche and Horgan to stay with us.
So my reading is we'll know quite quickly if there's any chance we'll stay up.
Sadly today exposed the lack of real depth in the squad given the injuries and Covid lay off, we were particularly woeful in defence where other than Knight we looked leaden footed and short of pace, both Curtis & Dennis looked lacking in full fitness which further exposed our defensive weaknesses.
The positives were despite letting in 7 goals Rocky actually had a decent game and going forward Uche, Fred & Admiral were a real handful.
Charles probably shouldn't start any more games in this division. He may well have a decent part to play if we go down though.
But McCarthy shouldn't and I'm sure won't get near left back again. Should be right back only. But again, we know he's a star player in that position next season too.
Feels negative to look at next season in a lower tier already, just over 1 game into the second half of the season. But 7-2 takes a bit of recovering from.
I know we’re all disappointed but you don’t need to wind up the rest of us
I suspect we will have a very clear view by 1st March as to whether we're still in it at all.
Sorry I forgot people aren’t allowed to have an alternative opinion nowadays.
I think we can beat Notts Forest, Huddersfield and Millwall and draws against Birmingham and Derby. That's only 11 points I'm afraid.
Maybe it's physical and mental fitness that is the problem after that enforced stop to training and having no matches for far too long. We absolutely cannot afford a repeat against teams we're up against in the relegation dogfight.
To top it all the hearts fan were wound up by a wycombe tweet and of course they are giving it large now.
Right now, no. But Give me 48 hours and the Hope will be back.
I have to admit, my worry would be more a slipping out of league 1, then a guarantee we'd come straight back up.
We've seen it before, and we've only had 1 season in league 1 in about 15 years where we've been a top end team.
I'm still reasonably confident we can make a decent fist of our remaining games and get to 45 points plus which I suspect might just be enough.
I certainly don't relish Gareth & Dobbo's job of lifting the squad after that but I am equally sure that they will and we will come out on Tuesday all guns blazing
Yep, we laugh at our media team's cheek sometimes, like the "Our house" Sunderland one.
But when you get smashed people remember, like when Sunderland whopped us 4-0
I'm still chuckling at someone the other day saying we need to stay within 12 points of safety in case teams get points deductions.
Talk about ultimate grade A straw clutching.
My lack of hope is not down to a belief in the endeavor and skill of this team. It's for the same reason I believed we were going to go up last season. Last season, we just seemed to come through in every vital moment throughout the season (and did not even need dodgy refereeing decisions). It just seemed like nothing could turn back the tide, and once we got the playoff final, I just could not see us losing it.
This season, EVERYthing has gone against us, from abysmal ref decisions, to missing sitters, to a catalogue of vital injuries. It just feels like the reverse of last season. If you replay this season 100 times, this is the worst points total we would have, I am convinced. So we just seem to have stumbled into the worst possible version of this season. So it is not a lack of belief in our players, but a lack of belief that we are suddenly going to start getting the rub of the green.
How? What? I suppose everyone can have a few but I wasn't expecting anyone defending that utterly ludicrous decision. This is how we got Brexit and Boris Johnson
The big problem, that someone else touched on, is that we needed EVERYthing to go for us to have a chance this year.
Like you say, it's all gone against us. So it's not that big a surprise we're not only in the relegation zone, but as far off safety as any team has ever been at this stage.
Everyone’s entitled to their opinion, I wouldn’t say it was a ‘stonewaller’ but it was clumsy and you’ve certainly seen them given before. I would be appealing if it was the other way around as I suspect many others would.
Let’s not let that incident detract from what was an utterly appalling defensive performance.
Everything has to be the worst ever these days. He didn't do very well today out of position against a top drawer wide player and getting no cover from a static left sided centre back.
His set pieces were awful.
@Shev - not sure it’s just the rub of the green that is the reason why we are bottom. Unfortunately we don’t have enough Championship quality players. Nobody’s fault just a result of our financial constraints.
Some work to do defensively, but were missing players today who will be a substantial assistance with that work.
The 'penalty' does make a difference. The gasroom was absolutely lit up with anger over the decision. The players shouldn't feel it and react to it as we do because they are professionals, but I think it very difficult not to feel some considerable anger and frustration if you are on the pitch. I think it must be very hard to put that behind you.
Then two goals to chase and to our team's credit they used the anger and frustration to go for it.
After the fifth maybe you should defend and keep it to five, but I think there was an idea of either scoring three in a match or Bayo scoring in the Championship, which I think is fair enough.
I think there was lot to commend in how the team played today, I don't think there is single one of them can be faulted for effort or application. I just wish I could have been there to clap them off the field.
You have your opinion but please don't tell me I've seen them given because I quite frankly never ever have. Never ever in all my years. Even the ref in the Kes film would have been embarrassed by that.
Wouldn't want to stop you slagging off our make shift defence though. Crack on.